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  1. #1
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    5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    So, gave Draigoch a go this afternoon after the patch. No pets, no LD, no one returned to the top of the instance... and after the first down of phase 3, he goes braindead, just as many of us have seen before. Legs are still attackable but after they die nothing, and no attacking. Guess that issue's still not fixed.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/012030000000b658d/01008/signature.png]Keirion[/charsig]

  2. #2
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    And they do try fixes for it each update so it's fairly obvious that not only do they know there's something wrong with it (despite their apparent gag order not to come out and talk about it), they are still probably actively and constantly working on it and haven't found *the* issue/fix yet.

    I just wish Turbine was more geared towards, or efficient in, getting smaller, faster patches out instead of one large one every month or two, so fixes for ongoing problems like Draiglitch over there that just can't be proven to be solved in limited QA testing, could have their kinks worked out faster and save everyone a lot of frustration, less venting and derision on the forums, etc.
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  3. #3
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shiara View Post
    And they do try fixes for it each update so it's fairly obvious that not only do they know there's something wrong with it (despite their apparent gag order not to come out and talk about it), they are still probably actively and constantly working on it and haven't found *the* issue/fix yet.

    I just wish Turbine was more geared towards, or efficient in, getting smaller, faster patches out instead of one large one every month or two, so fixes for ongoing problems like Draiglitch over there that just can't be proven to be solved in limited QA testing, could have their kinks worked out faster and save everyone a lot of frustration, less venting and derision on the forums, etc.
    Well put. Once you hit the two month mark... acceptable excuses grow fewer and fewer to pick from.

    If you can live through the transition from phase two to phase 3, get all claws down for the first attempt at a CJ... then you have, for all intents and purposes, conquered the fight. All that is left is the same monotony that you enjoyed for the first two phases. All that to say... killing off the dragon and bringing forth loot AND setting raid locks should be an easy solution from a GM WHILE this is being investigated. Further, if the GM's had to turn in reports on how many times they had to do this in a day, it might help escalate the issue just to free them up. It would also put less load on the poor reptile as tons of folks wouldn't be RETRYING failed attempts.

    You ever do this run without a burg? Its not horrible if you have guards and cappy's traited properly, although I still don't think it should favor one class. Anyway, we spent 4 hours in there a few nights ago. 3 attempts. Got all 12 CJs (without a burg) all 3 attempts. Bugged all 3 times. 4 hours. Didn't even get a t-shirt. :/

    When I go 2 weeks without internet my ISP starts compensating my bill for the next month... hint

  4. #4
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keirion View Post
    So, gave Draigoch a go this afternoon after the patch. No pets, no LD, no one returned to the top of the instance... and after the first down of phase 3, he goes braindead, just as many of us have seen before. Legs are still attackable but after they die nothing, and no attacking. Guess that issue's still not fixed.
    We had the same exact experience tonight. To the letter. We had a flawless run with no LD, and only one death in phase-1. Our 12th conj was completed at the beginning of phase-2, and we were into phase-3 within about 35-40 minutes. In phase-3 we got a second conj off on the first body-cycle, and when he got up, he never transitioned to aggro mode. Just as was stated above, we were able to continue DPSing the paws, but Draigoch never moved beyond his initial stand-up.

  5. #5
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Hoped they would fix his main bug, but oh well..u6 we're waiting and hoping.
    Nerf healing in PvMP and just maybe it will be worth it again.

  6. #6
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by bitman0101 View Post
    We had the same exact experience tonight. To the letter. We had a flawless run with no LD, and only one death in phase-1. Our 12th conj was completed at the beginning of phase-2, and we were into phase-3 within about 35-40 minutes. In phase-3 we got a second conj off on the first body-cycle, and when he got up, he never transitioned to aggro mode. Just as was stated above, we were able to continue DPSing the paws, but Draigoch never moved beyond his initial stand-up.
    Yup. We did 2 Conjs on that down cycle, too. I wonder if that's the link.

    PS. Just to clarify, this thread was made to inform the player base. Bug reports, etc. have been made and I know Turbine is doing what they can to squash this bug.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/012030000000b658d/01008/signature.png]Keirion[/charsig]

  7. #7
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Had him bug today on our server around 1.1 million morale.

    No fun. I think the dragon just likes to reset in that phase. He charges around and all just fine, but when he sits his bum down he can't think straight.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/132130000000011cf/01006/signature.png]Jessiriel[/charsig]
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  8. #8

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Like Keirion said, I think it's doing CJ's in the third phase. Ran it last week on my hunter, and first attempt it bugged, and we had a person use a CJ that popped up. Bugged at like 1.4 mil on this run. Second try, it worked like a charm. Raid decided that once we got to phase 3, and finished all the CJ's up, to not even click on the CJ windows. The other times I've run Draig, it seems it only even bugs when we do the CJ's in phase 3. There are probably other causes as well, but this seems to be one of the main ones.
    [b]The thought pierced him that in the end the Shadow was a small and passing thing: there was light and high beauty forever beyond its reach.” - J.R.R. Tolkien[/b]

  9. #9
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Oh come on guys! why fix Draigoch when you can reduce the trade in value of S4Ms to medallions or make sure hunters can't stack a fleetness buff, there is too much other stuff that really matters, honestly.

    Yes I know I'm sure it's more complicated and there are reasons probably tied to different peoples areas of responsibility, and I'm sure people have ample reason to say I'm unreasonable, but if I spent the kind of time some people are talking about I don't think I'd be happy either. Happily it has only bugged for me once (of the 6 times I've done it) so I'll just leave it at my 2c.
    Q. What state do you live in?
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  10. #10

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Are you guys using skills that stun? Tell everyone to not use skills that stun/daze/fear/etc. I haven't had it bug once since U5, and that's about 8 or so runs? The leader was constantly yelling at people to not use stuns though.

  11. #11
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by rhegan View Post
    Are you guys using skills that stun? Tell everyone to not use skills that stun/daze/fear/etc. I haven't had it bug once since U5, and that's about 8 or so runs? The leader was constantly yelling at people to not use stuns though.
    Not trying to sound rude, but that's a load of ####, you can use skills that stun all you want and it's not the cause it's just a theory that seems to be lucky enough that it could be correct. We did however have it bug out on us for the second time, and we've done it roughly 15+ times now. We usually run it twice a week to get cloaks and symbols. Our first bug was due to my LM pet, i had my raven out to help increase the fire damage from RK's, myself and hunters/wardens using fire oils. He went down and as soon as he rose, he had aggro on the pet and went brain dead. So i take the blame of my LM's pet. Tonight we had it bug again, but this is how we usually do it and i wanted to test something out that was different. Usually we get all 12 CJ's before phase 3(usually i mean by one of the fm guys have an issue of using the button and it goes grey for them so its a lagging issue), once phase 3 hits we don't use any CJ at this point and we get epic lootz. This time we did 2 CJ's for fun to see if it would help do dps(it did not) and after the second CJ, he rose and went braindead, we were able to attack one of the claws and as soon as transition came, it was bugged. So i will agree with the above statements saying that doing CJ's during phase 3 is a bad idea. More importantly this could also be another theory of course, but it seems to be a theory that is at least 95% true. Just saying.
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  12. #12

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Concerning CJs in 3rd phase - perhaps it's a timing issue, but in any case we've done CJs in the 3rd phase (post U5 some of the times actually ending him with the 12th CJ).

    Then again it bugged out nicely in a 6man with no pets, DCs, deaths or whatever.

  13. #13
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Did 2 more runs yesterday. First one, not CJs in third phase and he bugged out at 99k health after his third time down in the third phase. Now, that was disappointing.

    Second run, used CJs in the third phase and finally did get him down his third time down in the third phase. We had 2 burgs that run, so the entire thing just went quite a bit faster, which seemed to help.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/012030000000b658d/01008/signature.png]Keirion[/charsig]

  14. #14
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Keirion View Post
    Did 2 more runs yesterday. First one, not CJs in third phase and he bugged out at 99k health after his third time down in the third phase. Now, that was disappointing.

    Second run, used CJs in the third phase and finally did get him down his third time down in the third phase. We had 2 burgs that run, so the entire thing just went quite a bit faster, which seemed to help.
    Well this all depends too, did you get all 12 cj's before phase 3? mostly because we find doing cj's after the 12th is useless, because it only does 100k damage, which you can easily do in the 6ish second time frame with all 12 doing dps. Now doing the remaining cj's to finish your 12th one in phase 3, we have done and it didn't bug, and each of those did 5% of his maximum? morale, more or less it helps to usually save the remaining 4 on phase 3, because it goes down so fast. Truth be known, after some consideration, I believe it to be more a graphical error, this could be just me, but me and some kin mates have the same issue, that when a cj is done, there is a slight lag spike. I do believe that this lag spike could be causing the graphical brain dead error we are receiving. I don't know for sure, but its a possible idea, but either way, it all still leads to cj malfunction.
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  15. #15
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    What did people expect?

    And it isn't just to the disadvantage of Turbine. It prolongs the time you will spend with endgame content. If it was bug-free you could just ride it out and be done with the game, no?

  16. #16
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Darmokk View Post
    What did people expect?

    And it isn't just to the disadvantage of Turbine. It prolongs the time you will spend with endgame content. If it was bug-free you could just ride it out and be done with the game, no?
    In a way yes, being the fact LoTRO doesn't have enough content to keep a steady cycle for raiders to continue playing, they will get bored at one point of just farming one instance on a weekly basis. But even still the fact remains Draigoch is an old raid now and it continues to bug, what does that say to the community when the developers only shrug their shoulders and say " sorry try again". IMO Draigoch is just a filler to keep the players here while they decide on what to do next, once Orthanc is farmable, people will get bored and will want something new. I personally would like to see OD or maybe even Rift scaled to level, having more choices at raids will give incentive to play more for the PvEer's, I see more and more people leaving servers and the game due to lack of content, and with Draigoch being bugged, that leaves one instance for progression. And people will get tired of that soon, hopefully update 6 will add something new, more complaining im sure, but less complaining on the same subject at least.
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  17. #17

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    for what it's worth, my group has NEVER had him bug and we always save at least two FMs for third phase.

    Only the devs can find what the issue is. We mere peons can only guess and cause wild theories about stuns and bleeds and FM timing.

  18. #18

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dukito View Post
    Not trying to sound rude, but that's a load of ####, you can use skills that stun all you want and it's not the cause it's just a theory that seems to be lucky enough that it could be correct.
    Yeah, I guess so, since I don't have access to the code or what happens when it bugs, of course it's just a theory. Stuns do affect burglar skill rates, interferes with FM attempts, and this is an FM based fight. FMs going into stage 3 could also be part of it, or related to it - the issues are clearly interrelated.

    Quote Originally Posted by mrfigglesworth View Post
    for what it's worth, my group has NEVER had him bug and we always save at least two FMs for third phase.
    This is interesting (ish). All the runs I've been on also had 2-4 FMs left in phase 3.
    Last edited by rhegan; Jan 20 2012 at 06:22 AM.

  19. #19

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Here's a new bug for everyone (or new to me). Yesterday I led dragoich. At 1.4m morale he bugged. Same old same old...we reset instance and went at it again.

    Here's the new bug. We were in phase 3 down at the bottom. He rose up and we all ran to the safe spot by his tail. I started watching everyone gather by me and then the next thing we knew, everyone was dead! He not only set fire near where his head was, but he also set fire by his tail. While dead I was able to see the area by his head was on fire too. Anyone else have this problems?

    Come on programmers. Surely you can fix the old problems and not create new ones! Going 0/2 yesterday on bugs has caused me to stop leading and/or joining this raid which is sad because it provides so much gear for the kin.

  20. #20
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Amlost View Post
    Here's a new bug for everyone (or new to me). Yesterday I led dragoich. At 1.4m morale he bugged. Same old same old...we reset instance and went at it again.

    Here's the new bug. We were in phase 3 down at the bottom. He rose up and we all ran to the safe spot by his tail. I started watching everyone gather by me and then the next thing we knew, everyone was dead! He not only set fire near where his head was, but he also set fire by his tail. While dead I was able to see the area by his head was on fire too. Anyone else have this problems?

    Come on programmers. Surely you can fix the old problems and not create new ones! Going 0/2 yesterday on bugs has caused me to stop leading and/or joining this raid which is sad because it provides so much gear for the kin.
    There's a few things to this, did your tank move into position immediately? If he doesn't, Draigoch causes a "cave-in" to whoever has threat that isn't in Draigoch's LoS. This could be why you all died so suddenly. A lot of other tanks would say they have tanked him right behind his head, but i personally can say that doesn't work, whoever has threat, no matter who or what it is, has to be in front of him, or he causes the "cave-in". as for the fire pools that is wierd but i have seen graphical flaws where depending on your settings, does look like fire pools are surrounding you, especially if you never really paid attention to it from other attempts. I've had members with ultra settings not even see the fire pools when those with the lowest settings could, and vice versa. This sounds like a graphical error, and you guys probably got caved-in.

    Now we ran it again last night, and i personally tried everyone's theory in this thread here are teh results:

    1. Using my burglar i used every stun, cc, riddle, I could off cd to see if it would harm us, and it didn't, I also had champs spam clobber, hunters use rain of thorns and bards arrow, I had each toon use every type of cc they had to prove this theroy and nothing happened...he went down like clockwork.

    2. Using the burglar, I went gambler line(yes I was the only burglar there, and usually you trait QK for the feint attack Trip fm) and used every type of gamble possible, and nothing affected him. I had applied every bleed known possible i could while gambler traited...he still went down.

    3. We also used 2 FM's at phase 3, FM 11 and FM 12, then we didn't do any others, mostly because he went into phase 3 so soon, we didn't even pay attention, After the 12th FM, we ignored any others that popped up...and he still went down.

    Conclusion - Doesn't matter what you do it seems as far as skills or FM's as long as you get the 12th one, like i said it all seems to be theory based, but i still lean toward to graphical errors, if there is any sort of server lag or personal lag with the head itself, seems to bug him out.

    Oh on a further note, I would like to comment that those who QQ about "Why are you guys complaining about a raid that's old when there are bigger stuff like Orthanc?", well the fact being, everyone has to start somewhere, but for those who start late or at the bottom and they continuously get screwed at their progression to improve. This is why there are complaints, mind you this raid was suppose to be out back before OD, so the idea of this raid is at least a year old or close to it, and it still bugs, look how old OD is and tell me if it bugs still...
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0e215000000054256/01007/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  21. #21

    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    lol it wasn't a cave in. As I said before, we were out of combat in the safe spot waiting for him to plop down again. Instead of plopping down he decided to rain fire on us after he did it where he head was. We all died to 12-20k dmg from fire. About 2 feet away from me was the safe spot "dot".

  22. #22
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    A post in another thread is indicating that what might be happening there is that it's an anti-exploit measure. Since the claws do distributed damage, the whole DPS group is supposed to get hit by them as you're attacking them. The way it was before, ranged classes could ranged DPS the claws from the safe spot without taking damage. Now, it sounds like doing so will make him turn around and wipe the raid. Do you know if people were ranging the claws from the safe spot when you died?
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  23. #23
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Had him bug on us just a little bit ago. Had him at 1.8 mil after all the FM's were done. Didn't do anything that supposedly causes the bug, yet sure enough he froze, wings out, no targets, no question marks, no moving. And of course the GM can't do anything (not surprising, and not saying it's the GM's fault either).

    A bit ridiculous that after all this time they don't have it fixed yet. 3 hours of setting up the group, waiting to get started and doing the run lost for nothing. Not happy right now to say the least. And several in the group were very upset as they had the same thing happen to them last night as well.
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  24. #24
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gylve View Post
    A post in another thread is indicating that what might be happening there is that it's an anti-exploit measure. Since the claws do distributed damage, the whole DPS group is supposed to get hit by them as you're attacking them. The way it was before, ranged classes could ranged DPS the claws from the safe spot without taking damage. Now, it sounds like doing so will make him turn around and wipe the raid. Do you know if people were ranging the claws from the safe spot when you died?
    Yea. Heaven forbid that your party were using your class skills to advantage rather than doing it precisely the way the designers intended even though they couldn't bring themselves to design the environment well enough to naturally preclude the tactics. Much easier just to let anti-exploit waste everyone's time or add an insta-death attack.

  25. #25
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    Re: 5.1 Well... Draigoch still bugs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kongas View Post
    Yea. Heaven forbid that your party were using your class skills to advantage rather than doing it precisely the way the designers intended even though they couldn't bring themselves to design the environment well enough to naturally preclude the tactics. Much easier just to let anti-exploit waste everyone's time or add an insta-death attack.
    I'm not quite sure that finding a spot to get out of combat during a phase in which you're supposed to remain in-combat technically qualifies as "using your class skills to your advantage".

 

 
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