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  1. #26
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
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    5,817
    My philosophy is this: if I see a character running around an area I'm harvesting with a high level character, I check the other character's level. If it's also 10+ levels over the monsters, they get no deference from me. Otherwise, if I see them near a resource drop fighting, I wait 'til they're done fighting to see if they harvest it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Vandervahn View Post
    Yet it is natural. Humans do it all the time, using first come-first serve spoils, me and most likely you as well.
    Ever rushed into a train/bus/subway to grab a seat before others?
    Ever cut into or jumped a line to lower your waiting time? etc. etc.
    Have I ever? I may have. I don't remember. Do I? No. Are you trying to justify your own self-centered behavior by saying "It's OK, everyone does it?" Everyone does not do it.

    All of these completely natural behaviours all of us are prone to.
    By "all of us" I assume you mean you and the mouse in your pocket.

    So the question for me rather is: Why do you let yourself get worked up about normal everyday behaviour?
    But this I can agree with (taking out the "normal").

    It may be "natural," but it is far from universal.

    And this one ...

    Ever took the second or third package in a supermarket because the one in the front had a little nook?
    ... is not even remotely related. The product may be damaged. It's not selfish to choose an undamaged product when you're the next one in line for the product.
    Last edited by maxjenius; Feb 09 2013 at 12:21 PM.

  2. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Ellieni View Post
    I never said I do the same and I don't.

    If I see someone next to a node I do not mine it. If I see someone farming nodes in the area and I am doing the same, I go somewhere else.
    Looks like I misunderstood you there and thought that you would do so. Sorry about that.

  3. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Dawnsinger View Post
    Just a comment to the node jumping. If ppl come on warsteeds they likely won't notice much around them, nor other players (tried controlling the warsteed in Rohan, and found it hard.Tried the warsteed in low lvl area and collided with everything). I haven't farmed anything but the newest high lvl ore, but I can honestly admit, that if I went to a low lvl area, I would be too busy trying to control the warsteed while getting to my target to take note of other players in the area.
    Eh, its not that bad. I actually like having the mount that feels... well like a horse
    Granted its harder to control low level medium steed when you just get it than fully yellow traited light one, but once I got used to the feeling and leveled it up a bit I hardly notice any difference. I took my ordinary horse off my hotbar now and ride warsteed instead all the time.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/222190000000ae313/01008/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  4. #29
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    Up the steps and down the hall
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    62
    Quote Originally Posted by TwenBumblefoot View Post
    Personally, If I'm in an area which is grey to me and I see a player near a node, I leave it alone, as they have first right to that area not me.
    I do the same thing. Even though I am sitting behind my computer and will never meet my fellow gamers in real life I still show others respect out of respect not just for them but for myself, as well. It's just not who I am to treat others badly.

    I have watched several players lately come up and steal my nodes while I am literally backed right up on a vase or an ore fighting a mob (one player took my vase while my mob was standing on top of it). Meanwhile the thief has advanced far out of the zone's level. The first time I was like "whaaa.."? But after that, I found myself heating up with anger.

    I am polite, rarely even giving another player a playful slap unless they are my friends but these disrespectful players I have come across more and more lately deserve to be pinned down and ripped to shreds by my tundra cub.

    Too bad the game does not allow me to do so

  5. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
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    5,817
    Quote Originally Posted by oldrat View Post
    I have watched several players lately come up and steal my nodes while I am literally backed right up on a vase or an ore fighting a mob (one player took my vase while my mob was standing on top of it). Meanwhile the thief has advanced far out of the zone's level. The first time I was like "whaaa.."? But after that, I found myself heating up with anger.
    If you let yourself get this angry over nothing, you're not doing yourself any favors. You can't control what others do, but you can control how you feel about it.

  6. #31
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
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    Everywhere
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    1,693
    While "node stealing" isn't exactly good behavior, I think that the best way to react to it is reminding yourself that the game is largely set up on the "first come first served" model. In fact, life is that way. Until you actively claim something, the node/kill is pretty much open to whoever gets there first to claim it.

    Now, you also have to consider that, no matter how generous and kind the vast majority of people may be (which is one big reason people are attracted to LOTRO), there will always be a few bad apples who just aren't interested in applying the common decency and common sense that everyone else does. And, while this may sound rather blunt, you just have to do your best to work with/around those people within the rules set forth by the user agreement. So, basically, you ignore them as best you can and move on. If those people's actions violate the rules, you should report them so the GMs can deal with it appropriately.

    My advice is to just do your best to not overreact. In most cases, the person who comes and takes the node is simply guilty of not paying attention to what they are doing. They are just like "Oh, node. I'll go grab it." They aren't necessarily looking to cause you trouble - just not paying attention. And, be thankful for the vast majority of players who are not jerks. At least where I play, there are plenty of great people to outweigh the few jerks I come across.

  7. #32
    This is not new behavior. It has been going starting when I first started playing in 2007. It is much less common than it was back in 2007 and 2008 probably because there are fewer people in the same area.

    I would be leveling my character and harvesting back when horses were only available to level 35+ characters. People would ride around taking all the nodes on their horses. I can even remember cases where there were two nodes. I start toward one, the horse person would ride past me, I would turn to get the other node. He grab the first. Mount up. Pass me again. Take the second node.

    In the bad old days, there was no tapping a node. Higher level characters would steal nodes that you were mining because they had faster picks. Nodes would not respawn if there was still something left in them. Plus nodes worked like chests. You could store something in them. In frustration I would carry some very low value trash. I would empty a node. Put something worth 4 copper in the node. The mining ants would notice that I did not mine out the node. They would race over to get that last item that I had left for them. I also run into the mining ants that would only take the ore. They would leave dye components and gems behind.

    It a annoying human behavior that you have to get used to and put up with. In real life, line jumpers will occasionally get into conflict with the other people. There was an incident years ago where one older male cut in line in front of another male getting ready to buy a movie ticket. An unacceptable solution was implemented by the cutoff male. He pulled out his pistol and killed the guy. Bought his ticket. Went in to see the movie. He police came and hauled him away. Beatngs and yelling is much more common a reaction.
    Last edited by Yula_the_Mighty; Feb 09 2013 at 01:50 PM.
    Unless stated otherwise, all content in this post is My Personal Opinion.

  8. #33
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    157
    I'm sorry you had this experience. Unfortunately there is always one out there who is always out for themselves and those are the ones we tend to notice because that type of behavior is not the "Norm". I find the community on Brandywine to be generally courteous and respectful...but there are always a few that have the "me first" attitude.

    When I am farming in a lower level area, I tend to avoid any node that someone is next to or close to. I figure there are plenty more out there, missing "that one" is not going to kill me. Now if I see someone fighting next to the node I was going for, I too will check their health and maybe throw them a heal. Before open tapping, unfortunately that was a no no because it interfered with their XP. After a quick salute I am on my way.

    One thing I have noticed is that players tend to be a little more skeptical now. Our kin has an event during the Yule time called "Operation Hardiclaus". We basically make a lot of 7-14 level critted weapons, shields and food to hand out in the lower level areas. Most players are very receptive, but some always ask what you want from them. I basically reply I just want to give them a gift and wish them a Merry Yule. I have made some very good friends over the course of 3 1/2 years and even recruited a few new kin members doing this. It gives new players some good gear and the knowledge that there are friendly people in Middle Earth. It gives us a feeling of accomplishment knowing we did something nice for someone, and one day they will pay it forward by helping someone else. If you are on Brandywine and find something in your mailbox from Hardi or Nyke, it's just our way of saying hello.

    Bottom line, please don't let that one bad apple ruin your fun in Middle Earth.
    [COLOR="#00FFFF"]Co-Founder of Roxxi Manor on the Brandywine Server. For more information on our kin, please visit [COLOR="#FF0000"]www.roxximanor.com[/COLOR][/COLOR]
    [COLOR="#EE82EE"]Nykea, Nykeaborn, Nykeabur, Nykeadal, Nykeala, Nykealuv, Nykealyn, Nykeamynx, Nykeanor, Nykearoxx, Nykeasea, Nykeathyn, Nykeatte, Nykeavaldis, Nykeawen and Nykeawyn[/COLOR]

  9. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by maxjenius View Post
    By "all of us" I assume you mean you and the mouse in your pocket.
    That;s not a mouse. It's a miniature giant space hamster.

  10. #35
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    Jun 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moln View Post
    That;s not a mouse. It's a miniature giant space hamster.
    Go for the eyes, Boo, go for the eyes!

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by maxjenius View Post
    Have I ever? I may have. I don't remember. Do I? No. Are you trying to justify your own self-centered behavior by saying "It's OK, everyone does it?" Everyone does not do it.
    Don't twist Vandervahn's words. He is not justifying the behavior. Merely stating it is a thing of all times. It is natural behavior to give priority to the needs of yourself or your group/community over the needs of someone else. If you see the entire server as your community that's great, but you have to realize not everyone sees it that way.

    It may not be the nicest behavior, but it happens and will continue to happen. People are no saints(most of us aren't at least).
    To the OP, take comfort in the fact that you had not seen it in a while. This means that the 'node-stealing' is by no means a widespread behavior in this game. And you just had some bad luck encountering it recently.
    [B][URL="https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthread.php?385713-Kinship-Revamp-Proposal"][COLOR=#ed2669]A vote for the kinship revamp proposal is a vote for progress! Vote today![/COLOR][/URL][/B]

  12. #37
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    Jun 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalderic View Post
    Don't twist Vandervahn's words.
    Don't twist my words.

    He is not justifying the behavior. Merely stating it is a thing of all times.
    Which is a way of justifying it.

    It is natural behavior to give priority to the needs of yourself or your group/community over the needs of someone else.
    If we were hunting wooly mammoths out on the steppes, sure. My family/tribe is more important to me than yours is. But it's not the norm in modern Western social situations. Being able to "turn it off" ("it" being the competitive drive) when it's not needed is part of being a social human. Some people have not mastered (and probably never will master) that skill.

    It may not be the nicest behavior, but it happens and will continue to happen.
    No argument that it does happen.

    People are no saints(most of us aren't at least).
    There's probably some room in between "saint" and "self-centered jerk."
    Last edited by maxjenius; Feb 09 2013 at 02:57 PM.

  13. #38
    I'm occasionally wont to pick up resources in areas that are grey to the character to collect stuff for lower level alts. Frankly it's more efficient for everyone involved if I don't have to defeat nearby mobs, because I typically have a set goal in mind (100 Barrow Iron, for example), and doing this means I'm in the area less time than I would be on an on-level alt.

    That being said, if I see someone fighting near a node, I leave it alone, and since the advent of open tapping, will often help kill the mob for them so that they can get it before a 3rd party wanders into the mix. On the rare occasion that the other person has griped about kill-stealing, I've simply replied with my actual intended purpose. Have made several friends that way.
    The navigation throughout the LotRO site is horrible. You can quote me on that.
    [color=green]You say "[i]Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn[/i]" like it's a bad thing...[/color]

  14. #39
    I usually run in to the opposite behaviour. I will call it node-avoiding.

    Players are noticing the same node, they move in to dig but than they spot each other. They are both overly polite and chivalrous so in the end no one ends up digging the freaking ore. It does look funny, when 2 people suddenly turn away from a node, the obliviously want, and ride of in opposite directions.

    Only time i spot node jumpers is when questing in areas where you have rarer mats like gold ores or masters scholar nodes. But i almost understand the lack of courtesy there. They have probably been cruising North Downs and Evendim for hours looking for gold. The ratio between gold and iron is pretty frustrating.

  15. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by maxjenius View Post
    There's probably some room in between "saint" and "self-centered jerk."
    Yes, but you don't get to monitor someone else's behavior 24/7 and make a qualitative assessment. All you get to see is that "they stole my node just now". If they're following you around and specifically taking nodes when you engage in combat, that's another matter. Otherwise, all you're seeing is individual events which don't give you enough information to place tham anywhere on your imaginary scale.
    The navigation throughout the LotRO site is horrible. You can quote me on that.
    [color=green]You say "[i]Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn[/i]" like it's a bad thing...[/color]

  16. #41
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
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    940
    I had said in my OP that I understand the 'first-come-first-serve' theory of node grabbing. I understand that there are times people will be there before me. I won't always win. I am fine with that. I can even understand a player grabbing it when I am standing next to the node, nearly on top of it. They may have thought I was just fighting the mob by the node because of random placement. But when I message and ask why they took the node without even seeing if I was going to take it after fighting and I get a snotty attitude, that tends to make me a bit angry at the person. Selfishness is normal, I can almost understand it. But when its combined with rudeness as well? And especially by someone who is higher level than the area.

    I hadn't seen a lot of it until the past few months. Now it seems rampant. Whether I am on my level 85 or my level 15, people have just forgotten common courtesy and have developed an "I want it all, screw you to get it" attitude. I don't blame fre to play or open tapping. I blame people.

  17. #42
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
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    I can only comment on Windfola, but this has never gone away. It was bad early on, not seen much of it for a long time, though it happens now and then. It's just poor taste on some peoples part.
    When the Rebels become the Tyrants, Revolution takes on a New Meaning.

  18. #43
    I have experienced many, many more considerate players in this game than jerks. I remember trying desperately to mine areas where all the creatures are purple - you have to be very careful or die if you can't run to safety. It would be very exasperating when someone, especially higher level, grabbed that resource I had worked so hard to get to. Since I remember that so well, I always give way to others, especially lower level characters.

    I do have a problem that keeps getting in the way of helping other players. I can't seem to type messages quickly enough to interact with other players in time. Trying to ask another player if he needs help usually results in his death or the player is long gone by the time the message is finished.

  19. #44
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashrellion View Post
    Yes, but you don't get to monitor someone else's behavior 24/7 and make a qualitative assessment. All you get to see is that "they stole my node just now". If they're following you around and specifically taking nodes when you engage in combat, that's another matter. Otherwise, all you're seeing is individual events which don't give you enough information to place tham anywhere on your imaginary scale.
    "Jerk" is a subjective term, as is "saint." Whatever your personal definitions of "jerk" and "saint" are, "not being a saint" does not make someone a jerk, and vice versa. That's the point of my comment to Kalderic. His implication was that because no one is a saint, jerky behavior is to be expected. It's not. Why? Because it's possible to be both a non-saint and a non-jerk.

    But again, anyone who let's him- or herself get worked up over "node stealing" in a computer should probably take a break.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elrohir_of_Kellemar View Post
    I have experienced many, many more considerate players in this game than jerks. I remember trying desperately to mine areas where all the creatures are purple - you have to be very careful or die if you can't run to safety. It would be very exasperating when someone, especially higher level, grabbed that resource I had worked so hard to get to. Since I remember that so well, I always give way to others, especially lower level characters.
    If I see a low level approaching a node, I won't go grab it. But I'm not on gonna go on the hawk looking for low levels just so I can avoid ganking them. I bet most of the time when you experience what you're talking about the player with the high level didn't even notice your character was there.

    I do have a problem that keeps getting in the way of helping other players. I can't seem to type messages quickly enough to interact with other players in time. Trying to ask another player if he needs help usually results in his death or the player is long gone by the time the message is finished.
    That's why I don't even bother. If a player aggros something their character can't handle, them's the breaks, IMO.
    Last edited by maxjenius; Feb 09 2013 at 06:06 PM.

  20. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Felajarko View Post
    I haven't seen it for a while, but it looks like its back; people jumping ore nodes. Now before you say "first come first serve" please let me explain. I was fighting a worm and standing right next to an ore node when a character rides up, grabs the node and runs while I am fighting. I thought it had always been common courtesy to at least ask before grabbing it, but maybe I am wrong.

    This has been happening with more and more frequency. And the people doing it don't even seem to care. They are 10 levels or more higher than the area and just there for the ore. I can understand farming ore, but to grab it from someone? Very bad form.
    I have learned over the years to ignore the grab and run players and keep enjoying my time questing and ore gathering as the nodes present themselves.

    You are right about common courtesy, it should be highly valued, but sadly it is not the case.

    On the bright side, there are still many in the LOTRO community who continue to abide by the quality of character portrayed by many of Tolkien's characters in the books.
    Landroval Server

    "I don't know half of you half as well as I should like; and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."

 

 
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