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  1. #1

    What freeps and creeps bring to a fight

    Well due to being requested to make this, while also having a lot of discusions on these forums comparing skills and sides i'm going to make a full list to what each side brings.
    I will most likely not be comparing DPS and Healing, much of that depends on a player by player base and how one builds his/her class.


    Allright, knowing how long these posts are going to be i'm gonna start with debuffs(these do not incluide slows those i consider more as CC):
    (note class debuffs stack with other class debuffs if you weren't entirely sure)
    Also note, some things may be missing, it's a really huge list with , and i may have missed some, if you know of any i missed out or repeated let me know, if your wondering what skills make this happen ask me.

    Keep in mind, for many freep debuffs or CC it might say “if traited”
    These are 2 seperate list, in no way I'm stating you can have everything at the same time, sometimes traiting for debuffs might not be effective as much as other traitline etc.
    I will NOT be incluiding class items, such as hunter chants etc

    Creeps



    Spiders:
    • -7% miss chance
    • +30% attack duration
    • +30% induction time
    • -10% BPE(stops with running out of range or CCIng the spider)
    • -1700 resist chance
    • -10m range on skills if skills are above 20m (this is an AOE cooldown)
    • -325 agility

      Reavers:
    • -3.7K Block and parry if traited(cooldown)
    • +20% miss chance (AOE 30s duration 60s cooldown)
    • 5S disarm 5s duration(potable) 1M cooldown
    • -3.5K armor value
    • -50% incoming healing 15s duration 30s cooldown

      Wargs/stalker debuffs:

      Shadow
    • +40% skill power cost(+35% with trait)
    • -3.3Kish physical/tactical mit's rating(hotspot stacks with other wargs cooldown) adds lower debuff(644i) when leaving the hotspot
    • +10% incoming melee/ranged damage
    • -10m range on skills if skills are above 20m(stealth only)
    • -687BPE
    • -3777 parry +25% induction time
    • +25% skill inductions +25% attack duration (AOE)
    • -10% outgoing damage (30s duration 60s cooldown)

      Flayer
    • +25% skill inductions +25% attack duration (AOE)
    • +10% incoming melee/ranged damage
    • -10% outgoing damage (30s duration 60s cooldown)
    • -687BPE*2
    • -10m range on skills if skills are above 20m
    • -3777 parry Rating +10% attack duration
    • +40% skill power cost(+35% with trait)
    • +33% attack duration (10s duration 1M cooldown)
    • Flayer root sets all BPE's to 0% chance for 10s

      Flayer brute chance
      In flayer some of your skills have addicional "brute" effect chance, which by default is 5% chance, the brute skill adds 20% for 30s with 45s cooldown
    • +50% induction time
    • -25% incoming healing
    • -1417 armor rating

      Defilers:
    • -365 Fate
    • -4K Tac mastery
    • -365 Might
    • -365 vitality
    • -3464 Armour Value
    • -25% outgoing healing
    • +5% incoming damage
    • -50% incomming healing(hotspot -75% if traited)
    • +20% induction time
    • +20% miss chance(flies)

      BA's:
    • -600 armor value stacks with other BA's (ranged attack)


      War-leaders
      (these are all cooldown banners)
    • -3777 resistance
    • -1531 Physical/Tactical mitigations.
    • -365 might
    • -4K Tac mastery
    • -500ish ICMR/ICPR
    • -10% damage

      That's it for creeps now it's time to look at the freeps:

      Freeps




      LM Debuffs
      (note i know several raid LM's who actually trait yellow-line, i'll put in both with and without it)
      These are Red-line:
    • -30% melee damage
    • +2% miss chance
    • -50% ranged damage
    • +30% attack duration
    • -20% tactical damage
    • -2295 amor value
    • -10% fire mitigations
    • +10% incomming tactical damage
    • -900 crit rating

      (if you use the raven)
      Add -50% ranged damage (single target)
      Add -10% fire mits (single target)
      (if your using the bear)
      Add +10% incomming melee and ranged damage every 30s with a 60S cooldown(single target)

      note: most of these red-line or blue-line debuffs are on 30s duration and 60s cooldown the way they are traited.
      All but the crit rating debuff are AOE, the fire mit's and incomming tactical damage are hotspots

      If yellow-line traited all these are ADDED to the debuffs, while all debuffs can be on 24/7
    • +8% miss chance
    • -10% ranged damage
    • -5% tactical damage
    • +50% induction time

      With the moors set they also have an AOE silence 10S duration 1M cooldown
      if they have the set-bonus from the moors

      And before you think, -110% ranged damage is imposible then your wrong.
      Also tactical ranged attacks like spider dots are affected by both the ranged damage and the tactical damage, so LM's can reduce spider/defiler damage by -135% or BA's by 110%

      Burglar debuffs
      (note most are single target)
      Tricks(these can only have 1 per burg but they stack with multiple burgs)
    • -20% miss chance
    • +15% Attack Duration -15% Melee Damage -1700finesse
    • -680 BPE +3% incoming critical chance(+6% in total if traited)
    • +5% incoming ranged damage

      Non-tricks(stacks with tricks)
    • +25% induction time (+75% if legacy and yes stacks with LM's for +125% induction time healers love it)
    • +8% incoming damage (10% if traited stacks with other burgs)

      Gambling burglar (yes they are around)
    • +3% incoming damage
    • +10% attack duration

      If they get a T6 gamble debuff off:
    • +20% miss chance, +40% attack speed, -30% damage

      And these stack with tricks

      They also have a single target silence for 10s with a minimum of 15s cooldown(note not being a gambling burglar will mess this up quite a bit)


      Captain debuffs:

      Marks(note only 1 mark per captain, single target the same marks do NOT stack with other captains these are toggles and on 24/7)
    • +5% incomming damage(+10% with legacy which each captain has)
    • 15% morale return on damage, meaning if you do 1000 damage on the target with that you get 150morale healed

      If you use the correct moors armor set you can have:
    • +5% incoming damage on a single target or
    • -35% incoming healing AOE however this has a small cooldown which outlasts the duration

      I almost forgot:
      +35% incoming damage for 10s, 5M cooldown

      Guardian debuffs:
      As far as i know they only have:
    • 25% chance to disarm for 5s on an AOE response, requires a moors set
    • +15% attack duration

      Champion debuffs
      If traited:
    • -1000 armor value, AOE spammable


      Hunters
      They have “some debuffs” but they mostly come from armor sets and as far as i'm aware those are out of moor sets

      All i can think of is a -25% incoming healing with mercifull shot and if yellow-line traited some BPE debuff with pen shot, someone with a high level hunter could add something to this


      Mini's debuffs
    • -1200 light damage mitigation(only works in war speach or with the trait chance on call unlock)

      RK debuffs:
    • -5% fire/lighting/frost mitigation(this one is the RK's choice on which type to apply however removed when the debuff damage applies)
    • +24% All Skills Inductions (a tiering skill at the highest tier)
    • +15% Attack Duration (a Tiering skill at the highest tier)
    • -30% incoming healing
    • +50% power cost

      Warden debuffs:
    • -3740 block chance(small outlasting cooldown)
      With armor sets either:
    • +10% attack duration OR -25% incoming healing which stacks twice


      And that's all the debuffs each side has.
      Now notice this:

      Ministrels can remove up to 3 fears from the fellowship with a low-cooldown skill
      Minstrels using the set-bonus can remove 1 poison, disease fear or wound effect every 2s for 10s(30s cooldown) from anyone
      Captains can remove up to 3 fears from the fellowship with a low-cooldown skill
      Burglars can remove all poison effects from 1 person or themselfs, unless traited which allows a full fellow removal.(requires FULL yellow-line)
      Hunters can remove up to 3 poison while adding resistance to 1 person or the fellow if traited (requires partial yellow-line)
      LM's have a very low cooldown skill to remove 3 wounds or diseases from a target or if traited(only 1 trait) in an AOE of the fellowship

      Champions have a personal fear removal cooldown, and if you have a set have 50% chance on removing 3 effects with bracing attack
      Guardians have a personal wound removal cooldown


      All freeps have the 30s debuff removal pots as well
      Creeps only get the pots mencioned above to remove debuffs, 30S Cooldown 1 debuff and you don't have control over which one removes.
      And notice that debuff removal counts for many DOT's, freeps could trash most of the creep dot's if they know what their doing.

      Allright that sums up debuffs,(took me a few hours lol)


    Ex
    Last edited by MTminas; Jan 29 2013 at 04:04 AM.
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  2. #2
    Allright it's time to compare what each class bring with crowd control, which incluides:
    Stuns, dazes, roots, fears, silences slows, get out of CC skills, speed buffs(ONLY in-combat) and others i may have forgotten to put on the examples
    I am incluiding the times and the cooldowns.
    NOTE(S): all CC is HALVED with audacity, as example a 10s stun is 5S as for roots and dazes those are only 25% so 30s = 7,5s
    I will be posting the duration as they would apply on a R13 audacity freep/creep
    I will NOT be incluiding class items, such as burglar stun dust/marbles hunter traps etc

    Creeps

    Wargs:

    • 2.5s Stun from stealth only 15s cooldown
    • 2.5s FM chance skill 15s cooldown
    • -25% movement speed debuff 30s duration 10 cooldown
    • FM skill
    • 5s stun(in flayer) with a 3M cooldown
    • 10s 2 target silence with 5M cooldown
    • 10s silence with 1M cooldown(in shadow)
    • 50% chance of a 2.5s fear AOE 4 targets
    • 10s unbreakable root(only flayer no armor debuff hotspot)
    • 200% run speed for 20s 5M cooldown (3M if traited)
    • (if traited) +5% passive movement speed

      War-leaders:
    • A “chance” slow(if critical) with a 10s duration for -40%
    • 3s stun with 20s cooldown, cooldown resets with a critical or devestating traited it has +25% chance(which makes it around 35% chance to reset)
    • A CC removal skill 20s cooldown, no immunity given
    • An AOE cc removal skill (if traited provides 3s immunity) 2M cooldown

      Reavers
    • 5s disarm 1M cooldown
    • 15s -25% run speed 10s cooldown(traiting it increases the debuff by 10% and reduces cooldown by 2s)
    • (If traited) -40% run speed for 10s 1M cooldown
    • A skill to pop out of Dazes, Stuns, Fellowship Manoeuvre Stuns, Roots, Knock Downs, and Slows (traiting will add a 5s immunity) 2M cooldown

      Reavers have no dazes, roots, stuns, fears or silences and are the only class without any of them


      Spider:
    • 7.5s daze 30s cooldown
    • 7.5s root 30s cooldown
    • 7.5s AOE root
    • -10% run speed follow up by 7.5s delayed root(requires your spider pet to be alive) 30s cooldown
    • 2.5s FM 5M cooldown
    • 5s delayed stun with 1M cooldown (melee)
    • 5s fear with 10s cooldown (melee)
    • -50% movement speed hotspot for 15s(near the spider) on exiting -50% speed for 10s 1M cooldown
    • +10% passive movement speed

      BA's:
    • 3s stun 20s cooldown(melee)
    • (If traited) 50% chance for a 1.5s ranged stun also applies on crits 30s cooldown
    • (If traited) 3.75s AOE root 1M cooldown
    • 3 snares(1 skill) with -40% movement speed for 30s (if traited +10% speed buff for 10s)
    • 7.5s root (with a trap) 1M cooldown
    • -40% single target speed for 8s, 5s cooldown(+7s duration if traited)

      Defilers
    • -10% running speed 10s, 15s cooldown(if traited +5s duration sets debuff to -20% -560tac mits)
    • 5s fear up to 3 targets 30s cooldown
    • 25% chance for a single target 4s daze 8s cooldown

      Freeps

      Burglar:
    • 4s stun AOE 3 targets 45s cooldown
    • 2.5s FM usuable only from stealth(unless red-line traited) 5M cooldown
    • 2.5s FM 5M cooldown
    • 7.5s daze(usable from stealth without breaking it) 1M cooldown (if right moors set it works on 2 targets)
    • 20% chance on 3s stun skill, with 10s cooldown
    • 7.5s delayed 2 target daze (if traited a 2.5s stun applies before the daze and adds 2 targets) 2M C/D
    • 3.75s root 5M cooldown (if traited doubles the duration, halfs the break chance on damage and reduces the cooldown to 1M [requires full yellow-line])
    • A skill to remove dazed, stunned, knocked down, or knocked out(i may be missing some) from themselfs giving em touch and go a 25% max morale heal, has 5M cooldown


      Captain:
    • -25% run speed 20s duration 20s cooldown
    • 1.5s stun (if traited) it's AOE with a 45s cooldown(lower by 20% with the correct moors set)
    • +25% fellowship speed for 20s(45 if legacy) with the correct moors set, Removes all slows and Gives 5s slow imunity 5M cooldown


      Champion:
    • -30% movement speed 20s duration 4.2 cooldown
    • +25% movement speed + immune to slows 15s duration(45s if legacy) 5M cooldown(3M if traited also adds 1.5s stun on next wild attack)
    • 1.5s AOE stun 20s cooldown
    • 2.5s AOE stun 15M cooldown(+2.5s if legacy)
    • Skill to allow them to break all CC no cooldown but costs 10% of max morale
    • (if traited) Toggle skill allowing no CC besides slows, constant morale cost while active


      Guardians
    • -25% Target Run Speed duration 15s cooldown 5s(must be behind oponent or crit to apply)
    • A skill that when dazed, stunned, knocked down, or knocked out removes it and does an 2.5s FM stun 5M cooldown(-1M 30S if legacy)
    • Skill that sets speed at 150% for 7s(+10s if traited) while no slows apply 2M cooldown
    • 1.5s stun 5s cooldown(this is a response skill)
    • 1.5s Stun 5s cooldown(ONLY applies if crit)
    • +15% movement speed 10s duration 5s cooldown(requires legendary trait and a retaliation response)

      Hunters:
    • -50% speed AOE 3 targets melee attack 10s duration 5s cooldown
    • 1.25s melee daze 1M cooldown(-10s if traited)
    • 2.5s ranged daze 3M cooldown(if traited [requires full yellow-line] +5s duration -50% cooldown)
    • 5s fear 1M cooldown(should only work on spiders/wargs if it works at all someone verify pls )
    • 7.5s fear Ranged 30s cooldown(requires legendary trait)
    • 7.5s Root ranged AOE 5 target 3M cooldown(requires legenday trait)
    • Ranged -40% movement speed skill, no cooldown 8s duration(requires power stance)
      I am missing cry of the hunter here


      Rune-keepers
    • 1,25-2.5s daze 20s cooldown (if traited +1.25s duration)
    • -50% run speed AOE skill 10s duration 3M cooldown(-30s cooldown if traited)
    • -50% run speed for 10s, removed on damaging 30s cooldown
    • Stun chance for 2.5s every 20s
    • On damaging the RK -30% run speed for 5s, buff lasts 20s cooldown 3M


      Warden
    • 0.5s root + -30% run speed, 20s duration 45s cooldown(if traited -15s cooldown)


      Minstrel
    • -30% movement speed, 3target AOE 15s duration 1M cooldown(if traited 3-red's cooldown to 30s)
    • Near 70ish% chance of a 2.5s ranged stun 30s cooldown(requires a trait for the stun chance and war-speach active to reach 70ish%)
    • 7,5s fear 30s cooldown
    • +10% fellowship speed buff for 10s cooldown 30s Only available in WS (Note radius is ONLY 5m)

      Lore-master
    • -30% movement speed for 30s, 3s cooldown
    • 7.5s AOE delayed root, 10s cooldown
    • 7.5s AOE root 30s cooldown
    • 1.5s stun 30s cooldown(if traited 4 red-line -15s cooldown)
    • 3s AOE stun 5M cooldown(requires legendary, if traited red cooldown reduced by 3M)
    • 2,5s stun 1M cooldown(if red-line -15s cooldown)
    • 7.5s daze 30s cooldown(note if traited red decreases duration to 3,75s)
    • 3.75s AOE daze 1M cooldown
    • -50% movement speed AOE hotspot 1M duration 1M 30S cooldown(1M if traited, note this DOESn'T stack with other slows)
    • A skill that cures dazed, knockdown, knock-out, silence, and stunned effects, provides
      inmunity to dazed, knockdown, knock-out, and stunned effects.
      30s duration 5s cooldown (if traited +30s duration -2s cooldown, if legacy +30s duration)


    If there are any other requests of comparison, any questions about what skills i'm refering to, feedback or things i missposted let me know

    Ex
    Last edited by MTminas; Jan 29 2013 at 04:13 AM.
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  3. #3
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    100
    Just a some changes on the defiler points i've got:

    Defilers
    -10% running speed 10s, 15s cooldown(if traited +5s duration -560tac mits)
    5s fear up to 3 targets 30s cooldown
    25% chance for a single target 4s fear 8s cooldown
    The 10% can be traited to 20% instead of 15% and the tact mit debuff was changed to -644 (was updated)

    And the 25% chance for a single target CC is a 8s Daze not fear.

    Defilers:
    -325 Fate
    -325 Will
    -325 Might
    -325 vitality
    -2,892 Armour Value
    -25% outgoing healing
    +5% incoming damage
    -50% incomming healing(hotspot -75% if traited)
    the Will was changed to Tactical Mastery in update 9 (ninja change wasn't noted in update notes)
    It now sits as:
    -4000 Tactical Mastery

    all stat values were changed to -365 might/vit/fate

    And the Armour was upped to 3464.6

    Defilers also have a +20% all skill induction debuff 30 second duration and 15s CD

    I know WL banners took the same hit on Will changing to Tactical Mastery however i do not know what value they have.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Talizar View Post
    Just a some changes on the defiler points i've got:



    The 10% can be traited to 20% instead of 15% and the tact mit debuff was changed to -644 (was updated)

    And the 25% chance for a single target CC is a 8s Daze not fear.



    the Will was changed to Tactical Mastery in update 9 (ninja change wasn't noted in update notes)
    It now sits as:
    -4000 Tactical Mastery

    all stat values were changed to -365 might/vit/fate

    And the Armour was upped to 3464.6

    Defilers also have a +20% all skill induction debuff 30 second duration and 15s CD

    I know WL banners took the same hit on Will changing to Tactical Mastery however i do not know what value they have.
    Ah thanks, I've updated the list, i logged onto my WL to verify and the will has changed to 4K tac mastery

    Ex
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  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by MTminas View Post
    Wargs/stalker debuffs:[*]-3Kish armor rating(hotspot stacks with other wargs cooldown) adds lower debuff(600ish) when leaving the hotspot
    This is actually -3315 phys/tact mits, not armor rating. The lower debuff is -563 phys/tact mit (may be different per person, but I don't think it is).

    Also, you should make shadow/flayer notes in the first section since all of those don't have the same effect based on stance.
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  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Samus1111111 View Post
    This is actually -3315 phys/tact mits, not armor rating. The lower debuff is -563 phys/tact mit (may be different per person, but I don't think it is).

    Also, you should make shadow/flayer notes in the first section since all of those don't have the same effect based on stance.
    Updated the list, just logged in my warg to verify the lower debuff and it's 644
    Separated the notes

    Ex
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  7. #7
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    France
    Posts
    749
    'Ministrel' is not a class.
    [size=1]Freeps (Snowbourn): [b]Equanor (R11 MNS)[/b] - Equendil - Orlo - Equadoc - Quaolin - Oshia - Kaolin - Equaric - Equorn
    Creeps (Snowbourn): Veloch (R9 RVR) - Velrow (R10 BA) - Velkro - Oruk - Velrot - Velreth
    Author of the [url=http://tiny.cc/2zm50w]Legendary Item Planner[/url], [url=http://tiny.cc/m1m50w]Bootstrap[/url] and [url=http://tiny.cc/41m50w]Baruk[/url] plugins.[/size]

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Texas
    Posts
    53
    The warleader's menacing roar gives -383 tact mit. It's an aoe with a 30 sec duration. CD varies with stance/traits.
    [URL=http://s1369.photobucket.com/user/Legofil/media/lotrourukmambasig2r13_zps05a09c4b.jpg.html][IMG]http://i1369.photobucket.com/albums/ag212/Legofil/lotrourukmambasig2r13_zps05a09c4b.jpg[/IMG][/URL]
    Meneldor (retired RoI) - Legofil R10 HNT, Falahir R8 CPT, Anticredit R7 Warg
    Vilya - Urukmamba R13 WL, Legofail R10 BA, Orckamikaze R9 RVR, Hurine R8 Champ

  9. #9
    reavers dev strike gives -50% inc healing. didnt see that in there i dont think
    Lugbur, R11 Reaver ./. Guthfred, R9 Captain ./. Guthblade, R9 Chamption ./. Muzluck, R9 Warg + Various other toons of different rank and class.

 

 

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