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  1. #1

    Talking Freeps Getting Heal Buffs, Feelings?

    I am not one to usually post on creep forums, but I wanted to see how you guys feel about the heal buffs RKs/Minis will be receiving in U10.

    With the new ICPR conversions, your power drains will be less effective. The fate crit buffs (both chance/magnitude) will greatly increase HPS for freep healers, and Will now comes with tactical mitigation. Not to mention Battlefield Promotions that will increase their morale and drop their power costs, and encourage healers to focus more on raids to achieve rank.

    Just curious.

  2. #2
    Terrible, terrible, horrifically bad idea.

    What the moors needs is LESS healing. ATM, it's just a big heal fest...

    Are they boosting creep healing/dps at all? If they aren't, then we're back to not being able to touch freeps again and minis being stupidly OP.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0420801000011a1c9/signature.png]Feelmybite[/charsig]

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Costs View Post
    I am not one to usually post on creep forums, but I wanted to see how you guys feel about the heal buffs RKs/Minis will be receiving in U10.

    With the new ICPR conversions, your power drains will be less effective. The fate crit buffs (both chance/magnitude) will greatly increase HPS for freep healers, and Will now comes with tactical mitigation. Not to mention Battlefield Promotions that will increase their morale and drop their power costs, and encourage healers to focus more on raids to achieve rank.

    Just curious.
    Its just more evidence that Turbine wants to have one side or the other OP with a subsequent update. This is their form of balance, shouldnt be surprising. Ive recently been in one of your raids with the purgatory guys and I have to say you (and they) do a decent job of not make the fights ridiculous with heal stacking.

    That said, you know where its heading going to be a lot of heal stacked freep groups running around. Id like to say im surprised but im not, i think overall the battle field promotions are a good idea for freeps im just not sold on the the buffs to will.

    Rk's, LM's and minis are getting one hell of a boost here for moors play.

  4. #4
    I can certainly salute the battlefield Promotion freep side, as its gonna give at least one incitative to rank. But Freeps already have the upperhand, by a miles, in the healing department. And now theyll get even more?

    Healing inflation need to be stopped, not encouraged.

  5. #5
    I don't know enough about u10 yet. I remember reading devs want to make creeps/freeps need to sacrifice more for the way they trait so a class isn't able to have high dps heals and mits all on one trait build, will have to wait and see and most likely weather the storm. I actually prefer freeps to have the edge tbh since it brings out more freeps on the small servers. Not sure what creeps will be getting as well. As it stands a well timed +blight and a cc or pack flayer will decent dps can counter heals pretty good unless bubbled. And the box brands, heh peeps will still be asking for a nerf on that so whatever. I also prefer the longer drawn out strategic fights vs follow the rat and bomb targets.

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by ssSteele View Post
    I don't know enough about u10 yet. I remember reading devs want to make creeps/freeps need to sacrifice more for the way they trait so a class isn't able to have high dps heals and mits all on one trait build, will have to wait and see and most likely weather the storm. I actually prefer freeps to have the edge tbh since it brings out more freeps on the small servers. Not sure what creeps will be getting as well. As it stands a well timed +blight and a cc or pack flayer will decent dps can counter heals pretty good unless bubbled. And the box brands, heh peeps will still be asking for a nerf on that so whatever. I also prefer the longer drawn out strategic fights vs follow the rat and bomb targets.
    Completely agree. What I'm worried about is not being able to kill things without having to use a healing debuff skill. I don't think they should be required at all. But true, we do really need to wait until we have all the data and are able to test it.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0420801000011a1c9/signature.png]Feelmybite[/charsig]

  7. #7
    Freep healing is fine as is, this coming from a freep healer and a creep. No need to improve it, but I suppose some froobs complained about it so it's getting a buff. /shrug

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Waterford, Ireland
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    3,401
    Only two simple things to make U10 a perfect balance update:

    Increase creep base stats slightly to match them with freep BFP's and keep them on par and,
    PUNISH CLUBBING.

    If clubbing is not punished, BFP's will be farmed for.

  9. #9
    The change i see is that mini's RK and Lore-masters will just be able to spam-heal themselves more effectively.
    Then again usually against self-heal spammers and shield-wardens creeps deploy brute force aka zergs.
    All those "survivable" targets are doing is making them call-outs for creeps.

    Ex

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Bay Area, California
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    872
    If 1pt of Will does give 2pts to Tactical Mitigation (correct me if I'm wrong), I'm worrying about how much more resilient Tactical classes will be, especially if that stat is highly stacked. Would a 2000 Will Minstrel/LM/RK gain 4000pts in Tactical Mitigation? Considering most Creeps use Fire/Shadow/Acid attacks, would Heavy Armour classes be left in the dust, in terms of survivability?

    The addition to Freep Promotions is overdue I think, and gives legit incentive to actually rank. However, with the idea that Creeps gained large amounts of morale initially to counter the better DPS output of freeps, what will happen when that gap is reaching a closure? At first glance, it further gives incentive to group, but I'd like to see how this impacts RvR fights with even numbers.

    As far as changes in Power/ICPR, I'd imagine Minstrels would be insanely difficult to defeat, relative to other classes. I'd depend on power drain to bring the fight close, otherwise, they'd easily outheal the damage done unto them. Again, more incentive to group and I'd have more reason to avoid a 1v1 situation with said class. Or, the devs are aiming for each class to have an 'achilles' nemesis, and be the bane of another?

    A lot of people are awaiting U10 to determine their continued activity in the Moors. Here's hoping the pendulum of balance strikes close to a midpoint, rather than stray too far away.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Aztec_Soul View Post
    If 1pt of Will does give 2pts to Tactical Mitigation (correct me if I'm wrong), I'm worrying about how much more resilient Tactical classes will be, especially if that stat is highly stacked. Would a 2000 Will Minstrel/LM/RK gain 4000pts in Tactical Mitigation? Considering most Creeps use Fire/Shadow/Acid attacks, would Heavy Armour classes be left in the dust, in terms of survivability?
    So I played my mini for a bit last night on Bullroarer. I usually run him at near tact-mit cap anyways. However, with the +4600 tact mitigation I received, I discovered I could use all of my virtues on morale/resistance and still be at tact-mit cap. In fact, with AoC up, I have a resistance rating of almost 40%. This could be very difficult for DOT classes. Though heavies are not left in the dust... their cap is still higher than ours.


    Quote Originally Posted by Aztec_Soul View Post
    As far as changes in Power/ICPR, I'd imagine Minstrels would be insanely difficult to defeat, relative to other classes. I'd depend on power drain to bring the fight close, otherwise, they'd easily outheal the damage done unto them. Again, more incentive to group and I'd have more reason to avoid a 1v1 situation with said class. Or, the devs are aiming for each class to have an 'achilles' nemesis, and be the bane of another?
    Power drains may be required, but with a 4k+ ICPR and 40% resistance ... you may be hard pressed (and this is without the new fate gear we'll be wearing soon). I did note a 18% drop in max power (without the rank buff), but also noticed that all skills required less power too, and my ICPR nearly doubled. I am not trying to scare anyone here ... just letting you guys know what numbers I am seeing.

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Costs View Post
    Power drains may be required, but with a 4k+ ICPR and 40% resistance ... you may be hard pressed (and this is without the new fate gear we'll be wearing soon). I did note a 18% drop in max power (without the rank buff), but also noticed that all skills required less power too, and my ICPR nearly doubled. I am not trying to scare anyone here ... just letting you guys know what numbers I am seeing.
    If confirmed when going live, this mean the return of the godmoding minstrel. 4k ICPR is 4 times what my mini had during SoA days and 5 times what my defiler currently have. Guess you wont need to worry about flies anymore and just ignore it.

    In term of healing output, do you have any numbers?
    Last edited by whitefox1313; Feb 03 2013 at 09:42 AM.

  13. #13
    First off, a disclaimer on that 4k ICPR, that was with me switching two gear items and losing 310 morale and 62 will. I would say with the high resistance + new ICPR spider drains will not be very effective against minis. But honestly, they never really did have an effect on most minis anyways (who ran with 5-set harmonious and the pvp rings). In fact, I have always tried to act as a spider magnet in RvRs when on my mini.

    As for flies ... they are still nothing to be messed with. I 1v1ed several defilers on Bullroarer and their flies were devastatingly effective. You have no worries there. Flies still drain minis ... fast (for now). On a side note, the PoT effect from AoC felt less powerful ... but I am not sure if that is my imagination or a result of having a lower relative power pool.

    As for changes in HPS. I did not have the opportunity to act as a dedicated healer in raids in the moors. So I am still not sure. Looking at the numbers though, there will no doubt be an increase in overall HPS because:

    1.) Increased crit chance due to fate changes
    2.) Crit multiplier now being added to crit rating (my burg for instance has a +30% crit multiplier)

    Those changes in crit, as it deals with DPS, will most likely be nominal considering all mobs (and creeps already having) new crit D. However, unless fellow freeps have crit D against my heals, I highly doubt we will not see at least a 5% increase in HPS.

    All these changes are subject to modification before u10 comes out, so I am not sweating it too much yet. At the end of the day, it's all going to come down to itemization ... something only the devs know about atm.

  14. #14
    don't forget the extra 1.4+ tacti mit on 1st agers.

    from what it looked like in BR barely any freep classes run out of power even when spamming everything(not even hunter which easily burns it on live), that might be changed but who knows.

    those changes you are talking about for traits or whatever will be done in the class changes coming after the update I believe.

    not much more to U10 than what the BR patch notes already have no point in expecting anything except a polish or two.

  15. #15
    Yes, the moors certainly needs healing, on either side, to be more powerful. Really great change. I'm very excited.

    Is this their way of phasing out PvP in this game cuz they don't have the manpower to deal with it? Increasing heals update after update until eventually 99% of the moors is comprised of healing classes and nothing ever dies?

  16. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Costs View Post
    So I played my mini for a bit last night on Bullroarer. I usually run him at near tact-mit cap anyways. However, with the +4600 tact mitigation I received, I discovered I could use all of my virtues on morale/resistance and still be at tact-mit cap. In fact, with AoC up, I have a resistance rating of almost 40%. This could be very difficult for DOT classes. Though heavies are not left in the dust... their cap is still higher than ours.




    Power drains may be required, but with a 4k+ ICPR and 40% resistance ... you may be hard pressed (and this is without the new fate gear we'll be wearing soon). I did note a 18% drop in max power (without the rank buff), but also noticed that all skills required less power too, and my ICPR nearly doubled. I am not trying to scare anyone here ... just letting you guys know what numbers I am seeing.
    The +tact mit for will is in my opinion overkill for minis. As of now I run with maxed tact mit, but have my build based mostly around that and keeping my crit rating around 18-19% w/o buffs. With this and Fate contributing to crit and crit devastate, I am finding all sorts of openings for improvements (virtues, class traits, settings, gear, etc.) on a build that was already working just fine for me (I still think minis are one of the best pvp classes). Don't get me wrong I'm happy that we're getting the boosts, I just don't necessarily think we needed anything else
    Last edited by xmorzan; Feb 05 2013 at 03:28 PM.
    "Heroes get remembered but Legends never die."

    SnH Landroval

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by xmorzan View Post
    The +tact mit for will is in my opinion overkill for minis. As of now I run with maxed tact mit, but have my build based mostly around that and keeping my crit rating around 18-19% w/o buffs. With this and Fate contributing to crit and crit devastate, I am finding all sorts of openings for improvements (virtues, class traits, settings, gear, etc.) on a build that was already working just fine for me (I still think minis are one of the best pvp classes). Don't get me wrong I'm happy that we're getting the boosts, I just don't necessarily think we needed anything else
    Honestly, I think the devs went overboard with the changes. With the changes to Will as they affect tactical mitigation, I easily cap tac mit now. This allows me to switch out traits or gear I've been using to stack Will, and raise other attributes while still staying capped on tac mit. With the Battle Field Promotions, my r10 RK gets a lot of buffs, too. The overall effect of changes gives my RK +12% Health, +12% power, +9% damage, takes my tac mit % from like 33% to cap (so about 7% less damage taken), increased ICPR, and with the changes to crit mechanics and the nerf to creep passive crit defenses...... yikes!

    Imho, Turbine did this all wrong :/ It's things like number imbalances (give each side an ON buff when numbers are lop-sided)and OP buffs that needed fixing.

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    435
    I always believed that freeps got updated for the new PVE content/raids.....not for pvp. While creep updates were to "Balance" us with these freeps........

    Remember there was no raid that came out last Update and the PvP sets were just awful. So creeps got the love =) but every veteran creep who has played since launch knew what was going to happen for the next update, we told ya so....

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Location
    Niagara Falls. NY
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    460
    It just means their healers should be primaries now.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/032020100001b94bf/signature.png]Bicyclerepairman[/charsig]

 

 

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