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  1. #101
    Quote Originally Posted by Fredelas View Post
    It looks like I mixed up the bestowers for the Inhabitants: I and Inhabitants: II quests. I've corrected that in the applicable sections now. Thanks!

    I don't have a burglar or a champion to see if those armour barter prerequisites are still correct, though.
    yeah, unfortunately I ran out of tokens or I'd let you know

    I'll check tonight.
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  2. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reillan View Post
    yeah, unfortunately I ran out of tokens or I'd let you know

    I'll check tonight.
    you don't need to have tokens
    all you need is to check at your class barter NPC what are the requirements for a piece. (in this case [Leggings of the Hytbold Knife])
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  3. #103
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    Wish I could look at the barter and know what things I needed to rebuild, but that doesn't seem to be working for me. At least I can refer to this guide to know what I need to do to make progress on my set.
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  4. #104
    Quote Originally Posted by Lunasa View Post
    you don't need to have tokens
    all you need is to check at your class barter NPC what are the requirements for a piece. (in this case [Leggings of the Hytbold Knife])
    A kind burglar on Brandywine just double checked this for me. The quest prerequisites for the armour were correct, I just got the bestowers mixed up.

  5. #105
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    Thumbs up

    Quote Originally Posted by Fredelas View Post
    All of your characters can rebuild Hytbold completely and get the Thane of Hytbold title. (You also get the Thane of the Eastemnet title for the same quest, but I didn't originally include that in the guide as a nice surprise for players.)

    There's no requirement for a character to rebuild Hytbold to actually wear the armour though, in case you want to purchase it for an alt after rebuilding Hytbold completely on your main character.
    Ah! Thank you, so much! There was rumor going around (at least in my circle) that since you could buy stuff for alts once you rebuilt Hytbold, that only one character per account actually rebuilt it.

    Thanks for the quick reply. This makes deciding who to level first much easier.
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  6. #106
    Quote Originally Posted by Lunasa View Post
    you don't need to have tokens
    all you need is to check at your class barter NPC what are the requirements for a piece. (in this case [Leggings of the Hytbold Knife])
    it doesn't show me when I do it, not sure what you're looking at
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  7. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reillan View Post
    it doesn't show me when I do it, not sure what you're looking at
    Click on the piece of armor. Mouse over the 'barter' button. It'll tell you what you need.
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  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crell_1 View Post
    Click on the piece of armor. Mouse over the 'barter' button. It'll tell you what you need.
    Rather confusing way of doing that. At least I know how to look that up now.
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  9. #109
    Quote Originally Posted by Lenton View Post
    Rather confusing way of doing that. At least I know how to look that up now.
    ditto, yeah.

    I'll still have to wait til I get home to try it, as lotro is frowned upon at work
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  10. #110
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilean-EU View Post
    It would be extremely difficult to make sure that every class has the exact same need what comes to reputation in all cases, especially when you think that there are three armour sets per class. The amount of tokens needed depend which class set you are aiming for: one class set might require more tokens than another set for the same class. Also, you can mix and match, take three pieces from one set and three pieces from another set, which again changes completely the reputation requirements.
    Actually, it wouldn't be at all difficult to make them all exactly even. Could have had the exact same rebuilding requirements for every single class.

    eg, regardless of class:
    set 1 helm build A
    set 1 legs build B
    set 1 shoulders build C

    set 2 helm build G
    set 2 legs build H
    etc etc

    You cannot unlock armour for other characters until the whole if Hytbold is rebuilt, so the only restrictions that are in place are based on whatever arbitrary rules the Dev used for deciding to do it this way, I can't even fathom what the thinking behind the current methodology is. Faction requirements being so dramatically different for some classes is totally uneeded.
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  11. #111
    verified that yes, the Quiet Knife burglar gear is correct
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  12. #112
    Quote Originally Posted by Eriandor View Post
    Actually, it wouldn't be at all difficult to make them all exactly even. Could have had the exact same rebuilding requirements for every single class.

    eg, regardless of class:
    set 1 helm build A
    set 1 legs build B
    set 1 shoulders build C

    set 2 helm build G
    set 2 legs build H
    etc etc

    You cannot unlock armour for other characters until the whole if Hytbold is rebuilt, so the only restrictions that are in place are based on whatever arbitrary rules the Dev used for deciding to do it this way, I can't even fathom what the thinking behind the current methodology is. Faction requirements being so dramatically different for some classes is totally uneeded.
    Given the current distribution of quests (162), reputations (4), standings (2) and an extra NPC for no rep, it would actually be mathematically impossible to have every set and every class require the exact same number of kindred and ally reputations. (Trust me, I did the math on this more than once over the past few months.)

    Hytbold had to fit into the existing framework already established in Eastern Rohan, especially for reputations. It would have been possible to make it "fairer", for example by having each set require two or three kindred standings and one or two ally standings, and each class as a whole requiring exactly three kindred standings and one ally standing.

    However, keep in mind that parity of time in acquiring each individual armour set was never a design goal of Hytbold, at least not as stated by the developers. (I'm not trying to put words in anyone's mouth, but from the obvious disparities, it seems pretty clear.) If I were to try to reverse-engineer the developers' thinking, I'd guess the goals were for all players to:
    1. rebuild the town completely (repetition)
    2. while learning the quest and reputation interactions (discovery)
    3. see the town come to life again (engagement)
    4. pick up their own armour at some point along the way (reward)
    5. pick up armour for alts at the end (bonus)
    From my perspective, the current implementation meets those goals. Personally, I don't find the process to be fun, but I do find it interesting enough to keep my attention, probably even for 44 days.

    I think perhaps Turbine underestimated the competitive drive of some players toward efficiency and gear rewards, which this guide probably (unfortunately) had the effect of magnifying. I'm sure the developers will keep this in mind next time they design max-level activities of this sort.

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fred2011 View Post
    That might be so, but when some classes need kindred x3 for ALL of their sets, and other classed have full sets available with not one piece neeeding kindred, its badly done. I look at this and think that the designer should be going back to the drawing board and reworking some of this. It really should not be possilbe for it to be this lopsided and if this was the best they could do, should have had a reputation requirement to barter for some pieces as well as the building requirement. I don't want it easier, but I do believe it should be fair. Looking at the Hunter and RK requirements (glad I'm not one of them) makes me think the Dev has a bias against them, and has taken bribes from the Warden community.
    lolwut? the warden set that most will get is the single most expensive set in the game, per the numbers listed here. that head-scratcher aside, I do agree with the central point here. but in reality, between the most expensive and the cheapest sets, you're really only talking a difference of 3 or 4 days. not really a big deal.

  14. #114
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    am I correct in reading that there is no vault keeper access available through any repair? this seems like an oversight in design.

  15. #115
    Quote Originally Posted by tomiathon View Post
    am I correct in reading that there is no vault keeper access available through any repair? this seems like an oversight in design.
    There was never an auctioneer or vault-keeper in Hytbold during beta. However, that doesn't mean there couldn't be one now. If you happen to find one, let us know.

  16. #116
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    Hytbold really should have a vaultkeeper and auctioneer. Maybe tied to the Armory?
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  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredelas View Post
    If I were to try to reverse-engineer the developers' thinking, I'd guess the goals were for all players to:
    1. rebuild the town completely (repetition)
    2. while learning the quest and reputation interactions (discovery)
    3. see the town come to life again (engagement)
    4. pick up their own armour at some point along the way (reward)
    5. pick up armour for alts at the end (bonus)
    From my perspective, the current implementation meets those goals. Personally, I don't find the process to be fun, but I do find it interesting enough to keep my attention, probably even for 44 days.
    That is more or less how I see the goals as well. Although I don't have anything against Hytbold as it is (except I would like if it had vault-keeper at least... ). But I am amazed how many people complain about the grinding needed. As for my point of view, this "grind" does not come even close to many other grinds in game, especially from soloers point of view. If I just think about that Draigoch set and those 4/6 "soloable" parts, that could take months to acquire even for one character, by doing same old skirmishes over and over (I was already completed ALL encounter deeds across all skirmishes, with all my 9 characters, so I have ran them enough... ). Or, how one could acquire enough greater empowerment scrolls to max out their LI's. A much bigger grind, unless you don't count buying them from AH or store.

    So to me, Hytbold does not seem to be a grind at all, not even to rebuild the whole town, and I am going to do that with 9 characters eventually... It's the way this "grind" is done: you can do only 5 repeatables per day, you can CHOOSE those 5 out of 16 quests daily, and even most of those chance every day. And one hour is well enough for doing all those 5 quests. Then you can do something else for the rest of the day.

    There has been lot of talk both in beta and live about that 5-quest limit you have every day. Many players want to get rid of that limit, I was also thinking that before, but now that I have been thinking this more, I think it's good that there is a limit. Because when we can do only 5 quests and not, say, all 16 every day, we don't get exhausted so soon. Let's think about skirmishes: many people loved them at first, and did ten or even more skirmishes every day. No wonder the same people were hating skirmishes some time later. I have no doubts about that people would hate these Hytbold repeatables as well if they could do them as many times as they wish per day. Sure, people still can hate them at some point, but now that they can do only 5 per day, and they change as well, that point might come much later...

    This time devs gave soloers a way to acquire raid-level armour set, and although I spent quite some time in beta in Hytbold, and now in live as well, I still think they pulled this off well. The only thing that is hard to find out is the "optimal building route" if you want to do only the absolute minimum repairs needed for your armour, but if the intention is that we build the town fully anyway, then it doesn't matter.
    Last edited by Gilean-EU; Oct 24 2012 at 03:39 AM.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fredelas View Post
    Given the current distribution of quests (162), reputations (4), standings (2) and an extra NPC for no rep, it would actually be mathematically impossible to have every set and every class require the exact same number of kindred and ally reputations. (Trust me, I did the math on this more than once over the past few months.)
    /snip
    Seems you missed my point.

    Lets say we were to take the requirements for one classes armour and copy and paste them onto another classes armour. Repeat for all classes. They now have the exact same requirements for all classes. No difference in builds at all. No variation at all.

    For blueline set, they all have to build the exact same rebuilds, with the same requirements. For redline set they all have to build the exact same rebuilds. etc.

    Doesn't matter which set you take for the original and copy across, as every class has to do all builds before they can unlock for other classes. The difference is that no class has to do more than another to get a full set, the only difference would be that different people would want to work on different sets. If you took the hunter requirements (just chose that as I am familiar with the reqs) and made them apply to all classes, and were to move one of the ally pieces for Huntsman's helm or boots over to a kindred given bestower, every class, and every set would require 3 kindred factions as well.

    The current system of having different builds unlock different pieces on different classes is completely artificial and the ONLY thing it does is make it harder / easier for some classes over others. Nothing else. The premise that every class has to do a different build for a different piece of armour would only come into play if we had access to all vendors without having to complete Hytbold. We don't, so it is not needed in any way, shape or form. I can only assume that at some point in the developement they were not going to have the completion of Hytbold needed to acquire items for other classes, and this is the reason for all the uneeded complexity we see now.
    Last edited by Eriandor; Oct 24 2012 at 05:47 AM.
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  19. #119
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    Great guide
    TYVM

    +1

  20. #120
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    My problem is not with solo players getting raid-worthy sets, not at all.

    It's the fact that there is so much grind *after* getting the sets that bothers me. I'd personally rather see daily quests allowance tripled after your toon is kindred with everyone, or has turned in a certain number of quests to prevent rep accelerators being a part of it, (and, then, likely has all the armour he needs) as opposed to being able to share the armour via shared storage after 44+ days of 5 a day. But, that is likely because I will do the rep grind, and likely complete the town, on four toons because I do that ><

    Ah, well.

    In the meanwhile, the Sutcrofts will be ground to the dirt for housing items on one toon XD

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  21. #121
    excellent guide, thank you.
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  22. #122
    Quote Originally Posted by Eriandor View Post
    Seems you missed my point.

    Lets say we were to take the requirements for one classes armour and copy and paste them onto another classes armour. Repeat for all classes. They now have the exact same requirements for all classes. No difference in builds at all. No variation at all.

    For blueline set, they all have to build the exact same rebuilds, with the same requirements. For redline set they all have to build the exact same rebuilds. etc.
    I see what you mean now, and it would have been a very elegant solution! You're suggesting that only 18 of the 162 quests would be barter action prerequisites.

    However, what we have now is what we have to work with. I think it's very unlikely this will change during Hytbold's lifetime.

  23. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomiathon View Post
    lolwut? the warden set that most will get is the single most expensive set in the game, per the numbers listed here. that head-scratcher aside, I do agree with the central point here. but in reality, between the most expensive and the cheapest sets, you're really only talking a difference of 3 or 4 days. not really a big deal.
    As has been stated repeatedly in the thread, the bottleneck is usually rep, not tokens. Expensive has very little to do with it.

    My Warden set will be completed in 10 days, max, and I won't have to deal with mixing for set bonuses, since there's only 1 set I'm interested in as a tank. Conversely, other characters can take upwards of 25 days. 15 days difference is more what he was talking about when he mentioned Warden bribes, not the "3 or 4 days" you made up.
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  24. #124

    Confused

    I am a bit confused about the token exchange, if you do the quests daily and give the tokens in to rebuild part of the town, how do you then have tokens to barter for your armour? If anyone could clarify I would appreciate it.

  25. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by artblade View Post
    I am a bit confused about the token exchange, if you do the quests daily and give the tokens in to rebuild part of the town, how do you then have tokens to barter for your armour? If anyone could clarify I would appreciate it.
    The tokens are used for both purposes. You'll need to use some of them to rebuild parts of the town, and use some of them for bartering for armour.

 

 
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