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  1. #8001
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelloweyedemon View Post
    I bet you were not even playing lotro when the RK fire bug existed... Anyways there have been 1 RK and 1 burg using exploit on gilrain, and they got banned after 3 days exactly. They both stopped using them after that. That was also back in RoI very early days.
    Ehrmmm ... Im talking about fire RKs and burgs using the macros right now at HD, dont know why are you talking about RoI.
    Last edited by Juanra; Dec 28 2013 at 06:08 PM.
    [IMG]http://i1258.photobucket.com/albums/ii524/Martwen/juan_zps65bf8663.jpg[/IMG]

    Badjuanra R12 (BA), Adbulhassan R9 (STK), Fatjuanra R9 (WL)

  2. #8002
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yelloweyedemon View Post

    Not sure why I bother, but an advantage of less than 10% damage and morale is almost un-noticable. On the other hand an advantage of killing any player in 2 seconds is laughable gamebreaking.

    As I said both are exploits and should not exist, but they can't be compared in ANY way.
    !0% is nothing of a boost on creepside in those days, but it is on freep, plus im thinking the first ager would make a decent bit of difference also, So I stand by it being an advantage. As for comparing it with the macro abuse, well it seems you are the only one comparing them. I was just stating how its funny you have all developed standards all of a sudden to the cheaters of this game. Like I said before I could rattle off all the cheating and game breaking done by just one person who you all stand by, but one of his bum chums will report me and i don't even know if you can write a post that big without my hands falling off.

    By all means make the ones cheating at the moment suffer, but don't forget the ones you all stood by and still do. Give them a hard time also.
    -----------------------------Scumbags tribe--------------------------------------

  3. #8003
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    Quote Originally Posted by Juanra View Post
    Ehrmmm ... Im talking about fire RKs and burgs using the macros right now at HD, dont know why are you talking about RoI.
    I'm in EM pretty much since HD released, and I havn't seen any burg or RK using exploits that kill their oponent in 2 seconds.

    Macros in general =/= exploits. Exploiting game mechanics with macros is what the problem is all about.
    ~Nimolas R11 Warden (Retired before RoR) (Snowbourn)

    ~Eralwen R10 hunter

  4. #8004
    Goodnight Romper

  5. #8005
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrackleNackle View Post
    Goodnight Romper
    You leaving already? Nite nite, sweet dreams. x
    -----------------------------Scumbags tribe--------------------------------------

  6. #8006
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    So lets clarify something. Using eye gouge in this manner is the same as a burglar turning away from target to use addle so it doesn't go on cd yet still has the effect of cutting off the animation, thus increasing dps. The top burgs have been doing this for years with no issue. Yet, assuming the counter points raised by several of you hold true, this would constitute exploiting. Should they face disiplinary action from Turbine in the same way you think wargs who use macros should?

    (Also for anyone still in doubt, macros that require human interaction are completely legal for use in LotRO)
    #zergistheanswer

  7. #8007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirathalad View Post
    So lets clarify something. Using eye gouge in this manner is the same as a burglar turning away from target to use addle so it doesn't go on cd yet still has the effect of cutting off the animation, thus increasing dps. The top burgs have been doing this for years with no issue. Yet, assuming the counter points raised by several of you hold true, this would constitute exploiting. Should they face disiplinary action from Turbine in the same way you think wargs who use macros should?

    (Also for anyone still in doubt, macros that require human interaction are completely legal for use in LotRO)
    Since I don't know how the warg exploit works exactly, I cannot answer this with certainty. From what I understood from the earlier forum post describing it, however, it seems that the reason why the warg version counts as an exploit is because there either is no cd at all on the skills being used because the devs never assumed someone would write a macro to trigger the skills in quick succession, or the skill can be cancelled after it does damage but before it goes on cd. I don't have a burg either, so going by your description of how burgs can use addle to up their dps, it seems notable that this 'exploit' is orders of magnitude weaker than than the warg version is, since they have to constantly pirouette, making it rather hard (I'd assume) to macro. If it would turn out to be macroable, I'd certainly be in favor of fixing the skills so that they cannot be abused in that fashion, but until then, it seems a rather unimportant issue.
    What I don't see, however, is why you are constantly hoping to deflect the issue by talking about how minor avenues for abuse excuse your own major exploiting. As has been repeatedly pointed out, the CoC forbids all forms of exploiting, and it is irrelevant under the CoC whether other players or classes are abusing game mechanics to their advantage.

  8. #8008
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    Quote Originally Posted by Romper View Post
    I ment to add I wasn't generalizing the first time. The number stat was a slight exaggeration, you could chop a few 9s off the end or even turn teh whole number to 100% as it sure seems there is no solo or even duo freeps anymore. So my FACT still stands.

    Unlucky.
    Mainly because there are hardly any solo creeps as well -_-
    MacSwaggis (formerly MacHaggis) R11 HNT , HeavyHaggis R10 GRD, Scrubtain R2 CPT
    Haggisbash R8 RVR , Haggisgash R7 WL

  9. #8009
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    Quote Originally Posted by rannion View Post
    Since I don't know how the warg exploit works exactly, I cannot answer this with certainty. From what I understood from the earlier forum post describing it, however, it seems that the reason why the warg version counts as an exploit is because there either is no cd at all on the skills being used because the devs never assumed someone would write a macro to trigger the skills in quick succession, or the skill can be cancelled after it does damage but before it goes on cd. I don't have a burg either, so going by your description of how burgs can use addle to up their dps, it seems notable that this 'exploit' is orders of magnitude weaker than than the warg version is, since they have to constantly pirouette, making it rather hard (I'd assume) to macro. If it would turn out to be macroable, I'd certainly be in favor of fixing the skills so that they cannot be abused in that fashion, but until then, it seems a rather unimportant issue.
    What I don't see, however, is why you are constantly hoping to deflect the issue by talking about how minor avenues for abuse excuse your own major exploiting. As has been repeatedly pointed out, the CoC forbids all forms of exploiting, and it is irrelevant under the CoC whether other players or classes are abusing game mechanics to their advantage.
    There is a cooldown on all skills used in the macro. If the macro works as intended, eye gouge never fires thus never goes on cd - the same as the way burgs use addle. I don't see why this is exploitative? No burgs I know have been banned for doing it, so perhaps it is a working as intended game mechanism, rather than an abuse of a broken one? I haven't seen a blue name ever mention this is a broken mechanism, at least.
    #zergistheanswer

  10. #8010
    Quote Originally Posted by DharmaSpider View Post
    Ive just spammed ooc with rage and now im spamming here

    If you are a mini ... and i engage you in a 1 v 1 as a SPIDER, please, for whatever dignity is left in this game do not see that as an opportunity to start dragging me through npcs ... your a ******* MINSTREL. Im literally having to come at you 100% with everythin i have just to have like 10% chance of beating you strap on a pair and actually come to ettenmoors to test your skill and improve. One power pot and im literally on my backside sprawled eagle dead, lets no add insult to injury by taking what little effort away thats left in the minstrel class.
    I would feel sorry for you but I have seen Creep Craids do just that to Freeps, Try to draw us into NPC's, lure us closer to the one shots or draw us out far enough from our NPC's to have the wargs hit us from behind in groups of 4 +. Not to mention signinng onto there Freep Toons and Leading a Train right up through the Freep Raid fallowed soon after using the NPC's as cover for them. Not to mention screwing up the Freeps Raids buffs with lower tier weaker ones as mostly Captians. Isnt the Moors just so wonderfully filled such skillfully players and love a challenge lol.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/08207000000264409/01003/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]
    lvl 95 Champion / Rank 10 Arkenstone Server / Officer - Order of the Cresent Dragon / Kuznumshi lvl 95 Reaver / Rank 7 Arkenstone Server / Grunt of Tribe of Aracnophobia

  11. #8011
    Quote Originally Posted by SpicyMacHaggis View Post
    Mainly because there are hardly any solo creeps as well -_-
    Solo Creeps are mostly on late to catch the few Freeps doing there dailys on there own since most any Creep can run over a Average Freep 1 v 1.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/08207000000264409/01003/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]
    lvl 95 Champion / Rank 10 Arkenstone Server / Officer - Order of the Cresent Dragon / Kuznumshi lvl 95 Reaver / Rank 7 Arkenstone Server / Grunt of Tribe of Aracnophobia

  12. #8012
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draithenz1971 View Post
    I would feel sorry for you but I have seen Creep Craids do just that to Freeps, Try to draw us into NPC's, lure us closer to the one shots or draw us out far enough from our NPC's to have the wargs hit us from behind in groups of 4 +. Not to mention signinng onto there Freep Toons and Leading a Train right up through the Freep Raid fallowed soon after using the NPC's as cover for them. Not to mention screwing up the Freeps Raids buffs with lower tier weaker ones as mostly Captians. Isnt the Moors just so wonderfully filled such skillfully players and love a challenge lol.
    Such hypocrite, very truth, much freep goggles, wow.
    +Moose+ tells you, 'Do you still need me to put the smack down on this foe??'

  13. #8013
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stealthiness View Post
    Such hypocrite, very truth, much freep goggles, wow.

    Dont know who this guy is but hes a gold mine. New troll in town.

    https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...93#post7051393

    Quote Originally Posted by Draithenz1971 on 24 Dec 2013
    As long as I have been playing we never had the upper. The more time passes the further back Creep s have to dredge up any example of when they dint have there way in the Moors. For what ever the Creeps are doing it clearly not done by skill rather the extreme greater Morale, Nice Regen given them from 12.1 and there ability to take 1/3 to 1/2 of a Freeps morale in a single swipe. Brag as you like as there is no skill required for Creeps in the Moors I am in. Enjoy your high Time Creeps because true Freeps patience for this unbalanced creep fun land is running out.
    https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...88#post7052388

    Quote Originally Posted by Draithenz1971 on 25 Dec 2013
    I have never seen Freeps with the upper hand. Enjoy this while you can because it down right near dead in the Moors. So I hope the Creeps are enjoying themselves.
    [IMG]http://i1258.photobucket.com/albums/ii524/Martwen/juan_zps65bf8663.jpg[/IMG]

    Badjuanra R12 (BA), Adbulhassan R9 (STK), Fatjuanra R9 (WL)

  14. #8014
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpicyMacHaggis View Post
    Mainly because there are hardly any solo creeps as well -_-
    Funny that, because when im on solo/duo or even if im lucky a trio, I always pass certain solo creeps at the same places looking for smaller action. So they do exist, just that most are usually wargs due to the fact if you attack someone who is on route to the fraid, they ether drag you to the fraid or shout on the fraid and you get steamrolled. So I suppose warg or even spider are best cause at least you have a chance of escape from your impending doom. So there is plenty solo or mini groups of creeps going about , you just cant find them with your fraids cause they stay well away. Maybe get a small group together and try a night of that away from the fraid and you will see these people and if you are lucky I may pop up too, only if you have been good and promise not to cry for the raid.
    -----------------------------Scumbags tribe--------------------------------------

  15. #8015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draithenz1971 View Post
    Solo Creeps are mostly on late to catch the few Freeps doing there dailys on there own since most any Creep can run over a Average Freep 1 v 1.
    Classic example of a freep who doesn't know how to play his character. This made me lol.
    [center][URL=http://s1170.photobucket.com/user/Glohir/media/99b92620-47a6-43d6-8b52-1ff43a173a35_zpsz90debot.png.html][IMG]http://i1170.photobucket.com/albums/r524/Glohir/99b92620-47a6-43d6-8b52-1ff43a173a35_zpsz90debot.png[/IMG][/URL][/center]

  16. #8016
    Quote Originally Posted by Dirathalad View Post
    So lets clarify something. Using eye gouge in this manner is the same as a burglar turning away from target to use addle so it doesn't go on cd yet still has the effect of cutting off the animation, thus increasing dps. The top burgs have been doing this for years with no issue. Yet, assuming the counter points raised by several of you hold true, this would constitute exploiting. Should they face disiplinary action from Turbine in the same way you think wargs who use macros should?

    (Also for anyone still in doubt, macros that require human interaction are completely legal for use in LotRO)
    The difference between the burgs and the current day exploits is that they are/were manually doing it, and likewise with this, some people did think it an exploit. However what you and others are doing is a step up from that. You are using a program that *does not require human interaction to fire off more skills than you would be able to do manually.

    *by your definition, human interaction = pressing the start key for a script to run. Therefore *every single program ever made that requires a -Start Script- key, would be legal in terms of lotro*

    This is downright stupid.
    Shakuru scored a devastating hit on Retarius for 8,094 Scottish damage to morale.

  17. #8017
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    Quote Originally Posted by Limmy View Post
    The difference between the burgs and the current day exploits is that they are/were manually doing it, and likewise with this, some people did think it an exploit. However what you and others are doing is a step up from that. You are using a program that *does not require human interaction to fire off more skills than you would be able to do manually.

    *by your definition, human interaction = pressing the start key for a script to run. Therefore *every single program ever made that requires a -Start Script- key, would be legal in terms of lotro*

    This is downright stupid.
    Finite skill sequences are permitted, infinite loops that require no input at all (i.e. farming bots) are not. By Turbine's standards, as long as you are sat at the keyboard operating your character, macroing skills is fine.
    #zergistheanswer

  18. #8018
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dirathalad View Post
    Finite skill sequences are permitted, infinite loops that require no input at all (i.e. farming bots) are not. By Turbine's standards, as long as you are sat at the keyboard operating your character, macroing skills is fine.
    Do you admit to using macros on your warg ? If you are so sure that your interpretation is correct then you should have no problems making this admission . I suspect that you don't want to openly admit this .

    "Macroing skills" ? have turbine granted new skills to the warg ?

    The two words are poles apart , there is no skill in your warg being able to bring someone down in seconds because you pressed "macro button 1" why on earth do you think that a skill ? Why do you use them if not to gain a significant if not game breaking advantage over your opponent ? I'd think no ill of you if you beat someone simply because you are better than that person but why do you feel the necessity to employ such things ( as with your admitted clubbing)

    There are too many wargs using this , it's not just you. I even had three on me at lug the other week and all used it !!! Pathetic , one logged from his fotm reaver , the other his BA and the other had just been let out for the day from the local juvenile detention centre . All from the same kin too so I know who you are . Again pathetic .

  19. #8019
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tirn View Post
    Do you admit to using macros on your warg ? If you are so sure that your interpretation is correct then you should have no problems making this admission . I suspect that you don't want to openly admit this .

    "Macroing skills" ? have turbine granted new skills to the warg ?

    The two words are poles apart , there is no skill in your warg being able to bring someone down in seconds because you pressed "macro button 1" why on earth do you think that a skill ? Why do you use them if not to gain a significant if not game breaking advantage over your opponent ? I'd think no ill of you if you beat someone simply because you are better than that person but why do you feel the necessity to employ such things ( as with your admitted clubbing)

    There are too many wargs using this , it's not just you. I even had three on me at lug the other week and all used it !!! Pathetic , one logged from his fotm reaver , the other his BA and the other had just been let out for the day from the local juvenile detention centre . All from the same kin too so I know who you are . Again pathetic .

    Tirn is right, Dirac and Gilea aren't the only 2 wargs doing it at the moment.

    And: if any non-infinite script is allowed, so I can set a farming bot that farms for 100000 times, and it's allowed because it isn't infinite? ^^ ( obviously not )

    And n°2: both burglar and warg exploit just avoid skills going in cooldown, both are exploits, both are blameful
    Baronth - Alemis - Aipod - Alessandro - Talyla - Viyle | Ombra e Fiamma - [Gilrain]

    Retired

  20. #8020
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baronth View Post
    Tirn is right, Dirac and Gilea aren't the only 2 wargs doing it at the moment.

    if any non-infinite script is allowed, so I can set a farming bot that farms for 100000 times, and it's allowed because it isn't infinite? ^^ ( obviously not )
    In a nutshell, if a GM is suspicious of your actions and sends you a tell, you better be there to respond it to.
    #zergistheanswer

  21. #8021
    Gurbarash what do you have to say about giving away macros and exploits to players?

  22. #8022
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrackleNackle View Post
    Gurbarash what do you have to say about giving away macros and exploits to players?
    I'm not defending anyone, and I don't play creep so I don't know whats going on there, but I have 1v1'd Gurb many times, and he didn't use the exploit any time. I havn't seen him using the exploit on anyone else either.
    ~Nimolas R11 Warden (Retired before RoR) (Snowbourn)

    ~Eralwen R10 hunter

  23. #8023
    Lets all be honest the ones really at fault here are Turbine (again) for putting in skills that are capable of being fired off that fast. Regardless if the way they are being used is how they intended them to be it is human nature to try and exploit any advantage you can over another person so with that in mind they should have thought about the possible use of a macro to fire something off more often than is humanly possible and just stopped it from being doable in the first place.
    Leader of [url=http://hopeandglory.eu]Hope & Glory[/url] LOTRO Division

  24. #8024
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wyvernclaw View Post
    Lets all be honest the ones really at fault here are Turbine (again) for putting in skills that are capable of being fired off that fast. Regardless if the way they are being used is how they intended them to be it is human nature to try and exploit any advantage you can over another person so with that in mind they should have thought about the possible use of a macro to fire something off more often than is humanly possible and just stopped it from being doable in the first place.
    sorry but I don't agree . It's also human nature to see that sometimes it's "simply not cricket" . We all have that choice , rules are for a reason , without them there would be anarchy . There is and should be a structure to everything . We can all ignore this and in doing so put an end to a sea of troubles . It doesn't help at all , it makes matters worse .

    If the lights go out its not an excuse to riot and blame the power company .

  25. #8025
    Quote Originally Posted by Tirn View Post
    sorry but I don't agree . It's also human nature to see that sometimes it's "simply not cricket" . We all have that choice , rules are for a reason , without them there would be anarchy . There is and should be a structure to everything . We can all ignore this and in doing so put an end to a sea of troubles . It doesn't help at all , it makes matters worse .

    If the lights go out its not an excuse to riot and blame the power company .
    Not saying we ignore the problem at all I'm just pointing out that the game/rule makers left a huge hole in their rules that has allowed people to abuse a set of skills that shouldn't be like that in the first place because they should know people would abuse it.
    Leader of [url=http://hopeandglory.eu]Hope & Glory[/url] LOTRO Division

 

 
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