We have detected that cookies are not enabled on your browser. Please enable cookies to ensure the proper experience.
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 28
  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    678

    Reaver quick strikes and Blood-lust

    Hey folks, I was informed last night that quick strikes is currently doing quite the opposite, the trait says -10% Attack duration, but when you equip it is giving a negative effect and making our attacks slower

    Also, I was 1v1ing a freep earlier and suddenly noticed my attack speed decreased, I checked debuffs and had no negative effects, then I noticed, I'd just used Blood-lust. Again, this skill says -10% attack duration but is giving a negative effect and slowing our attack speed.

    Just thought I'd let you all know, and would like this fixed for update 10!

    Cheers, Olog

  2. #2
    hmm..thanks. i knew quick strikes wasnt working, however bloodlust i honestly hadnt checked. good to know though. thanks for the info
    Lugbur, R11 Reaver ./. Guthfred, R9 Captain ./. Guthblade, R9 Chamption ./. Muzluck, R9 Warg + Various other toons of different rank and class.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    362
    Don't know about quick strikes but I can promise you that Blood-Lust works.

    I've used it dozens of times since the update and every single time I've noticed that it definitely makes my attacks faster. Perhaps you were just experiencing skill lag?
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0d2160100000e1dea/signature.png]Andrag[/charsig]

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    678
    Quote Originally Posted by Andared View Post
    Don't know about quick strikes but I can promise you that Blood-Lust works.

    I've used it dozens of times since the update and every single time I've noticed that it definitely makes my attacks faster. Perhaps you were just experiencing skill lag?


    The first scene is before Blood-lust, the second scene is with it on. The fact that it's giving a debuff is undeniable

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Toronto, Ontario
    Posts
    5,118
    Ugh what a pain the &&&. Attack duration is an extremely important mechanism especially for a melee class.

    I do hope it's addressed in the next update!
    Third Marshal Rubicon Guardian ~ Third Marshal Raae Minstrel
    Commander Danceswithwargs Reaver ~ Taskmaster Whiskeytangofoxtrot Spider
    Commander Verkaufsschlacker Lore-master ~ Lieutenant Rivaalan Hunter
    ~ No Mercy ~

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    My Computer?
    Posts
    632
    I thank you my good sir! +rep to you because i noticed my attacks started to go slower but couldnt trace it back to the quick strikes trait,
    Rank 10 ~ Blindreaver

  7. #7
    Wow, what a pain.

    Good call.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0420801000020a8c6/signature.png]Slyzer[/charsig]

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    388
    The same issue happens with Warleader's Aura of Command.
    Captains are clearly made of sunshine and rainbows. I thought that much was obvious. - RockX

    Essie - Tr.

  9. #9
    I call tinfoil hat theory on this one, and raise you some math to back it up.

    Using combat analysis auto attacking slugs, time starts when first auto attack goes off and time stops when the last auto attack kills the slug.(note combat analysis records a ~half second delay while you are still in combat but seeing as it was a error across all tests it is ignored) As usual there is a decent amount of error that can occur with these tests but the results do in fact show at least a clear trend. Using only auto attacks slugs would die within the range of 35-42 seconds which proved helpful in data collection as the duration for blood-lust is only 45 seconds.

    I'll post the spreadsheet with the total attacks and time for each trial in a few once I make it more ascetically pleasing to the non-excel friendly folks.

    But the results for attack speed with auto attacks against slugs are as follows;

    Without Quick Strikes or Blood-Lust (Baseline)
    Atk/s: 1.039815

    With Both Quick Strikes and Blood-Lust
    Atk/s: 1.114048

    Blood-Lust Only
    Atk/s: 1.103535

    Quick Strikes Only
    Atk/s: 1.086404


    Blood-Lust and Quick Strikes both decrease atk speed by 10% so statistically they should be the same, but again there is error. But as you can see within reasonable error not having either Quick Strikes or Blood-Lust drops your attacks per second by a noticeable amount, while each individually does in fact increase your atk/s over a base-line value. With both active you would expect a even higher atk/s that what I determined when compared to the single cases but without further testing I can't explain the source of the error with any accurately yet.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080100001acb0c/signature.png]Togrof[/charsig]

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    1,143
    Fire dmg traits makes it even worse

    [Tangaar Captain R 7][Barukhazad Minstrel R 9]

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    855
    My 2cents.

    This problem was brought up at ror launch.
    The quickstrikes make the aoe skills animation look slower then without,
    But the delay between two skills is still the same.

    It was tested on multiple occations.
    Even so, i tested this myself today, and it was feeling like in the launch of ror, so for the qs trait will stay traited!


    The original Valdez

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    678
    Never mind all this, I screwed up.

    Cheers for time all, case closed.

    Now i feel like an &&&. :c
    Last edited by TiberPancake; Jan 30 2013 at 11:57 AM.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    112
    I have also done my own testing and it doesn't quite match up with what has been said here.

    First I used combat analysis as a stop watch and spammed sudden strikes on the light training dummy, When the clock hit hit one minute I turned my character around and stopped my attacks. I did 10 trials with and without quick strikes traited. The results are as follows.

    With Quick strikes traited:
    138 (92/46) Total attacks (sudden strikes/default melee attack)
    138 (92/46)
    138 (92/46)
    138 (90/48)
    138 (92/46)
    136 (90/46)
    138 (92/46)
    138 (92/46)
    138 (92/46)
    138 (92/46)

    Average attack speed 2.296 atk/s

    Without Quick strikes traited:
    146 (98/48)
    144 (96/48)
    144 (96/48)
    144 (96/48)
    144 (96/48)
    146 (98/48)
    142 (96/46)
    144 (96/48)
    144 (96/48)
    146 (98/48)

    Average attack speed 2.406 atk/s

    While it is clear the attack speed is faster, it is not the expected 10%. Instead it's only ~5%.

    I also tested our AE skills as well as ravage (ravage animation appears slower just like the AE skills)
    Again I used combat analysis as a stop watch. I followed the rotation of jagged cut > serration > mutilation > thrash.

    Without quick strikes traited thrash would start at ~5.8/5.9 seconds and would finish at ~6.8/6.9 seconds.

    With quick strikes traited thrash would start at ~5.9/6.0 seconds and would finish at ~7.0/7.1 seconds.

    Adding ravage to the end of that rotation (jagged cut>serration>mutilation>thras h>ravage) the animation finishes before the 9.0 second mark without quick strikes traited and with quick strikes traited the animation doesn't finish until after the 9.0 second mark.

    Even if we assume that through error the AE/ravage skills fire off at the same rate whether quick strikes is traited or not, it shouldn't be that way. They should be firing off quicker.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/03202010000191269/signature.png]Slyc[/charsig]

  14. #14
    there was already a thread about this back when rohan came out, there's nothing wrong with the trait or the skill they both work as they should.

    there are screw ups with the way the animations fire off but it doesn't actually attack slower.
    [IMG]http://img541.imageshack.us/img541/2637/2q6n.jpg[/IMG]

  15. #15
    Just did some testing on this yesterday, and it is indeed still bugged. Quick strikes slows everything by 10%, and Blood Lust slows AoE skills by 10%.
    ~Rank 11 Loremaster, Landroval~

    ~Rank 12 Warg, Landroval~

  16. #16
    Quick strikes and blood lust are only bugged some of the time, ie there are certain ways to make them increase your atk duration but most people don't know them, play around with your rotation and test this out and maybe you will see what I am talking about but if you know the way to get them to work they are definitely worth traiting.

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    286
    Seeing the math that people did I have to wonder tho.I've seen this kind of thread back on 85 too.If you unslot Quick Strikes it does indeed LOOK like you hit faster.Considerably faster I mean the eye can spot the difference.But where does the math come from then? o.O Is it really working or is it not?
    Vundrak - Rank 12 Reaver / Corruptpresent - Rank 10 Warleader / Corruptmedicus - Rank 8 Defiler / Kolostomy - Rank 8 Blackarrow : Landroval
    Rognomli - Rank 8 Guardian / Raiker - LvL 100 Minstrel / Lacet - LvL 100 Warden : Arkenstone

  18. #18
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Gramsfoot
    Posts
    1,439
    Nobody mentioned that the Warleader's Aura of Command is also broken, giving +10% attack duration, instead of -10%, which, if you had 5 melee classes in your group might not be so bad, but if you have 1 reaver and then BAs and Weavers, that slows down their attacks too. You all know damn well if this was a bug on freep side, it would have been hotfixed in a day. Remember that time Turbine brokethe hornblower code (that didn't need to be touched anyway), and the hornblower was attacking ther horn? Then instead of actually fixing it, they just gave the horn a reflect to the hornblower would just kill itself over, and over, and over, all day? And then they decided to just remove it, instead of fixing it.
    [img]https://puu.sh/eEtPr/e6936d48fb.jpg[/img]
    [color=darkred]High Chieftan Urukhaithere + Chieftan Vargburz + Commander Annorian + Liutenant Professorbananas[/color]

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    San Diego
    Posts
    438
    The Single target skills are fine, it's the AoE skills are having the opposite affect. I tested this the other morning to make sure.
    [img]http://i.imgur.com/mUZJhh8.png[/img]
    [FYMF squad] Killabees

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    New York
    Posts
    2,205
    Shouldn't this not matter since everything is Fast or Immediate now? I'm pretty sure it does affect the skills despite that, as I tested CotW, and the debuff seemed to work...although it shouldn't have, unless my understanding of Fast skills is wrong?

    "It is wisdom to recognize necessity, when all other courses have been weighed,
    though as folly it may appear to those who cling to false hope."

  21. #21
    There is a pretty interesting thread on attack duration and skill duration in the burglar forums, where someone was wondering if the -attack duration on relics helped his dps.
    link for convenience

    Now if I grasped it correctly... note the if ... a skill lasts as long as the animation of the skill plus a delay factor that comes after the skill.

    Fast skills (which indeed all our melee skills are except for our immediate skills) do not have a post animation delay.

    However, the attack duration does affect animation time.
    Sadly in current case it affects ours adversely and actually slows us down instead of speeding us up.
    [img]http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/222190100001eabd1/signature.png[/img]
    Reaver (r14), Weaver (r8), War leader (r8), BA (r9), Stalker (r7), Defiler (r7)

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    England
    Posts
    678
    this has been an ongoing problem since 75 cap.

    i made this thread 2 years ago

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    8,332
    Quote Originally Posted by TiberPancake View Post
    this has been an ongoing problem since 75 cap.

    i made this thread 2 years ago
    With any luck they'll fix it before another 2 years expires, not holding my breath though.

    Quote Originally Posted by infinitewhimsy View Post
    Shouldn't this not matter since everything is Fast or Immediate now? I'm pretty sure it does affect the skills despite that, as I tested CotW, and the debuff seemed to work...although it shouldn't have, unless my understanding of Fast skills is wrong?
    It's a major detriment in a fight to have these buffs applied and have bleed applications take twice as long before an impale. This is taking into consideration that the first was mostly bypassed by immediates. The worst offender is aura of command, your AOE's become
    absolutely sluggish.
    There may come a time for valor without renown, for those without swords may surely still die upon them.


  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Thorandril View Post
    It's a major detriment in a fight to have these buffs applied and have bleed applications take twice as long before an impale. This is taking into consideration that the first was mostly bypassed by immediates. The worst offender is aura of command, your AOE's become
    absolutely sluggish.
    Actually, that is not true in my combat parses.

    I did a few parses using Moebius92's SkillTimer plugin, doing the same rotation on a target dummy.

    Sudden strikes -> Ravage -> Jagged Cut -> Serration -> Lacerate -> Mutilation -> Thrash

    I tried several combinations, no buffs at all, only quick strike corruption (-10%), only Blood lust(-10%), only Aura(-10%), then QS + BL, QS + Aura, and BL + Aura, and finally all 3 buffs at the same time.

    Denoted the time between skills (that is basically what the plugin returns and should be a good indicator to attack speed)
    * 0 value is just the start of the timer
    Code:
    No buffs:       no buff   QS only    BL only   Aura only        QS+BL     QS+Aura   BL+ Aura        QS+BL+Aura
    Improved SS:  0           0            0           0              0         0           0             0
    Ravage:        1.8905    2.2968     2.2970   2.2969            2.2492   2.2500      2.2495             2.1878
    Jagged Cut:    1.5007    1.9693     1.9688   1.9686            1.9221   1.9219      1.9223              1.8752
    Serration:      1.4995    1.9690     1.9697   1.9687           1.9217   1.9378      1.9217              1.8848
    Lacerate:      1.6872    1.6560     1.6552   1.6665           1.6096   1.6095      1.6094              1.5780
    Mutilation:     1.5001    1.9695     1.9690   1.9686           1.9219   1.9225      1.9206              1.8908
    Thrash:        1.8908     2.2963     2.2968   2.2967           2.2501   2.2498      2.2502              2.1877
    I did a couple of repeats, pretty much similar results all the time.


    Unbuffed the time between skills is shortest, with the odd exception of Lacerate, which actually speeds up with more buffs.
    -10% buffs do pretty much the same, whether its Aura, QS or BL
    [img]http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/222190100001eabd1/signature.png[/img]
    Reaver (r14), Weaver (r8), War leader (r8), BA (r9), Stalker (r7), Defiler (r7)

  25. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2013
    Location
    Greece
    Posts
    286
    Quote Originally Posted by Jacen123 View Post
    Actually, that is not true in my combat parses.

    I did a few parses using Moebius92's SkillTimer plugin, doing the same rotation on a target dummy.

    Sudden strikes -> Ravage -> Jagged Cut -> Serration -> Lacerate -> Mutilation -> Thrash

    I tried several combinations, no buffs at all, only quick strike corruption (-10%), only Blood lust(-10%), only Aura(-10%), then QS + BL, QS + Aura, and BL + Aura, and finally all 3 buffs at the same time.

    Denoted the time between skills (that is basically what the plugin returns and should be a good indicator to attack speed)
    * 0 value is just the start of the timer
    Code:
    No buffs:       no buff   QS only    BL only   Aura only        QS+BL     QS+Aura   BL+ Aura        QS+BL+Aura
    Improved SS:  0           0            0           0              0         0           0             0
    Ravage:        1.8905    2.2968     2.2970   2.2969            2.2492   2.2500      2.2495             2.1878
    Jagged Cut:    1.5007    1.9693     1.9688   1.9686            1.9221   1.9219      1.9223              1.8752
    Serration:      1.4995    1.9690     1.9697   1.9687           1.9217   1.9378      1.9217              1.8848
    Lacerate:      1.6872    1.6560     1.6552   1.6665           1.6096   1.6095      1.6094              1.5780
    Mutilation:     1.5001    1.9695     1.9690   1.9686           1.9219   1.9225      1.9206              1.8908
    Thrash:        1.8908     2.2963     2.2968   2.2967           2.2501   2.2498      2.2502              2.1877
    I did a couple of repeats, pretty much similar results all the time.


    Unbuffed the time between skills is shortest, with the odd exception of Lacerate, which actually speeds up with more buffs.
    -10% buffs do pretty much the same, whether its Aura, QS or BL
    It could be just visual.Besides the actual differences in delay here which don't make any sense to me but I guess couple of 0.1 or 0.2 miliseconds aren't really a big issue.But there is an increase from no buffs right?Even if a small one it is an increase when it should be an actual decrease.If your tests are right then if you combine the buffs together the increase is just minimal.Without the buffs however some skills increase to 0.5.That's almost half a second...Anyways I would really like to see a dev respond to this,very controversial topic and I'd love to know if I should kick quick strikes out or not.
    Vundrak - Rank 12 Reaver / Corruptpresent - Rank 10 Warleader / Corruptmedicus - Rank 8 Defiler / Kolostomy - Rank 8 Blackarrow : Landroval
    Rognomli - Rank 8 Guardian / Raiker - LvL 100 Minstrel / Lacet - LvL 100 Warden : Arkenstone

 

 
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

This form's session has expired. You need to reload the page.

Reload