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  1. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Andorric View Post
    I guess my question for people complaining about the lack of appropriate reward for challenge content is - why are you actually playing the challenge. Is it to prove your skill, is it bragging rights, OR (as I suspect is true for most) is it so that you can have better gear than the Joneses and walk around brandishing said big stick? For #1, nothing has changed. For #2, would you be satisfied by a special title or a low % drop cosmetic / housing item? If not, evidence says you're actually, probably, #3.

    Which is fine. But let's at least be honest that it's about epeen and not something else.
    My answer to "why are you actually playing the challenge" is that overcoming challenging things is fun. This will keep a range of people, including myself, busy for the next month.

    Now, faceroll farming an instance and getting all the best loot is fun too. This, too, will keep a range of people busy for the next couple of weeks.

    But what a healthy endgame should do is tie those together. Give people challenging content with the best loot. This will keep a range of people busy for the next few months, and give many people a reason to log in consistently until the next update.

    A healthy endgame SHOULDN'T reward an insatiable desire to run the same mind-numbingly boring stuff over and over and over and over again until your eyes bleed or until the RNG smiles upon you and bestows a rare gem.


    PS:
    farming runs don't encourage group teamwork, they don't encourage improvement of self, and they don't encourage a fellowship-oriented atmosphere. They just put 12 random people together as quick as possible and try to button mash to the rewards. Very few farm pugs will distribute loot fairly ensuring some people will be shafted and others rich. And at the end of the day, there's no banter or fond memories of great deeds performed, just an empty desire to acquire another symbol.
    Last edited by mrfigglesworth; Mar 07 2013 at 04:58 PM.

  2. #27
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Southeastern USA
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    147
    People who do the difficult challenge modes actually need the appropriate loot rewards because they use that gear. It's not just shinies to them. They don't want the loot so they can go hang out, looking groovy to the noobs in Bree.

    The real life comparison is average Joe Blow decked out in North Face and whatever kind of athletic shoe is cool right now, trying to impress his friends; and actual athletes who use North Face gear to climb mountains or basketball players who wear the shoes on the court.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/2b2250000000dceda/01007/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Funniez View Post
    People who do the difficult challenge modes actually need the appropriate loot rewards because they use that gear. It's not just shinies to them. They don't want the loot so they can go hang out, looking groovy to the noobs in Bree.

    The real life comparison is average Joe Blow decked out in North Face and whatever kind of athletic shoe is cool right now, trying to impress his friends; and actual athletes who use North Face gear to climb mountains or basketball players who wear the shoes on the court.
    idk, i wish people would stop with this argument. You can get everything you need to beat the hardest content without having all the shinies from the raids themselves. I guarantee you I don't need a single new piece of jewellery, armor, or weapon to beat any of the new raids. Yes, slight upgrades in itemization might make it easier in some cases, but it is far from required.

    What's more important to me (and pretty much everyone who plays this game, including solo/casual players) is player progression and growth. If there's no way to improve, there's no reason to log in unless you wanna talk to your buddies and "fence-hop" in snowbourne.

  4. #29
    We did fires of smaug T2 at level 85: maybe 3 sunbrand thingies dropped and that was about it. No first ages. No gold scrolls. No gold class items. Nothing. It took ~24 minutes to do for my group (on our successful run. We spent ~2hrs learning learning our strat).

    We could have farmed Erebor T1 4 times vs our successful T2 smaug run and likely had much better loot. I'll never run fires of smaug again unless it's for challenge which looks like we'll need first ages for the necessary dps. And even then challenge likely won't drop jack and it's still quicker to get first ages on T1s. Doing T2 or T2c once and never again because T1 is a better farm is silly.


    On top of that. For the T2 Erebor armor you have to do ALL THREE RAIDS at level 85 on T2. Flights of the Lonely Mountain at lvl 85 is probably impossible as it's currently designed but maybe I'm wrong. That means we can't even wear the T2 armor set because no one can complete the deed.

    U10 has been terrible so far in terms of enjoyment.

    p.s. This is my ~5th time trying to post this.

  5. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by mrfigglesworth View Post
    What's more important to me (and pretty much everyone who plays this game, including solo/casual players) is player progression and growth. If there's no way to improve, there's no reason to log in unless you wanna talk to your buddies and "fence-hop" in snowbourne.
    That's a great point; where does that leave the raiders, after they've already improved their character as much as possible? (which will happen faster than ever before) ...Logging in just to chat, I suppose.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0920d00000010f3c4/01007/signature.png]Daschande[/charsig]

    Chanus - "MMO forums are mostly for whining, with the occasional sprinkle of an actually rational and intelligent poster offering a decent suggestion."

  6. #31
    I miss the loot from tower of orthanc where u only saw symbols drop on t2.
    “A single dream is more powerful than a thousand realities.” -???

  7. #32
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    1,086
    Turbine have pretty much ruined a great game in my opinion.

    They learnt nothin from the Durchest fiasco. Let gold items drop form any tier thats not a problem but 1st age symbols should be awarded for effort :/ at least initially, like it used to be.
    Snowbourn - Commander Shakbasher - Lieutenant Glurf

    Warriors of The Great Eye

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by Ellery01 View Post
    Bottom line: It is easier to get a first age today than it was to get a second age two days ago. In what MMO world does this make sense? Turbine, how can you nerf Durchest looting a few weeks ago and implement U10 like this on day 1?

    Do you guys even know why you nerfed Durchest runs in the first place?

    That aside, I commend you for what appears to be lair raids that will be quite challenging on t2c. We'll just have to see how many kins care to waste their time learning it since you made it so easy to get everything nice in the raid on t1.
    What bugs me the most is that the game now heavily favours those with huge amount of time in their hands to actually grind all those hours. No effort, just time. And a very strong nerve for grinding.

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by Jullandar View Post
    What bugs me the most is that the game now heavily favours those with huge amount of time in their hands to actually grind all those hours. No effort, just time. And a very strong nerve for grinding.
    If these raids had a daily cooldown you'd see many more people completing T2 and T2c. Right now T2/T2c is worthless to run because T1 drops the exact same stuff in less time.

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by timmyloo22546 View Post
    If these raids had a daily cooldown you'd see many more people completing T2 and T2c. Right now T2/T2c is worthless to run because T1 drops the exact same stuff in less time.
    Daily, twice-weekly, whichever. It was also a very good sanity check to have to keep our minds fresh, since you couldn't overdo it. Yesterday I happened on a champ that had been running BfE for 400+ times to get his cloak. That kind of sanity.

  11. #36
    When BG and OD were the main raids, my kin spent months learning the raids on T2 and we worked on getting challenge. When we had completed it on mains, we ran it on alts and with kinmates who were not as active as raiders. OD and BG kept our kin active and engaged for the entire time between expansions.

    With ToO, we initially worked hard on T2 challenges, but gradually enthusiasm waned because there was little advantage to completing it on challenge. Drops were basically the same regardless, and you only needed T1 for the armour, so once we had beaten the bosses T2 challenge a few times, it was hard to get a group to keep trying for challenges. Alts only go T1 treatment, and the pool of active raiders in kin kept dropping. There just wasn't enough to keep raid-focused players to keep logging in.

    Over the long wait until the current raids came out, our pool of raiders kept dropping. But people came back before this update, excited about the possibility of new raids and wanting to get used to working as a group in preparation for the new raids. We anticipated spending weeks at least learning the raid and beating T2 challenge.

    Lo and behold, the raids came out and they were beaten T2 challenge so quickly that there is no for an extended period of learning the raid. They can be run reasonably quickly even on T2. But no real need to do T2 as far as loot is concerned. T1 is enough for most things you need, and people can log in, join a pug and get their loot (if they are lucky with the RNG that is), so there really isn't a need to work together with the kin to beat harder challenges. Whereas I had thought these new raids would bring back the days of working together to beat a difficult challenge and get worthwhile loot, I suspect it won't be long before our raiding population is declining again. It certainly isn't going to keep us occupied for months and months the way OD and BG did.
    [COLOR="#800080"][FONT=Arial Black]A Vote for Sapience is still a vote for progress![/FONT][/COLOR]

  12. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by Burio View Post
    There are T2 only Sets, that give you are good reason to do t2 and don't farm t1.
    No, because Gold items are a lot better and drop in T1, or in T2C for newbies (like School, a real joke, a friend captain got twice his Gold breastplate by farming it in a few minutes runs in loop with me (+ 3 seals every time, it takes just a bit more minutes in solo, without the challlenge of course))

  13. #38
    Man, you guys make it seem like those golds drop like rain. I've run dozens of t2 3-mans, at least a dozen t1 BfEs and I've yet to see a single gold (besides crystals and symbols) drop for anyone, let alone myself. Far cry from the guy with 400+ runs but I would imagine I'd see one drop for any one of the 11, 5 or 2 other people I've run with by now.

    Side note, is there a way to see how many runs of an instance you've done? Or is that just something people guess at?

  14. #39
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    2,032
    Quote Originally Posted by Emachine View Post
    Man, you guys make it seem like those golds drop like rain. I've run dozens of t2 3-mans, at least a dozen t1 BfEs and I've yet to see a single gold (besides crystals and symbols) drop for anyone, let alone myself. Far cry from the guy with 400+ runs but I would imagine I'd see one drop for any one of the 11, 5 or 2 other people I've run with by now.

    Side note, is there a way to see how many runs of an instance you've done? Or is that just something people guess at?
    Control K to bring up the skirmish/instance stat panel. Just collapse them all and find the one you want to see the stats on, expand just that one. You'll see Boss Kills, Boss Resets, etc. The Boss Kills should give you the count you want.

    I'm one of those unlucky folks that has run hundreds of instances/raids and has yet to get any gold item or First Age Symbol :-/
    Chromite (Hunter) - Grumbletocks (Guardian) on Landroval, Appendage (Hunter) on Brandywine

  15. #40
    Hate to break some of you folk's bubble..but the 'hardcore' bunch of raiders....are not Turbines priority.

    people do not play the game for all the reason you stated. It's unimportant and irrelevant. They play it because it's Lotr and for the story, the journey.

    The only reason 'raids' and pvp are in the game are because they are staples of an MMO. But they are not Turbines main concern. If you're here for the 'hardcore raiding', really, you been playing the wrong game for the last 5 years.
    Likes to heal and thinks she is good at it. Unfortunately, can't heal stupid or bad builds...

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Maviarab View Post
    They play it because it's Lotr and for the story, the journey.
    By journey you must mean instance join and session play.

 

 
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