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  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Thorgrum View Post
    Wargs got nerfed in the last update. Ive played a warg now for a while, before it was FOTM, while it was and now after. One of the underlying themes of RoR is the necessity to group in the moors, wargs are no exception and freeps should be careful what they wish for. They should want wargs to run more solo they will be easier to kill as wargs are still squishy. Even if you go full mitigations and morale you give up so much damage you'll be out lasted.

    You should expect more warg nerfs in the future, its an easy target (like burgs were) and freeps are QQing a lot these days. So warg packs it is.
    The easiest wargs have it, the more of them there are, the least likely you are to be jumped by a single warg as a freep. All that happened during early Mirkwood (a major FOTM warg era) on my server is that warg packs frequently turned into warg raids.

    First thing you can expect as a lone freep when a warg pounces you is at least two other wargs. Timeless rule.

    The vast majority of the few solo wargs will also just disappear or sprint away should they lose anyway, especially now that the cooldowns are so stupidly short, so good luck finding freeps who even care anymore.
    Last edited by Equendil; Jan 02 2013 at 03:06 PM.
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  2. #27
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by Equendil View Post
    The easiest wargs have it, the more of them there are, the least likely you are as to be jumped by a single warg as a freep. All that happened during early Mirkwood (a major FOTM warg era) on my server is that warg packs frequently turned into warg raids.

    First thing you can expect as a lone freep when a warg pounces you is at least two other wargs. Timeless rule.

    The vast majority of the few solo wargs will also just disappear or sprint away should they lose anyway, especially now that the cooldowns are so stupidly short, so good luck finding freeps who even care anymore.
    I dont look for freeps who care, engaging freeps in meaningful conversation about the moors is mostly a waste of time. The cooldowns on dissapear and sprint are to much, sprint fine but dissapear is over the top IMHO. There were far to many wargs, you'll get no argument from me just like now weavers are everywhere.

    Wargs packing and escaping is exactly how they are supposed to work. The direction from the devs seems pretty obvious they want us to pack. Its the excess of packs and wargs that kill some servers, again the moors is coming down to the population imbalance every side has toons that have aspects of their build that are OP.

  3. #28
    To the OP: not especially.

    Wargs were the nearest creep to being on par with freeps pre-ror. The main reason they feel underpowered now is that the other creeps have seen decent boosts and well deserved some of them were. People were playing wargs too much as they were one of the few viable creep toons during roi.

    It follows that the warg is designed as a scavenger, the payoff for stealth is they are built to hit and run, pack or take down an already wounded opponent. I don't think the main intent of design was ever for them to be roaming the moors taking out most freeps 1v1 or even two freeps, even though this has been possible at times. The flayer change was nice to add suvivability, but its wrong for them to fill the role of "heavies" directly. The changes to crit magnitude defence have helped wargs a fair bit too, and with shadow packs are lethal if the players are smart and aware.

    What hurts wargs mostly nowerdays is the lack of a decent ability to slow. Compared to other slows they are poorly equipped and for a toon totally reliant on melee that smarts. Given slows can be broken or countered with a better slow this can leave the warg struggling to follow up an attack. Burgs can use their heavy cc to counter this, in comparison warg cc is poor.
    "Romper: You have the power to make EM less boring for yourself and everyone else. "
    "Look for your lore. But do not trust to lore, it has forsaken these lands." - Eolore prince of Lorehan

  4. #29
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    Sep 2010
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    Some of you guys claiming to lose against lvl 75 hunters etc? I dont play my rank 6 warg a lot but I can't believe Id ever lose fights against 75s, anyway, wargs are the 'worst' class in comparison to other creeps yes, but I wouldnt say they are underpowered against any freep.
    Good wargs can still beat most freep classes, even good champs, if they use sprint, not to run away but to kite around when champ pops a bubble etc..
    And some high rank warg on my server almost literally crits every hit he does on me, which is about a 1000 hit each time, which is more dps I can do on my burg..

  5. #30
    while I won't say wargs are underpowered... I will say it is easier to win with my r7 reaver, r7 spider. r6 wl against most classes hehe, they are not as strong compared to what they were in roi, but they can still do fine, I am pretty happy with where they are right now. I actually have to really try with warg like I don't have to with some other classes. to comment above mine if warg is critting you for around 1k keep your back away from him and get more auds and mits
    .
    R8 RK, R8 champ, R7 burg, R8 warden. R13 warg, R10 spider, R9 reaver, R8 Warleader R6 BA

  6. #31
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by firehandsjr View Post
    while I won't say wargs are underpowered... I will say it is easier to win with my r7 reaver, r7 spider. r6 wl against most classes hehe, they are not as strong compared to what they were in roi, but they can still do fine, I am pretty happy with where they are right now. I actually have to really try with warg like I don't have to with some other classes. to comment above mine if warg is critting you for around 1k keep your back away from him and get more auds and mits
    with audacity maxed and tact mit around 8000, still crits for 1 k, but you may be right that this is positional damage, not sure though

  7. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldwiley View Post
    To the OP: not especially.

    Wargs were the nearest creep to being on par with freeps pre-ror. The main reason they feel underpowered now is that the other creeps have seen decent boosts and well deserved some of them were. People were playing wargs too much as they were one of the few viable creep toons during roi.

    It follows that the warg is designed as a scavenger, the payoff for stealth is they are built to hit and run, pack or take down an already wounded opponent. I don't think the main intent of design was ever for them to be roaming the moors taking out most freeps 1v1 or even two freeps, even though this has been possible at times. The flayer change was nice to add suvivability, but its wrong for them to fill the role of "heavies" directly. The changes to crit magnitude defence have helped wargs a fair bit too, and with shadow packs are lethal if the players are smart and aware.

    What hurts wargs mostly nowerdays is the lack of a decent ability to slow. Compared to other slows they are poorly equipped and for a toon totally reliant on melee that smarts. Given slows can be broken or countered with a better slow this can leave the warg struggling to follow up an attack. Burgs can use their heavy cc to counter this, in comparison warg cc is poor.
    The thing is, if you read the posts, most people don't want to roam around "taking out most freeps 1v1." It would be nice to be in a position to compete though. The completely stripped the Warg's ability to compete in anyway other than forming a huge group of wargs.

    Quote Originally Posted by burzumaz View Post
    And some high rank warg on my server almost literally crits every hit he does on me, which is about a 1000 hit each time, which is more dps I can do on my burg..
    You are being crit for 1000 every hit by a warg? Are you level 50?
    Last edited by TimidObserver; Jan 06 2013 at 04:09 AM.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0520a00000022f79e/01006/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  8. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by TimidObserver View Post
    The thing is, if you read the posts, most people don't want to roam around "taking out most freeps 1v1." It would be nice to be in a position to compete though. The completely stripped the Warg's ability to compete in anyway other than forming a huge group of wargs.
    Aye, nor do I, and it is nice to play a competative toon; that said, when you say huge 0.o packs, you mean like the 3 or 4 it takes to form a lethal hit and run?

    Yes wargs could benefit from a very small buff; then again the main reason they struggle is that most freeps are grouped or raided and they have healing.

    Spike healing is what prevents the kills most of the time, fixing that would be better than making wargs overly powerful again. RK's, monstrels, cappies and lm's and to a lesser extent defilers and war leaders have command of the thing that most effects all toons, including those stuggling wargs.

    I did read folks posts, but if you buff wargs it won't stop packs, it will make packs stupidly more powerful and therefore fotm, soloing on warg is back to picking off the weak and wounded mostly, we've been there before.
    "Romper: You have the power to make EM less boring for yourself and everyone else. "
    "Look for your lore. But do not trust to lore, it has forsaken these lands." - Eolore prince of Lorehan

  9. #34
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    547
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldwiley View Post
    warg cc is poor.
    That's funny, my rank 7 warg can pop fm stuns around 3-4 per fight. I don't use flayer and as long as I get lucky with crits I can hold my own 1v1 even with no audacity.

    Crippling bite -> pounce = fm at a rate of around 50% (give or take I guess if you are luckier or unluckier) especially with position on your prey. I even suck so bad at warg and only play it when I'm drunk for laughs but I thought that trick was common knowledge.
    What is it? What do you smell?

  10. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by SozuRogberry View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldwiley View Post
    Warg cc is poor.
    That's funny, my rank 7 warg can pop fm stuns around 3-4 per fight. I don't use flayer and as long as I get lucky with crits I can hold my own 1v1 even with no audacity.

    Crippling bite -> pounce = fm at a rate of around 50% (give or take I guess if you are luckier or unluckier) especially with position on your prey. I even suck so bad at warg and only play it when I'm drunk for laughs but I thought that trick was common knowledge.
    Your snip was overly short, I said in comparison to burgs, warg cc is poor. Thats not the same as saying warg cc is poor full stop.

    I was discussing keeping targets with you. Burgs are better placed to do this in conjunction with burst. Once a target gets away from a warg it can either escape or use the distance advantage. The only tool wargs have in this instance is sprint. Thats one thing burgs don't have.

    Crippling bite is pretty poor for the only toon in the game with no ranged capability at all?
    "Romper: You have the power to make EM less boring for yourself and everyone else. "
    "Look for your lore. But do not trust to lore, it has forsaken these lands." - Eolore prince of Lorehan

  11. #36
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
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    547
    Quote Originally Posted by Oldwiley View Post
    Your snip was overly short
    Fair enough, I do have a r10 burg as well so I know all about stun locking and trick kiting melee classes.

    When fighting a cc class I "try" using warg sprint offensively and closing the gap to pop those stuns rather than backing off and bleeding the target. Especially with the new 3 minute cd. If they want to kite a warg? Fine, I'll close that gap. Again I'm not the best warg but wargs do have the skills if you use em to fight instead of escape.
    What is it? What do you smell?

  12. #37
    As a warg if you aren't critting over 1000 on light and medium armor freeps with bestial claws, that difference in damage may be explained by a few mastery corruptions and battlefield promotions, or may be due to the freep stacking mitigations. I regularly see crits over 1000.

    Significantly higher than 1000 if you use your warg puddle. Get the rend up early, pop the battle frenzy, and go to town. Try to get the attack duration buff from maul up as early as possible. Be aware of how silence disrupts the different classes. As has been mentioned, if you can use your sprint offensively to reduce the incoming damage and keep your damage steady it can win you the fight.

    I think shadow stance is really strong, cohesive, and fun. Flayer stance needs some work. Scratch and Snip should do more damage than bestial claws, thats the main thing I'd like to see happen. Warging has been quite fun for me since RoR, but there usually aren't enough freeps most of the time when I log in to do it.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0420800000013320a/signature.png]Rosenthal[/charsig]

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  13. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by Bhurgo_Burglefools View Post
    Warging has been quite fun for me since RoR...
    I bet it's almost as fun as playing your Burg...amirite or amirite?
    Brittain. Fidel. KimJongIl.

  14. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by TimidObserver View Post
    The thing is, if you read the posts, most people don't want to roam around "taking out most freeps 1v1." It would be nice to be in a position to compete though. The completely stripped the Warg's ability to compete in anyway other than forming a huge group of wargs.



    You are being crit for 1000 every hit by a warg? Are you level 50?
    This is positional damage mostly done by bestial claws, if its not positional, its about 600.

  15. #40
    Quote Originally Posted by BrittainTheCommie View Post
    I bet it's almost as fun as playing your Burg...amirite or amirite?
    You are quite right! It has been almost as fun, but not quite.

    My enemies aren't as plentiful.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0420800000013320a/signature.png]Rosenthal[/charsig]

    All of us knob heads miss you Sylidor - R.I.P.

  16. #41
    just from my experience, champions with crazy mits are impossible to solo. im almost always solo on my warg and when i pop out on a champ thats sitting in my shadow pack pee stuff, and i crit them in the back for a 500... something is wrong in my opinion.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/072060100001e3d60/signature.png]Iwrestledabeartwice[/charsig]

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  17. #42
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    Apr 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by djentsogroovy View Post
    just from my experience, champions with crazy mits are impossible to solo. im almost always solo on my warg and when i pop out on a champ thats sitting in my shadow pack pee stuff, and i crit them in the back for a 500... something is wrong in my opinion.
    For a burst damage class the warg dosent really live up to its specs. Ive gone full damage build and done some decent damage but you die very fast even if you flip to flayer. Im okay with dying quickly but being out DPS'd every time (usually on crits) procludes me from taking a lot of solo risks. If I dont think there is a chance to win I dont bother, champs are hard because they can pile on the damage so fast. I solo'd a lot for my first 9 ranks I did as much DPS as I could. Mixed results, stuck to RK's, LM's and hunters when I could.

    Solo feeding was much better in ROI, even though the damage was ridiculous. Its the RvR era now and honestly its become much easier to play a warg IMHO. However I feel you on the solo bit, LM's now are even a pain when the spam water lore and it out heals your DPS.

    Id like more DPS, Im doing OK at R10 but ive always felt wargs need more DPS not more defensive mits.


 

 
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