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  1. #76
    You wrote that:
    "[3231] Resounding Challenge

    3T Threat
    6 targets; 10m range

    [32313] Call to Battle

    2T Threat every 4s for 16s
    6 targets; 10m range"

    The range of those gambits is 25m (or afaik even more with proper legacy - can't check it now, btw the possibility of lengthening the range would be worth mentioning), and 10m is the radius from the initial target.
    That's quite important, as Call to Battle, giving as much raw threat as EoB is a great tool to grab mobs from a longer range, especially in chaotic situations that quite often happen in PUG skirm raids.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/20224000000100363/01007/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

    Warden(85), Minstrel(85), Rune-Keeper(85), Burglar(85), Captain(85), Hunter(85)

  2. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerzol View Post
    The range of those gambits is 25m (or afaik even more with proper legacy - can't check it now, btw the possibility of lengthening the range would be worth mentioning), and 10m is the radius from the initial target.
    That's quite important, as Call to Battle, giving as much raw threat as EoB is a great tool to grab mobs from a longer range, especially in chaotic situations that quite often happen in PUG skirm raids.
    You're totally right, not sure how I overlooked that. Can you tell I haven't done a whole lot of tanking since the expansion launched? It's fixed now, should display what the two new gambits do in each stance properly. Thanks for pointing that out.

    As for legacy extension, I've thought about including that. I originally didn't because it would add a ton of information to an already information-packed guide (not to mention creating a lot more work on my end). I might add trait and legacy information (their effects on individual gambits only) in the future though. I will definitely consider doing it, time permitting. Thanks for the feedback!
    [CENTER][COLOR=#008080]ASTO[/COLOR] [wrd] : [COLOR=#008080]BISMUTH[/COLOR] [brg] : [COLOR=#ff0000]BEDBUG[/COLOR] [wrg] : [COLOR=#ff0000]OTSA[/COLOR] [wl]
    [B][URL="http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?451496-Asto-s-Gambit-Compendium-Warning-Comprehensive"][COLOR=#ff8c00]Asto's Gambit Compendium[/COLOR][/URL][/B][/CENTER]

  3. #78
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Posts
    252
    Are all the BPE buffs listed by the OP for a naked Warden, or do they include bonuses from traits/legacies?

    If they are, can anyone provide me with a list of buffs with all traits/legacies included?

  4. #79
    Quote Originally Posted by Rhaphael View Post
    Are all the BPE buffs listed by the OP for a naked Warden, or do they include bonuses from traits/legacies?

    If they are, can anyone provide me with a list of buffs with all traits/legacies included?
    the buffs given by gambits are a multiplier of your level

    e.g. DoW = [20*level] Evade
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/23221000000168bff/signature.png]Aidlywo[/charsig]

    Getting a Gold Class Item "Soon™" - Currently running 999th ITA Instance

  5. #80
    Is this still up to date?

  6. #81
    I found this thread extremly usefull while learning how to tank at level 85
    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...gro-in-numbers!

    In summary: if tooltips of 2 different gambits say that each of those gambits spams moderate threat, it does not mean value of generated threat is same.
    For example EOB with all tanking legacies/traits (all those that you have while tanking) generates twice as much aggro as CoB (with same setting). This thread is good to see that some old gambits are still VERY usefull while tanking, while some new aggro builders are usefull in very few situations (I use new gambits only in recklessness, i found them useless as aggro buiders even though they were meant to be new threat generating gambits)
    Also aggresion, that is supposed to steal same amount of threat as conviction (and conviction also heals, so generates more threat) generates more threat. While dance of war is weakest of all 3 stealing aggro gamits.

    Right now tooltips are very messed up, one need to spend much time on forum to find, what to use and when.

    Great that such posts are created, so all newcomers can have any idea how to play this most complicated class

  7. #82
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    St Louis Mo
    Posts
    1,999
    Quote Originally Posted by andinic28 View Post
    Is this still up to date?
    Weelll,,

    Yes, most of the gambits are the same builders and effects
    Kinda, some of the changes with AGI were after Astro first draft
    No, they will change when they do the class revamp with the release of Helm's, so any info here will probably explode.

    Take your pick.

    Quote Originally Posted by Galwir View Post
    I found this thread extremly usefull while learning how to tank at level 85
    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...gro-in-numbers!
    Good idea to keep in mind that that is a purely theoretical discussion. Turbines official stance is, they will never releasing threat to DPS numbers, so all numbers are subjective to character, gear, mob and situation, even some luck if you crit your threat but not your dps.
    Last edited by Darlgon; Jul 22 2013 at 01:25 AM.

  8. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by Darlgon View Post
    Good idea to keep in mind that that is a purely theoretical discussion.
    Can't agree with this. There are a lot more threads about threat, people done so many reaserches, that it is no more theoretical, but pratcical with empirical basis. Of course, we never know if there are any hidden changes coming to threat, but right now we are quite sure how much threat generates dpsing, how much healing, how much gambits.
    And, even if there is some measurement error (most likely there is), we know wich gambit generates ABOUT what amount of threat.

  9. #84
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    St Louis Mo
    Posts
    1,999
    Quote Originally Posted by Galwir View Post
    Can't agree with this. There are a lot more threads about threat, people done so many reaserches, that it is no more theoretical, but pratcical with empirical basis. Of course, we never know if there are any hidden changes coming to threat, but right now we are quite sure how much threat generates dpsing, how much healing, how much gambits.
    And, even if there is some measurement error (most likely there is), we know wich gambit generates ABOUT what amount of threat.
    Sigh.. Sorry Astro.

    Read this thread:

    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.p...ghlight=threat

    Heres the highlights from the class creator and developer, Graalx:

    From 2008

    Quote Originally Posted by Graalx2 View Post
    Lets see if I can answer at least some of your questions.

    Warden Threat effects stack completely with other Threat effects and with themselves.

    The descriptions for the magnitude of a Threat effect are absolute. A Moderate threat increase does the same amount of Threat on a Tier 2 gambit as a Tier 5 Gambit.

    The magnitude of threat effects is approximately:
    .5x -Slightly increased threat
    1x -Moderately increased threat
    2x -Increased threat
    3x -Greatly increased threat

    All Warden Threat over Time effects last 16 seconds with 4 second pulses. The duration is not increased by traits but the magnitude of each pulse is increased by some traits.

    Warden heals do increase threat for each pulse of healing, though some monsters care more about healing threat than others.
    Quote Originally Posted by Graalx2 View Post
    Sorry missed that question...

    A single pulse from a Threat over Time effect has the same magnitude as the equivalent direct threat effect.

    The bonus threat from a skill that adds Slightly increased threat over time adds 4 times the threat as a skill that just has Slightly increased threat. (4 pulses)

    Hmmm, I just found out that the Warden threat over time effects don't have any descriptive adjectives. I'll get that taken care of. Until then it looks like all of the Warden threat over time effects "Slightly increase threat over time".
    Quote Originally Posted by Graalx2 View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by geoboy View Post
    X is a level based amount approximately equivalent to the threat generated by 1 autoattack.
    What he said.
    Quote Originally Posted by geoboy View Post
    No problemo I really doubt that turbine will ever let us see the threat on mobs, as that would make things a bit too easy. Here's an example graalx2 gave us to explain the threat table:

    Quote Originally Posted by Graalx2 View Post
    Fellowship of 4. PC1, PC2, PC3, Warden
    3 Orcs. Orc1, Orc2, Orc3

    Numbers are for demonstration purposes only.

    Midway into the fight the Orc's hatelists may look something like this
    Code:
    Orc1 Orc2 Orc3
    PC1 1500 1000 1000
    PC2 1700 1400 1000
    PC3 3000 3000 3000
    Ward 3500 3100 2200

    Warden executes Dance of War

    Orc1 Orc2 Orc3
    PC1 1400 900 900
    PC2 1600 1300 900
    PC3 2900 2900 2900
    Ward 3800 3400 2500
    Quote Originally Posted by LtDiablo View Post
    Graal made it pretty clear to me :/ in the formula x is just a number we have no idea. AA's were a way to give an example of the "magnitude" of what X would roughly be so we could better understand the "difference" between the gambits, not to better understand how much specific threat we are doling out. So as a community we've just used AA as the substitute for X. So essentially it was just to be an objective way of saying X can do anywhere from 150 to 200 Threats level dependent. But again, this is the important part, this was just to add a visual aspect to an abstract mechanic to understand the "difference" between gambits. So now you can theorize how much more one gambit will be effective over another without going overboard and saying that in the formula .5x, x = 1,000 threat.
    From 2013

    Quote Originally Posted by Graalx2 View Post
    The 1/2x, 1x, 2x, and 3x values are still correct as far as the relationship between the various increased threat values. What has happened in Isengard is that the 'x' has greatly increased over what it was pre-Isengard.

    Any Wardens having issues holding threat should also try out the various legacies that increase threat. They were all increased at the same time.
    At no time has Turbine EVER given numbers to say that DPS = threat. I have been around since pretty close to this discussion and mostly read the forums every day since. Threat is only compared to other threat. Every thread is "I determined how much threat to dps by whacking on this mob". That is nothing official, nor is it anything but subjective. You can label it practical and empirical all you want, but that disagrees with anything officially stated.
    If Turbine wanted us to say "X DPS = Y Threat", during any of those bazillions of discussions you mentioned, they would have told us.
    Last edited by Darlgon; Jul 23 2013 at 02:31 AM.

 

 
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