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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wartober View Post
    Tell me another story.
    Reality check: Freeps aren't the only ones who experience lag.

  2. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by l4j View Post
    Reality check: Freeps aren't the only ones who experience lag.
    Reality check: Creeps don't experience NEAR the lag freeps do.

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wartober View Post
    Reality check: Creeps don't experience NEAR the lag freeps do.
    [citation needed]

    Seriously. We've been over this. Show something other than QQ that it affects Freeps worse than Creeps in the Moors. There is anecdotal "evidence" from both sides, none of which is proof.

  4. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by l4j View Post
    [citation needed]

    Seriously. We've been over this. Show something other than QQ that it affects Freeps worse than Creeps in the Moors. There is anecdotal "evidence" from both sides, none of which is proof.
    what would that proof entail?

  5. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wartober View Post
    what would that proof entail?
    Good question. The problem is that to show it's worse for one side than the other, the data has to be gathered from both sides during the same "incident", and there should be multiple times when the data is gathered to show repeat-ability.

    Basically, one FRAPS session showing one side or the other getting lagged out isn't enough. Ideally, it would be same fight, both sides, multiple sources. Then repeated over time, from different servers.

    I'm not saying (nor have I ever said) that Freeps don't suffer lag. What I'm saying is that you're making a blanket statement that it is always worse for Freeps, and we can find enough anecdotes from both sides to make a blanket statement like that questionable.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by l4j View Post

    Basically, one FRAPS session showing one side or the other getting lagged out isn't enough. Ideally, it would be same fight, both sides, multiple sources. Then repeated over time, from different servers.
    ROFL.

    Go play a freep in npcs in raid vs raid take the goggles off and see for yourself.

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wartober View Post
    ROFL.

    Go play a freep in npcs in raid vs raid take the goggles off and see for yourself.
    About the answer I expected, unfortunately. You asked for a way to prove the point, and I replied. To which you laugh and respond with, essentially, "Go get more anecdotes."

    I play both sides. More on Freep side, in fact, after RoR. I've seen it from both sides, which is why I'm calling you on making the blanket statement. I've been in Raid v Raid. In and out of NPC's. Small groups. Solo. Both sides. Sorry you don't want to accept that other people's experience conflicts with yours.

    But, given the general tone of your responses here and elsewhere, including your response earlier in this thread, when you basically blew off someone who experienced worse lag creepside, I'm just going to step out and let you enjoy your view.

    No Wargie Snax(tm) for you though.

  8. #33
    Creeps do get the same lag. Though in my experience playing both sides the difference is occasional to my creep and almost always for my freep. I think it's important to note that my creep usually raids 18deep and my freep 12deep. So even though the potential for lag is greater for me on creep it doesn't lag at all except on rare occasion. Also noteworthy, my creep and freep are on different servers. My creep is on one of the new servers.

    For a non anecdotal test you can always check the same areas on both sides and check your frames. I tend to get double the frames on creep in the same areas. (turn off sync to refresh so you can get over 60fps)
    Last edited by Armitas; Jan 09 2013 at 07:09 PM.

  9. #34
    Speaks to the sad state of the moors, when we have factions arguing over who lags worst

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by l4j View Post
    [citation needed]

    Seriously. We've been over this. Show something other than QQ that it affects Freeps worse than Creeps in the Moors. There is anecdotal "evidence" from both sides, none of which is proof.
    That's the response I expected from someone with their head in the sand. If you refuse to acknowledge the fact that the lag is worse on freep side than creep side (especially because you "claim" to play on freep side) , you're just as ridiculous as the op is. Anecdotal evidence or not, any person who plays both sides can clearly see the disparity between the two.

    If you can't, I truly could care less.

    Besides, even getting evidence lag is worse on one side than the other is an incredibly worthless task to waste your time doing. Maybe when this game was worth playing and fighting to save I would have done it, but I'm beyond empathy or even giving this game a second glance.
    Last edited by Penionn; Jan 09 2013 at 07:55 PM.

  11. #36
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    Nov 2010
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    Cool

    i think audacity may contrubute to the imbalance as well. for a rank 15 freep/creep who has all audacity fighting someone with no or little audacity, it will most likely go to the one with more audacity, depending on what class each are..wich is generaly the higher rank, unless a high rank ground audacity for a low rank alt. that said, that gives the higher rank an atvantage against low ranked players, that seem fair, the one whos been playing for 3 years deserves to win against somone who just started... but its still imbalance. so my suggestion is to replace audity gear with gear that just has good stats, might,vit,agility etc etc etc. and for creeps...well i know id be happy to have the spare coms for my skills other than saveing them for audacity. id even more so perfer no coms, just coins. and pvp gear would just have rank requirments, just like creep skills

  12. #37
    on Snowbourn same story every day .......
    red map ....freeps raid starting , with full raid we take LC and ID and few OP's .
    after , we go to TR or Luga where craid waiting ( or not ) and we start fighting ; in a few minutes we get LAG skills and no1 can fight or move .........all fraid WIPE .
    Fraid disbanded and after few minutes map is red again .
    GV pew pew starting...

    RvR is not possible after ROR because
    1. LAG everytime
    2. on big servers like Snowbourn we have 40+ freeps VS 80+ creeps
    3. OP buffs help in 95% of time only the creeps
    4. Defilers ( and fly) , spiders and reavers are more than OP .

  13. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by avengingbananaslug View Post
    How about instead of constantly telling freeps to learn to group, creeps learn to solo and small group? You all are strong enough now, it's ok you can do it. Dying isn't permanent.
    on vilya almost every creep is solo. But the second they are being attack by a freep, they call it out in ooc, and run to the nearest map point (mostly hitting a mord brand too)


    Quote Originally Posted by Woromis View Post
    4. Defilers ( and fly) , spiders and reavers are more than OP .
    I play(ed) a defiler and tbh defiler isnt that op as most people think. Only average people QQ about their OPness. (you dont feel op anymore?)

    I do agree with spiders being op. On Vilya all the new spiders used to be freep during RoI

    And LoL at reavers being op, 95% of the reavers are freavers and you have to admit that they really needed some sort of buff.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Woromis View Post
    4. Defilers ( and fly) , spiders and reavers are more than OP .
    Typical i can´t faceroll them anymore=must be OP or even worse Godmode!

  15. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bazkanaggi View Post
    Typical i can´t faceroll them anymore=must be OP or even worse Godmode!
    I agree that reavers are not god-mode, altho they are OP against classes that can't self heal.

    Weavers are over the top. Most of the freep classes can't even fight back. I have friends that play spiders and they are saying that its fun for a while, but after some point its boring. The only classes that can counter weavers are good wardens and good RK's, and maybe LM's if they know what they are doing and keeping debuffs and water lore up all time. All other classes wont kill an experienced spider.

    About defiler flies lolololol.
    That skill is one of the most overpowered things moors have even seen.. It was counterable before RoR, but after is laughable unballanced. Every reasonable player knows that.

    But keep on trolling

  16. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by Yelloweyedemon View Post
    About defiler flies lolololol.
    That skill is one of the most overpowered things moors have even seen.. It was counterable before RoR, but after is laughable unballanced. Every reasonable player knows that.

    But keep on trolling
    i dont see the problem, in RoI flies had 12k moral(?) and in RoR they got 9k moral. So are you stating that they got buffed or that freeps dps got nerved?

    the only time i see flies as an OP skill is during a 1v1, but most freep classes got a power regen skill anyway.

  17. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by ulza View Post
    .....
    I play(ed) a defiler and tbh defiler isnt that op as most people think. Only average people QQ about their OPness. (you dont feel op anymore?)

    I do agree with spiders being op. On Vilya all the new spiders used to be freep during RoI

    And LoL at reavers being op, 95% of the reavers are freavers and you have to admit that they really needed some sort of buff.
    you little creep
    for RvR defilers is most op class after ror and playing a reaver is just another new troll session but stronger .

    I played my class in moors from may 2009 , I fight against good spider and reaver rank 10+ for almost four years and was fifty fifty chance for me and for her , but now the same creeps kill me in a few seconds without any scratch .
    I'm raid leader and I know what is a good fight RvR , but what happens in moors is too far .....never been so unbalanced .

  18. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Woromis View Post

    you little creep

    I'm raid leader and I know what is a good fight RvR , but what happens in moors is too far .....never been so unbalanced
    So you're telling me that the moors was more balanced in RoI? Dont get me wrong i prefered RoI over RoR since there was solo play and rank ment something.

    At the moment the only unbalanced thing i see is the creep:freep population. There are 2 reasons for that:
    1 new content = people want to gear up and might/will return once there is nothing to do but End-game raids.
    2. people leaving or going from freepside to creepside.

    since there is no perfect solution for these problems, i would just wait a few more months and maybe then you can start complaining

  19. #44
    While this unbalance generally has its own reasons on a server to server basis, I can speak a bit bout DD's status as of now OP.

    On DD, the freep who is most likely to quit / shun the moors are the ez-modders. The kind of people who have grown up in ranks by either being a part of the Ainur zerg or piggybacking on the Ainur zerg. Those kind of people know nothing but facerolling creeps in the moors and once it became hard to farm reknown with such ease, they throw up their hands and quit.
    And by saying that, I am not criticizing all the freeps on DD since there are many good players on the blue side, but I reckon the majority of the "lotro diehards" you are referring to might fall in the ez-modder category. There are not too many solid freep players left on this server and fewer freep leaders. But all I see is the irony in this, since I remember times when certain freeps would camp grams and hoarhallow all day and farm any greenie who dared venture out, enough to make 90% of the creep population quit. What goes around, comes around, but sadly all this excessive farming (by both sides) has only harmed the pvmp on DD IMHO. You can wait till freeps become OP again, and I bet you many will come flocking back to the moors, if they havent already transfered servers to greener pastures.

    As for the general reasoning, yea Turbine have again shown a lack of foresight. They reduced comms cost to acquire creep audacity but dint give the newbie freep who has freshly stepped into the moors with 0 audacity the same treatment of gaining audacity just as quickly. While it would be easier for freeps to still rank up audacity from 0 to cap on a highly populated server, on DD this doesnt translate well when the majority of the ez-modders up and quit the moors and the new guy is left to struggle while being cannon fodder for the majority of his time in the moors.
    They have added yet another gating mechanism with this audacity-comms bull&&&& by making PvMP a massive painful grind to gain the armour set/skill-set that makes you viable enough to participate in PvMP...after PvMPing enough to PvMP without all the excessive dying and ragequitting...so that you can enjoy PvMP...? Its not in the insta-kill/access denied form of Radiance but this Audacity gating is still an Imperfect Circle that is a very, Very poorly implemented system trying to mimic another game that launched with a similar mechanism.


    On a brighter note, they keep speaking bout the "Pendulum Swinging" and all that BS. So I can only guess that the next instance cluster will contain some Very powerful items to even the odds or even tip it in the Freeps' favour. They wont keep their freep subscribers unsatisfied for too long, you know.

  20. #45
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    Jun 2011
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    greece/Preveza
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    264
    all we know ,turbine dont mind about moors from freep side.want only money,dont care about players of course,with 500 tp can play lifetime at moors by the feep side.very fair and balance for a fun tolkien freep player.(lol).

    we play 6 years that game,and all we know, lotro pvp every day lost players.simple.

    in my server every day freeps they stop to play,for the unbalance numbers every day,or for the clubber who turbine dont make nothing too.

    we have players who rank from rank 0-11 in 1 week,we make many reports,and the answer? this is not forbiten.lol.

    lotro isnt for pvp.lotro is the best pve!

    if want pvp,with fair suport,change game better.that i have to say,in my playtime in lotro ,from 17/5/2007.-

  21. #46
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    Oct 2012
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    221
    Quote Originally Posted by l4j View Post
    About the answer I expected, unfortunately.
    What else would you expect? That I'd say ok and run all and start some huge frapsing campaign to prove a point to some random guy on the internet that something ridiculously obvious is happening?

    That's stupid.

  22. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by Thorgrum View Post
    However it is server specific but the issue is a bit more complex then "creeps learn to solo". The creep has 3 choices to get his rank/skills. Solo, group, or the store, two of which occur in a PvP zone. Freeps dont have to worry about that, they can rank and get their full compliment of skills in the safety of the PVE zones.
    Soloing can happen on creepside too even at low ranks. I have done it on all my creeps from the start and while I die quite often I do get lots of kills even at the start and have learned how to play my creeps much better through dying then I would have if I logged in and asked if a raid were active like I see a lot of creeps (and to be fair, freeps too) do. However, soloing isn't for everyone and some people like the community, but that is what small group is for. There still doesn't need to be the constant raid and warg pack like there is now. I'm not an absolute solo purist, but what I hate seeing is creeps raiding when there isn't an equivalent freep group and then telling freeps they should just group themselves. And yes, freeps do it too. It's just right now more common on creepside.

    You talking about R6+ creeps? Ok legit comment, anything lower then that and well id disagree. Not every creep out there is store bought, a lot of the VIP freeps who have flipped are. The other aspect of it is culture, this is one of the first periods in a long time where a ranked creep can actually solo and survive (not just wargs). I see some on my server, but the norm is raiding up cant dispute that.
    While I agree the balance before was off, I do disagree creeps couldn't solo before and survive. Besides wargs, defilers and BAs especially were able to do very well against freeps in solo fights. Now a lot more can.

    It's also not just freeps flipping. Wargs are the worst about it, but two of the biggest zerg creep leaders on Silverlode are creep only. In addition, to refute some claims that creeps are more organized, those leaders lead pretty bad raids with awful target calling, they just dominate a lot because they won't go out if they don't have a huge #s advantage.

    Now there are several raid leaders who can beat freep groups with even to superior #s pretty regularly, but they also are freep players too who can do the same to creeps. I don't see that creeps have inherently better group management, some people are just more skilled than others and that shows through on either side.

  23. #48
    It's been more Grams than GV on Meneldor.

  24. #49
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    Nov 2010
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    17

    Red face

    on dwarrowdelf, things are looking up ATM,(beginging to get tr/lugz occionaly even ta) not all at once of course. but the one thing that bugs me more than any thing else is warg hips/sprint and burg hips, who wants to fight someone who will just run away like a baby if/when they loose, especialy if they start the fight, then wimp out. spiders burrowing is also rather frusterating, tho i cant kill an OP spider or get him close enough to burrow, unless there a low rank. that is what makes a warg pack so annoying, as a ward i can stand a chance even against high ranks blowing DC and spam self heals, but i dont kill them, they just run off and i move to the next target and so on if i survived that long. but over all the lag has gotten more KB's on me than creeps LOL. >>>>> LAG= #1 CC <<<<<<<<<< my computer isnt running off kryptonite but even so i shouldnt lag THIS bad. TBH my computer kinda sucks, but i never had lag in RoI pvp or outside of pvp now.
    Last edited by Range; Jan 18 2013 at 02:53 AM. Reason: typo

  25. #50
    Well i agree with some things, i disagree with other things.
    Freeps aren't forced to stay at GV, there is the safe way to OR and you can get directly into the delving.
    I disagree with the comms cost on audacity, sure the first 7 ranks are easy to get, the rest costs 6K each.
    Freeps get 2 audacity per piece, the second you get 3 pieces it's really fast, cos the other 3 give you 2 audacity as well for an average of 6K o piece.

    Solo play is dying due to both sides making mistakes.
    As creeps i'll see wargs calling out freeps that are riding solo instead of jumping them.
    They prefer to get 5 people and zerg em, instead of soloing them.
    When i'm on my creep i'm always trying to solo, however freeps tend to run away from me, when i follow them i end up zerged....

    Turbine isn't to blaim for the playstyle of freeps/creeps just unbalanced classes or lag....

    Ex

 

 
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