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  1. #126
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragnipurake View Post
    Ever heard of "Touch and go"? On a stealth class with HIPS, self-heal and excellent debuff skills?



    1. Improved versions of "disappear" and sprint need to be traited. Not every warg has both.

    2. In a normal fight you have to choose flayer or shadow. You won't have the time to change in between.

    3. HIPS is not warg-only, as well as sprint.

    4. Try to attack a grouped hunter in shadow. Have fun while being repeatedly slowed and stunned.

    5. HIPS can save your hide in <50% of all uses. Usually you have a DOT and or slow on you and pop out of stealth in sight of the fraid. Or you are killed by a hunter/LM with an induction skill.



    So those 2 skills are OP on creeps but not on freeps? But down your freep googles. And please realize that I already mentioned in this thread that I agree with an improved survivability for hunters. Your suggestions with more skill to use on the run are good as well. But both can only be granted with a sacrifice in dps (for survivability) or range (shoots on the run). Otherwise you create just another unbalanced easy-mode freep class.
    ill definitely agree with some of your last comments... I wouldnt want easy mode thats for sure and something as simple as tweaking press onward to be more insta cast was suggested 1000 times for survivablitly the heal is small and shouldnt warrant any dps sacrifice... I would have loved to have that as a starting point...
    Last edited by therealwhizzy; Jul 29 2012 at 12:05 AM.
    work in progress...

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  2. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by therealwhizzy View Post
    ill definitely agree with your last comments... I wouldnt want easy mode thats for sure and something as simple as tweaking press onward to be more insta cast was suggested 1000 times for survivablitly...
    aye but yet again that wont solve all our problems.

    i would happily give up some range or damage to do DPS on the run no doubt.
    that would pretty much fix us up to where we could perhaps be somewhat effective.

    ( yes letting us do our current DPS on the move with insta press onward would make us almost as OP as BA)

    tack on a full revamp of useless / underpowered skills and you got yourself a balanced moors fighter










    will never happen

    fin

  3. #128
    Quote Originally Posted by Lendas View Post
    aye but yet again that wont solve all our problems.

    i would happily give up some range or damage to do DPS on the run no doubt.
    that would pretty much fix us up to where we could perhaps be somewhat effective.

    ( yes letting us do our current DPS on the move with insta press onward would make us almost as OP as BA)

    tack on a full revamp of useless / underpowered skills and you got yourself a balanced moors fighter





    will never happen

    fin
    Id be willing to take a small step forward than a giant leap to OPness and get nerfed back... I wanted a challenge but hunter became too much of a pain in the &&& to play....

    I also forgot i still played farron and gear swapped so having the extra pips was part of my thinking... with a small press on tweak.
    Last edited by therealwhizzy; Jul 29 2012 at 12:28 AM.
    work in progress...

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  4. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by Lendas View Post
    im not even going to degrade myself and waste my time responding to posts like this.
    Wow, just wow.

    I forgot about the "mature" LOTRO community. My bad.
    Last edited by Dragnipurake; Jul 29 2012 at 01:29 AM.

  5. #130
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragnipurake View Post
    Wow, just wow.

    I forgot about the "mature" LOTRO community. My bad.
    The anonimity of the web breeds a great deal of hypocrisy. Whats most curious (and do check yourself) is in 3 months will the op be crying again about hunters in PvP? (guess what he was 3 months ago), or will he move on.

    100tp says he'll still be here.


  6. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragnipurake View Post
    It only sounds OP if you do not mention that the same is true for: wardens, minis, RKs, cappies, burgs, guards, WLs, reavers, flayer wargs
    Wardens: Lowest dps in game.
    Minstrels: OP freep class, enough said about that one.
    RKs: Not sure if serious. RKs can't run solo into OC to get a kill off.
    Cappies: Once again, second lowest dps in game. 15 min CD, as opposed to 5 min CD.
    Burgs: It's... a burg... they're supposed to do ridiculous things...
    Guards: Yes. Guards can definitely do this.
    WLs: Not true. Low dps.
    Reavers: Definitely not true. No heals/survival skills besides resilience and that's not gonna help avoidances.
    Flayer wargs: Gonna have to pop HIPS... maybe sprint if the player is smart.


    Congratulations, a total of 3 of your 9 listed classes actually made sense for your argument.
    RIP Milkmefondly 2014

  7. #132
    I feel like this thread had a lot of potential to bring attention to the problems Hunters have, but now it's turned into just a massive ragefest about things that can be solved on your own.

    Yes, we have terrible survivability.

    Yes, our best chances are stealthed openings with focus up.

    Yes, Press Onwards is a very limited heal for its 4 second induction.

    Yes, our melee slow is terrible (for one reason only, the aoe due to the "missing" of the frontal angle).

    But don't come here and label BAs/wargs as OP as we can deal with them in our own ways too. Yes, wargs have hips and sprint and BAs have Moving Target. It's frustrating getting ganked over and over by those classes, but in reality, only the high ranking of those classes are dangerous, and it's fair to say they'll win versus hunters since they have the tools to do so. But low ranking BAs/wargs really don't do much harm unless you really are confused what to do when you get jumped, or when a BA pops MT.

    Hopefully we'll get a boost to our survivability, but lets not drag down the level of this conversation. We deserve to be heard, but the raging against one another is silly and not useful.

  8. #133
    After reading most of the posts in this thread and giving some thought to this the main problem I have is when i go out to do a lil pvping I get to go and change armor around so i wont melt in 5 sec with most hi rank wargs.

    When a creep goes and get their audcity their DPS does not drop, all stats stay the same. When I change out gear I drop more than 15% in PM and 4% in crit. Yes I do gain a lil in morale and tact mit. but not really enough to warrant the lose in DPS.

    Sure I can sit in stealth and pop BH gather focus and HS and a solo creep coming from the rez or in HH, but I find that boring and rez camping just shows how low a person can go.

    Just give me the audcity rank I earn and let me run the gear i want to.

  9. #134
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    My hunter is fun, I've played her for a while, and it's a challenge to be competitive in the moors. I have an end-game mini too. I prefer my hunter.


    Its gotten to the point where a good hunter will still lose fights a majority of the time against decent creeps though. Even before audacity came out, good hunters would beat any class 1v1 (Personally even beat MT BAs regularly) if the hunter had skill. Now, a lot of winning is about hoping for crits, hoping you don't get jumped before your trap is down and you camo, etc. Heck, I've fought r10 wargs who I pop out of stealth at 40m... They either sprint at me, hips, or break los and restealth, then just nom on me.

    I dunno, I love the class, but I'd just like to see a return to where we were 6 months ago.
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  10. #135
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragnipurake View Post
    No, they don't. The scenario you describe is: pounce from stealth with no stance active, next activate flayer.
    Sorry about that then, i don't play warg and i never had the chance to look closely at my opponents effects in those situation

    i assumed it worked the same as stance changes on the other classes since i got anyway the stun from stealth and quite some damage before flayer just like what happens with a shadow warg ^^

  11. #136
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    oh what Lendas? are your feelings hurt cause someone used moving target? I mean, not like you have ever ganked a BA with a tact class. Moving target is not OP, its a joke really. just get a RK or Mini, shouldnt be that hard, a lot of them running around 24/7.

    Defiler flies? that one is so easily scared off, Bard's arrow/distracting shot.

    You might say I have creep goggles but you have a combo of QQ and freep goggles.

    There are several hunters on my server doing just fine, You should ask them for advices. Daliane is not one of them, really, my r4 reaver have killed him without store bought skills or audacity.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bond007 View Post
    Wardens: Lowest dps in game.
    Minstrels: OP freep class, enough said about that one.
    RKs: Not sure if serious. RKs can't run solo into OC to get a kill off.
    Cappies: Once again, second lowest dps in game. 15 min CD, as opposed to 5 min CD.
    Burgs: It's... a burg... they're supposed to do ridiculous things...
    Guards: Yes. Guards can definitely do this.
    WLs: Not true. Low dps.
    Reavers: Definitely not true. No heals/survival skills besides resilience and that's not gonna help avoidances.
    Flayer wargs: Gonna have to pop HIPS... maybe sprint if the player is smart.


    Congratulations, a total of 3 of your 9 listed classes actually made sense for your argument.
    you forget wardens can tank 10+ creeps and solo keeps
    RKs can kill anything with their OP heals & dps
    And burgs hipses even more than wargs if its possible.


    yeah, Dragnipurake when hunters start to rant like this its hopeless, so blinded by their own selfishness its kinda hopeless talking to them.
    Last edited by Witch0King; Jul 29 2012 at 07:26 AM.
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  12. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dragnipurake View Post
    It only sounds OP if you do not mention that the same is true for: wardens, minis, RKs, cappies, burgs, guards, WLs, reavers, flayer wargs
    And that just validates this entire argument.
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  13. #138
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lendas View Post

    [... epic wall of hmmm lets say text ..]

    i first was going to comment every single peace of your post, but the more i comment the more i get the feeling that it is senseless.

    but a bit to each point:
    1) mimimimimi
    2) damn this is needed for creeps!!!
    3) mimimimimimi
    4) you should update your information regarding the hunter sets, the informations in the dev diary are outdated

    Quote Originally Posted by Lendas View Post
    [IN SHORT
    MY KITING PLAYSTYLE IS OUTDETED AND NONEXISTENT, MY GEAR IS USELESS, I'M USING THE WRONG SKILLS , I HAVE NO SURVIVAL,
    AND I HAVE NO HOPE OF RESCUE




    i did some corrections there.

    damn hey, you could make a daily soap: Help I'm a hunter get me out of here.


    RIP pvp hunters. 2007-2012
    rip hunters who invest time into there class. (i do not say that hunter could not need some love, but i would see it in totally diffent points than most hunter would see)

    edit:
    REMINDER! we are talking about POST RoR
    haha funny -.-

    how to talk about POST RoR if we do not know:
    1) our new Skills
    2) our new Armoury (there was already a change to them, maybe it will change again and again and again?
    3) our DPS values!

    there are so many unknown things you cant know but we should talk about it. its always good to talk about things where you have no idea what will happen.
    Last edited by Milithion; Jul 29 2012 at 09:35 AM.
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  14. #139
    Quote Originally Posted by Dragnipurake View Post
    !st you say:



    You state, you made a warg and killed 1 or more hunters within the 5min right after creation.

    Next you say:



    You state, you were tracked by a hunter before pouncing him.

    So what now? Did you kill a hunter in EC with a rank1 warg or not? Did the NPCs attack you?
    where the hell did i say 1 or more? come on.... and where the hell are you getting EC now and NPCS?

    This is my quote "made a wargie to see when i still had my VIP the sad thing is I solo'd some poor hunter within 5 mins of making it...( a little piece of me died that day =( ) Now granted he wasnt that good based on how he handled me but relative to any other class it was a cake walk....."

    You then made up some scenario about afk and grams and then I told you it happened in the ford between TA an TR...

    That story is relative to a creep talking about the 15k heartseeker a rarer event... i got that wargie to rank 4 I could kill some hunters, no chance on a mini, no chance on a champ, dont think i got an LM either, a warden i tried with a whack o creeps that didnt happen so solo is obvioulsy out the question... my point is hunter is cake walk relative to other freep classes to kill.... theres no arguement.. now if you wanna talk about other classes being able to take on 3-4 or more good creeps at once well thats a fair arguement but saying well most freeps are op so leave hunter gimped is the way to keep some balance is BS... buff creeps to match champs mini's etc I dont care but buff hunters up to those levels too...
    Last edited by therealwhizzy; Jul 29 2012 at 10:17 AM.
    work in progress...

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  15. #140
    Quote Originally Posted by Jessy82 View Post
    My hunter is fun, I've played her for a while, and it's a challenge to be competitive in the moors. I have an end-game mini too. I prefer my hunter.


    Its gotten to the point where a good hunter will still lose fights a majority of the time against decent creeps though. Even before audacity came out, good hunters would beat any class 1v1 (Personally even beat MT BAs regularly) if the hunter had skill. Now, a lot of winning is about hoping for crits, hoping you don't get jumped before your trap is down and you camo, etc. Heck, I've fought r10 wargs who I pop out of stealth at 40m... They either sprint at me, hips, or break los and restealth, then just nom on me.

    I dunno, I love the class, but I'd just like to see a return to where we were 6 months ago.
    hey jess... agreed!
    work in progress...

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  16. #141
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    Quote Originally Posted by Witch0King View Post
    oh what Lendas? are your feelings hurt cause someone used moving target? I mean, not like you have ever ganked a BA with a tact class. Moving target is not OP, its a joke really. just get a RK or Mini, shouldnt be that hard, a lot of them running around 24/7.

    Defiler flies? that one is so easily scared off, Bard's arrow/distracting shot.

    You might say I have creep goggles but you have a combo of QQ and freep goggles.

    There are several hunters on my server doing just fine, You should ask them for advices. Daliane is not one of them, really, my r4 reaver have killed him without store bought skills or audacity.



    you forget wardens can tank 10+ creeps and solo keeps
    RKs can kill anything with their OP heals & dps
    And burgs hipses even more than wargs if its possible.


    yeah, Dragnipurake when hunters start to rant like this its hopeless, so blinded by their own selfishness its kinda hopeless talking to them.




    your trolling...



    your argument is entierly invalid

    why?

    your talking about freeps VS creeps
    while this disscussion SOULD be about hunter VS creeps

    who cares what RKs and wardens and minis and burgs can do?



    we are talking about HUNTER in PVMP

    NOT OVERALL FREEPS







    saying MT is not an "I WIN" skill because tactical classes can ignore it is a nonesensical red herring argument becuase we'r talking about hunters, not overall CREEP VS FREEP. against hunter it IS an "I WIN" skill.






    please dont bring the whole creep vs freep overall balance issue in here.

    saying MT is a joke completly discredits you (and i think the PVMP community can bear with me on this one)
    by your logic... i should have my own private tactical class running with me at all times to be able to beat a BA....

    your trolling and you know it.



    defiler flies scared off? so i have to trait bards arrow (giving up ether a capstone, AOE root, or press onward) and get induct off (leting up on the defiler, who quickly gets heals up or throws a mega debuff) and then return to the defiler. if they have half a brain they will run up to your face and start running though you, effectivly leaving you with only pen shot to counter them since kiting is not an option (leting up on them for a second will let them heal or throw debuffs) and you are focred to slow them and run

    your trolling and you know it




    those players who say hunter is fine in the moors, have never played one there.




    please.... leave. your trolling has no basis in reality.

  17. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jessy82 View Post
    My hunter is fun, I've played her for a while, and it's a challenge to be competitive in the moors. I have an end-game mini too. I prefer my hunter.


    Its gotten to the point where a good hunter will still lose fights a majority of the time against decent creeps though. Even before audacity came out, good hunters would beat any class 1v1 (Personally even beat MT BAs regularly) if the hunter had skill. Now, a lot of winning is about hoping for crits, hoping you don't get jumped before your trap is down and you camo, etc. Heck, I've fought r10 wargs who I pop out of stealth at 40m... They either sprint at me, hips, or break los and restealth, then just nom on me.

    I dunno, I love the class, but I'd just like to see a return to where we were 6 months ago.
    ^^^^^^^^ this


    before audacity it didnt matter that we were killed in 6 seconds when we could do the same to them

    now?

    not a chance

  18. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Andared View Post
    Gotta be within 15m to use blade toss and that doesn't make him get to you any quicker, just keeps you from running. Even a mediocre hunter knows that his target is dead if he gets the jump on it from 30m or more. If you're having to kite a target that you get the jump on from 30 or more meters away, you're doing it wrong.
    This means the brain dead reaver is going to run toward the hunter instead of LOSing... most will resilient, los and then recharge... dead hunter...... want to try again? I played almost all creep classes.... execpt defiler. Each class has a solution to hunter slows and CC. Hunters don't we are indeed a sniper player but instead of a 50 cal we get a 22 .. sure it can kill but you need a lot of luck and skill to put one in their eye before they get to you.


    All these wanna be hunters giving advice to r10 hunters or better.... boys and girls we know our classes. Yes there are phenoms like Yelk out there that are the top hunters with the top gear that can kill creeps on a regular basis, but ask him how he does it. He NEEDS to burn everything he has to get that one kill. Wargs don't hell some BAs can just uruk then hit MT later. The problem is our top 5% can compete... that means we win some and lose some.. the rest are lunch.

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  19. #144
    1. I have no problem playing on a hunter in the moors solo.
    2. We really have no feedback at all for what its like at 85 so why jump to conclusions.
    3. Yes we need a survival skill, I don't deny our weakness however just because you can pick a snake up from the tail doesn't make it completely harmless.
    4. Rather than making a post in all CAPS I'd suggest waiting to hear or test level 85 yourself and then complain, in non-caps and without the ocean spaces.
    5. This post has kept my highly entertained, by all means continue.
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  20. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Witch0King View Post
    oh what Lendas? are your feelings hurt cause someone used moving target? I mean, not like you have ever ganked a BA with a tact class. Moving target is not OP, its a joke really. just get a RK or Mini, shouldnt be that hard, a lot of them running around 24/7.

    Defiler flies? that one is so easily scared off, Bard's arrow/distracting shot.

    You might say I have creep goggles but you have a combo of QQ and freep goggles.

    There are several hunters on my server doing just fine, You should ask them for advices. Daliane is not one of them, really, my r4 reaver have killed him without store bought skills or audacity.



    you forget wardens can tank 10+ creeps and solo keeps
    RKs can kill anything with their OP heals & dps
    And burgs hipses even more than wargs if its possible.


    yeah, Dragnipurake when hunters start to rant like this its hopeless, so blinded by their own selfishness its kinda hopeless talking to them.
    You do realize there is a decent induction for that right? The defiler closes and bonks you and while you are dazed the flies come back into play.... that and the whole time the defiler is healing through your dps.

    I currently coud give a squirt for the other freep classes.... yes burgs, champs, minies, and wardens are crazy op. But what the hell does that have to do with my class that keeps getting weaker in the moors? BAs, oh I have one, are going to be very easy mode in ROR... lie to me and tell me they won't. As for tactical against BAs I watch Griz and other BAs destroy them on E on a daily basis 1v1... the tools are there to use against tactical classes.... a hunter has nothing in the bag against MT.... it is just too long of a skill for a hunter to compete with... half it and give it a tactical boost and then I wouldn't complain and would balance out the "tactical" disadvantage BAs supposedly have, but watch the QQ from the BAS when their favorite food can acutally fight back.

    BAs can double my morale, have better mits, better movement skills, can heal better and because I do more dps I shouldn't complain about the hunter.... right....

    Tydalmir
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  21. #146
    As a resently ranking warg i would say the solo hunter is the easest freep to kill solo, as a group thier tracks make them deadly to wargs i would surgest they gain so skills aimed for pvmp which may have apliactions. i would like to see a more powerful hunter in the moors but not make them hit harder make them more cunning , my surgestion is allow them to place a straw trap that will stealth the hunter and leave a dobble ganger in his place, to the creeps he appears stationary/afk/lagging but to other freeps it appears like the scarecrow

  22. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tinluen View Post
    This means the brain dead reaver is going to run toward the hunter instead of LOSing... most will resilient, los and then recharge... dead hunter...... want to try again? I played almost all creep classes.... execpt defiler. Each class has a solution to hunter slows and CC. Hunters don't we are indeed a sniper player but instead of a 50 cal we get a 22 .. sure it can kill but you need a lot of luck and skill to put one in their eye before they get to you.


    All these wanna be hunters giving advice to r10 hunters or better.... boys and girls we know our classes. Yes there are phenoms like Yelk out there that are the top hunters with the top gear that can kill creeps on a regular basis, but ask him how he does it. He NEEDS to burn everything he has to get that one kill. Wargs don't hell some BAs can just uruk then hit MT later. The problem is our top 5% can compete... that means we win some and lose some.. the rest are lunch.

    Tydalmir
    pretty much summed it up perfectly right here.

    + rep.



    Quote Originally Posted by YesMaam View Post
    1. I have no problem playing on a hunter in the moors solo.
    2. We really have no feedback at all for what its like at 85 so why jump to conclusions.
    3. Yes we need a survival skill, I don't deny our weakness however just because you can pick a snake up from the tail doesn't make it completely harmless.
    4. Rather than making a post in all CAPS I'd suggest waiting to hear or test level 85 yourself and then complain, in non-caps and without the ocean spaces.
    5. This post has kept my highly entertained, by all means continue.



    i respect you as a great hunter yelk... but not everyone is as good or has as much time to get as much gear as you.
    Last edited by Lendas; Jul 29 2012 at 02:20 PM.

  23. #148
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lendas View Post
    those players who say hunter is fine in the moors, have never played one there.
    please.... leave. your trolling has no basis in reality.
    i'm playing in moores. i think hunters are not to bad, there are not fine, some little stuff is missing, but i cant say hunters are just victims in there, and they will not be, or will they remove our bows with rohan?

    and for me, you are the guy trolling in this (your own) thread.

    the hunter class is a class that is easy to play, but hard to master, keep that in mind.


    and for the part of the equipment:

    6 pieces of ettenmores set
    2 rings from moores
    offhand from moores (seekers blade)
    first age weapons (hey they are really not that hard to get)
    3 reputation jewelery (anduin vagabound's bundel, Bracklet of villains unmasked,anduins vagabound's earring)
    only 4 instance loot items: Celloch(ear) Gregolin(Neck) Bracer of the huntsman (wirst) Sarchol
    you could replace the 4 instance loot items with reputation stuff if you dont want to spend more time getting some items.

    creeps will hat you for this equip.
    Last edited by Milithion; Jul 29 2012 at 03:11 PM.
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  24. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Milithion View Post
    i'm playing in moores. i think hunters are not to bad, there are not fine, some little stuff is missing, but i cant say hunters are just victims in there, and they will not be, or will they remove our bows with rohan?

    and for me, you are the guy trolling in this (your own) thread.

    the hunter class is a class that is easy to play, but hard to master, keep that in mind.


    and for the part of the equipment:

    6 pieces of ettenmores set
    2 rings from moores
    offhand from moores (seekers blade)
    first age weapons (hey they are really not that hard to get)
    3 reputation jewelery (anduin vagabound's bundel, Bracklet of villains unmasked,anduins vagabound's earring)
    only 4 instance loot items: Celloch(ear) Gregolin(Neck) Bracer of the huntsman (wirst) Sarchol
    you could replace the 4 instance loot items with reputation stuff if you dont want to spend more time getting some items.

    creeps will hat you for this equip.
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  25. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by Milithion View Post
    i'm playing in moores. i think hunters are not to bad, there are not fine, some little stuff is missing, but i cant say hunters are just victims in there, and they will not be, or will they remove our bows with rohan?

    and for me, you are the guy trolling in this (your own) thread.

    the hunter class is a class that is easy to play, but hard to master, keep that in mind.


    and for the part of the equipment:

    6 pieces of ettenmores set
    2 rings from moores
    offhand from moores (seekers blade)
    first age weapons (hey they are really not that hard to get)
    3 reputation jewelery (anduin vagabound's bundel, Bracklet of villains unmasked,anduins vagabound's earring)
    only 4 instance loot items: Celloch(ear) Gregolin(Neck) Bracer of the huntsman (wirst) Sarchol
    you could replace the 4 instance loot items with reputation stuff if you dont want to spend more time getting some items.

    creeps will hat you for this equip.
    This is pretty close to the Equipment I have, and I do pretty well in the moors.

    I prefer the Draig cloak over Sarchol and the ToO necklace to Gregolin however, just gives me more mastery. FA symbols are not too difficult to come by, and my server only has 2 groups farming Lightning/FnF.

    No one can really comment on Rohan like a lot of people have said, as we don't know the specific changes coming to the class and how mounted combat will affect us.

 

 
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