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  1. #1
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    Fornost droprates way below all the others

    Many of us have played along the scaleables during the last weeks since U10. It's great to have them back with good loot and stuff. It's great to go online and be pretty sure to get something to do within little time. And if you're standing around you just start something on your own. In general I do love the endgame since U10 at least.

    But playing many instances over time many of us have noticed that chances for good drops differ from cluster to cluster.

    Let's compare some of them:

    - Great Barrow: I played Sambrog maybe 100 times (Challenge mode of course) since U10. I have seen about 5-6 golden drops, at least one teal drop per run calculated over all the runs (not each run with a teal tho, but sometimes up to 3 teals on one run). Takes about 7-10 Minutes, difficulty is very easy. I also got and saw teal items out of the other 2 GB-instances which I have played below 10 times each.
    - School/Library: I played those 3mans about 100 times (challenge mode) since U10. I have seen about 3-4 golden drops, about 70 teals. School takes about 7 minutes, library about 10-15 min. Difficulty is very easy.
    - Annuminas: I played Ost Elendil maybe 50 times (challenge mode as well) since U10. I have seen about 3-4 golden drops, at least one teal drop per run calculated over all the runs. Takes about 15-20 minutes - difficulty is pretty easy. I also seen and gotten teal items out of Glinghant with a comparable droprate which I have played about 10-20 times. I haven't seen or gotten any teal out of haudh valandil which I have only played twice since U10.
    - Dol Guldur: I played Dol-Guldur-Instances about 20 times since U10 (T2 challenge mode mostly - dungeons just T2 tho). I have seen about 20 teal drops and 0 golden drops. Takes between 40 min (SG) and 7 minutes (dungeons). Difficulty is pretty high.
    - Erebor: I played Erebor-Raids maybe 20 times (T1 mostly) since U10. I have seen about 10 teal drops, 1-2 golden drops.
    - Fornost: I played Fornost - Wraith of Water - maybe 30-40 times (T2 challenge mode) since U10. I have seen 0 teal drops and 0 golden drops. Takes about 20-30 minutes - difficulty is medium. I have neither gotten or seen any teal or gold-item out of Wraith of fire and Wraith of earth which I have played about 2-3 times each.

    So Fornost-droprates are - as most of us know - way below all the other instances. No idea as of why. There are teal items I've been told, but they're obviously extremely rare. I got two possible explanations:
    - It's a bug.
    - Turbine wants to make some (indeed very good - some of which are best in slot for certain classes) teal items very very special and added all of those to the Fornost-instances.
    Last edited by GithlithMonaghan; Apr 08 2013 at 10:03 AM.

  2. #2
    I myslef did Fornost water wing a lot times.. for me it seems there is no teal dropp just purple ones, like tha stone giants rug in the iorbars peak intance, the teal version was added later... lets hope they add teal versions very soon.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leri927 View Post
    I myslef did Fornost water wing a lot times.. for me it seems there is no teal dropp just purple ones, like tha stone giants rug in the iorbars peak intance, the teal version was added later... lets hope they add teal versions very soon.
    I've seen Teals drop from Water wing (and the other three wings as well). They're rarer, like the OP pointed out, but they're definitely in the game.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by TinDragon View Post
    I've seen Teals drop from Water wing (and the other three wings as well). They're rarer, like the OP pointed out, but they're definitely in the game.
    Since some of my companions were able to name the exact stats of some teal drops from Water-Wing I have to believe you're right.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by GithlithMonaghan View Post
    ...
    So Fornost-droprates are - as most of us know - way below all the other instances. No idea as of why. There are teal items I've been told, but they're obviously extremely rare.
    ...
    Allow me to introduce you to North Cotton Farms and Stoneheight

    Agreed though, there are a few spaces that seem off on drops and Fornost is one.
    Last edited by Gedachtnis; Apr 08 2013 at 12:53 PM.

  6. #6
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    It's just so hard to figure in MMO's what's a bug, a planned mechanic or what's just the odds.

    My lvl 83 Mini has never ever gotten a pristine hide for taxidermy trade. My lvl 49 LM has gotten 3 so far. My Mini is my main so the proportionately greater amount of time invested in slayer deeds for virtues is far greater than just the level difference as well. I believe it would take a far greater statistical sampling on either my kill trophies or the OP's instance drops to determine if a bug exists.

  7. #7
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    Allow me to add more anecdotal experience to the collective sample pool. Over the weekend, I went with friends to Fornost 10 times (4x water, 2x each earth/fire/shadow) all T2C. We saw 0 golds, 0 teals, 2 stat tomes (both agility iirc), one or two relic removal scrolls, a handful of purples (averaging less than one per run), and truckloads of relics/ixp.

    On the flipside, medallion droprates are pretty decent, for any who care about that.

  8. #8
    I ran the fornost instances(t2 cm) about 60-80 times in 2 days.. I saw about 2 or 3 teal items (not that I won one myself).. apart from that there were only relics and runes.
    BUT on the 2nd day the golden warden legs appeared on the last run I was going to do. Apart from that it was very underwhelming.

  9. #9
    We're told that gold items are supposed to be rare, it's likely the same for the good teals, so why do you think you should be seeing any drop in 40 runs? Or even 100 runs?

    People like to tell me that overall the numbers likely work out over a large group size, so your hefty drop rate that you've seen in Sambrog, Annuminas, School/Library, etc. probably balances the fact that I've seen 0 drop in my groups. I know they drop there, I've seen other people with the gear - just none ever drop in my groups.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Namesse View Post
    We're told that gold items are supposed to be rare, it's likely the same for the good teals, so why do you think you should be seeing any drop in 40 runs? Or even 100 runs?
    Because that's incredibly poor design bordering on insanity?

    Before remote looting was introduced, you could run a 6-man (i.e. Foundry) and be guaranteed a teal item every time. It wouldn't always be what you were after and even if it was, you had to roll for it (or use some other means of loot distribution), but at least *something* dropped.

    Unless Turbine decided that the amount of loot being offered in RoI instances was just way, way over the top (which I sincerely doubt), then surely the intent of the drop rates in RoR is that there should be *roughly* the same quantity of loot rewards available. That is, an average of one teal item per run. Sometimes you'll get unlucky and get none, sometimes you'll hit the jackpot and a bunch of people will get something. But if things are *averaging* a tiny fraction of the previous rewards, then either a) the drop rate is borked or b) this is intended drop rate.

    Considering that certain instances seem to be spot on (School/Lib/HoN/GB/Annuminas/LT/DG cluster) it does seem pretty glaring that the ITA 3-mans and Fornost are so clearly behind the curve. It's like those instances are dropping stuff equivalent to what non-raids were dropping right before the Durchest nerf (remember that the same patch that nerfed Durchest and BG in general also buffed teal drop rates in 3 and 6 mans considerably).

  11. #11
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    Stop logging me out, forums

    Anyhow, on topic. I have to agree with the OP. I have yet to see a teal out of my 30ish runs. One RK on my server is at about 80 Fornost water T2C runs. He hasn't seen a teal once.

    Compared to other instances that are *so* easy compared to Fornost, it's just a little ridiculous.

    Fornost, Lost Temple, and Sami-Surma T2 (especially C) should be dropping teals and golds *more* rather than less, IMO, but that's a bit of a different subject. In the end it does seem Fornost especially has strangely low drop-rates of any loot. Often we don't see purple gear, either.

    I hope this is looked into at some point of time.
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  12. #12
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    I picked up a Teal pair of pants on just 1 run of the Fire branch T1.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Gylve View Post
    Because that's incredibly poor design bordering on insanity?

    Before remote looting was introduced, you could run a 6-man (i.e. Foundry) and be guaranteed a teal item every time. It wouldn't always be what you were after and even if it was, you had to roll for it (or use some other means of loot distribution), but at least *something* dropped.
    Yes, I know that, I also happen to be one of the "wi-flagged" people who doesn't get anything except a pile of bounties and relics. I've been in way too many runs where a long string of bounties and relics is all that dropped, but sometimes punctuated by a teal that isn't worth using; I don't think the teal drops average out to 1 per run over the evening, I'd guess maybe 1 out of 3 runs on average for the groups I'm in.

    I was just parroting what I've seen other people say on these forums, that just because I don't ever get any good drops doesn't mean the pRNG doesn't function properly, that I have to run an order of magnitude more than what I have done already before I can even begin to judge the pRNG.

    My sarcasm and bitterness weren't meant to be directed to the OP, and I apologize if it seemed that way, but at those who insist that the good gear is supposed to be rare, the fact I don't see them drop at all in my groups is completely working as intended.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Namesse View Post
    My sarcasm and bitterness weren't meant to be directed to the OP, and I apologize if it seemed that way, but at those who insist that the good gear is supposed to be rare, the fact I don't see them drop at all in my groups is completely working as intended.
    I think the OP is pointing out that, comparing to *easier* instances, the Fornost cluster is off balance. Fornost, compared to the Annuminas cluster, the GB cluster, and the older three-mans, takes more coordination and usually better gear. There are some groups that can 'face-roll' it, but the majority of players across all servers likely cannot, while GB is easier to do with any level of 85ish gear.

    Since Fornost (and, as pointed out earlier, the In Your Absence) instances take comparatively more time and effort by most groups, a drop rate of teals and golds comparable to GB, if not slightly better than GB, would be expected I think.

    Good gear is supposed to be rare, but I think players also want amount of time spent in an instance to count for something. This is why I would love to see some sort of algorithm that puts in the normal loot drop rate for Item A added to difficulty of the encounter (which supposedly is already done, but I hope that Fornost Shadow t2c has a different 'difficulty' value than Sambrog hard mode since there is a clear contrast in difficulty) PLUS the amount of times that toon has run that instance cluster in a specific amount of time, capping at a certain set % and resetting at a designated point of time. This allows both time/effort and luck to be accounted for. No idea if it's possible though.
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  15. #15
    This thread would be better placed in the Instances/Raids section, but anyway:

    Same experience in my kin--not sure we've seen a single teal drop in Fornost, if so it's been one or two max. However, I've seen two gold drops, including one that I got.

    Sure, one person or a few people could be unlucky (case in point: I've never gotten a teal from Warg Pens or OE, and only one from IP), but six people over and over and over again, kin-wide and (from what people say in GLFF on my server) server-wide? Hard to believe. I believe there is something different about the drop rates in Fornost. Whether that is WAI or a bug, who knows.

    I'll keep doing Fornost for the medallions and for the fights (some of which are fun and very good for keeping up skills) but with no expectation nor even serious hope of loot.
    Last edited by Samsgaard; Apr 08 2013 at 05:52 PM.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gedachtnis View Post
    Allow me to introduce you to North Cotton Farms and Stoneheight.
    For completely no reason I forgot to mention that the In their absence cluster (I think aside from Ost Dunhoth which I have not played yet but heard that it's supposed to drop alright) is as bad as Fornost. I haven't played these instances as often as Fornost though, but something over 10 times for sure (T2 cm). They never dropped a single teal - not only in 3mans, also lost temple and the forochel-ini.

    And no teal means: No teal for the whole group not only me. Within 10 runs you always should get some teal items. I cannot believe what Namesse said that they never get teal at Sambrog, Ost Elendil etc. either. Droprates in Fornost and ITA are off. It's obvious.

    But as I said: There's a very very good healer-cloak at water-wing. There's an incredibly good damage-earring for agility-classes. Some guy on my server kept bidding one first age symbol, 700 gold and a crystal to get it just once. I think there's very very good might-gear in there as well. Not to mention the damage earring for casters at water-wing. It could be possible that devs want to make some teal gear more desireable by keeping droprates very low. It could also be a bug. I hope it's a bug actually cuz then it might be fixed soon and I'll finally get the gear I'm drooling for =)

  17. #17
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    As far as ITA, I think it may just be the three-mans, but it's hard to tell since I've run the other ones significantly less.
    • NCF and StH droprates suck. That much is obvious. It's a good day when you get a purple.
    • Lost Temple doesn't seem too bad. We do seem to average one teal per run. The minor problem here is that LT is probably one of the longer instances, and challenge is a bit tricky. (I mean, it's still easy but it's one of the few instances that my group will still occasionally wipe on and it's definitely harder than almost any of the other 3 or 6 man challenges.) You'd think with that you'd be seeing maybe two teals on average, since we tend to see two teals on average for something like GB. Again, this just may be due to a low personal sample size.
    • Haven't actually downed SS once since U10, so I can't speak for that one.
    • OD actually seems to have a decent drop rate, at least for gear. We ran through the first four wings last night, Wound was T2 and the rest were T2C. Think the lowest amount of teals we got was 3, and we had one wing where we got 5 or 6, which seems to be at minimum on average with how much gear it gave before. The Celebrimbor symbol drop rate was oddly low though, for a raid like OD I personally expected roughly one a chest, but of the seven chests we opened and the 12 people we had per chest (11 for Wound, which is probably why we missed challenge), we only got one symbol total. Think we only got one stat tome as well. No relic removal scrolls.

  18. #18
    As an aside, are the symbols in OD T2 SA or FA?

    We've had terrible luck with FA symbols in the Erebor T2 Raids.

  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gedachtnis View Post
    As an aside, are the symbols in OD T2 SA or FA?

    We've had terrible luck with FA symbols in the Erebor T2 Raids.
    They're second age symbols unfortunately.

  20. #20
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    Well, i can tell one thing i just did wraith of earth yesterday TIER 1 first time on level 85 with members from my KIN, i did it several times a long long time ago when i was about level 40....and yesterday at the end, surprise i won a Gold earring with my LM (162 will plus other things). Impressive! Im a lucky man or since im using my horseshoe for about 3 days and never got it out of my pocket, it does bring some "luck". By the way as well when i did wraith of fire in the sequence i won a Tome of Fate VII.

    I never won great drops at the end of instance/skirmish/raid. I could count the times that it happens. So since i began to use this horseshoe all the time (crafting, doing daylies, etc), something really change.

    Good lucky to you guys!

  21. #21
    Gold earrings drop rather often in Fornost Water, a lot of Hunters, LM or RK got them on my main server.

    As some people said, the worst instances are Northcotton/StoneHeight : I farm Stoneheight T1 or T2C in solo everyday, I never saw a teal item and I'm lucky when I see a purple one... definitely bugged (there was a thread about it in instances forum)
    Last edited by Castorix; May 02 2013 at 10:32 PM.

  22. #22
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    There are people running water at all!? :O

    I never cared about blue items drop when I farmed earth wing, but I'm sure they drop.
    And today champ looted golden axe.

 

 

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