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  1. #151
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    I tried running ToF in Gortheron T2 today. While I could lock one mob down easy, anger and genus specific CC made anything more near impossible. Since we had no LM it worked out well enough, but given the option I'd pick a good LM over myself any day.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0b20c000000069736/01005/signature.png]Smugo[/charsig]

  2. #152

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    No, no, go ahead and listen to the people that state "Hunter CC is fine as it is even without traiting Yellow"

    lols at them.
    My other Warhorse is a Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit,[I] Defiant-Class[/I], [I]U.S.S. Say My Name[/I], NCC-93144

  3. #153
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Eckenbrand View Post
    No, no, go ahead and listen to the people that state "Hunter CC is fine as it is even without traiting Yellow"

    lols at them.
    show me just one existing situation where you really have the need of more CC instead of more DPS. in my eyes not even FD had situations where the additional CC was needed - dealing more dps was the easier way.

    i mean its fine to have a traitline with that abilities. but for what having such a traitline if you normally do not need this, cause your others are far more helpfully.

    for me there is just one problem with the current traitline, the cooldown on Purge Poison (rest of the trailine is mostly* fine for me) and the missing situation where this traitline gives you an advantage.

    *in cambat traps should also effect your Set Snare trap
    Last edited by Milithion; Dec 10 2011 at 08:24 AM.
    Es grüßt General HauptmannMilithion - Held der Ettenöden

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  4. #154

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    It's like saying "Champions shouldn't be able to Tank because there's not one situation where a Champion needs to Tank instead of more DPS"

    Now go through the entire list of classes.

    By your logic, we should only have 1 tank class, 1 healer class, and a bunch of different DPS classes, since DPS, apparently, is the answer to everything, since

    i mean its fine to have a traitline with that abilities. but for what having such a traitline if you normally do not need this, cause your others are far more helpfully.
    Yeah, right.
    My other Warhorse is a Fleet Tactical Escort Retrofit,[I] Defiant-Class[/I], [I]U.S.S. Say My Name[/I], NCC-93144

  5. #155
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Eckenbrand View Post
    It's like saying "Champions shouldn't be able to Tank because there's not one situation where a Champion needs to Tank instead of more DPS"

    Now go through the entire list of classes.

    By your logic, we should only have 1 tank class, 1 healer class, and a bunch of different DPS classes, since DPS, apparently, is the answer to everything, since
    hey the champion tankline is well nedded if you do not have any tanks to hand. buts that not the same like to say you need the full hunter trapper line if you have no lore-master or burglar to hand.
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  6. #156
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    It seems I came a bit late to the party already but I do hope you take the time to also read the replies from a longtime hunter (since the start of the game) which are found a bit later in the thread. I can agree with you that the hunter does not require much buffs on the dps front but we do require some changes nonetheless. I think the hunter problems are these 3:


    Disappointment with the new skills: Hunters art and Split Shot

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    Hunter's Art is changed
    My thought for Hunters Art are:
    • Slightly increase damage
    • Re-work buff a little: Now lasts for 30 seconds. Instead of stacking multiple effects, it now tiers up and refreshes duration, much like a RK's Writs.
    These changes do sound good (especially the stacking of effects) but I do miss a discussion on the buffs themselves. The current amount of Finesse on hunters is so high that even on raid bosses b/p/e does not happen. Could you consider to change or add minus miss chance (which does happen a lot of raid bosses). The power buff in endurance is also very lackluster and it may be worthwhile to add or change it to minus threat since that is the main reason why I (and I believe most hunters) would use endurance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    • Stop the additional target legacy from effecting it (This was added near the end of beta, and was the reason the damage and radius had to be reduced, the skill was just WAY too strong. Removing the legacy lets us make the skill more exciting in other ways...)
    • Modify it to give +1 focus per target hit
    • Slightly increase radius
    • Slightly increase damage
    Changes sound good but isn’t it possible for you to allow the weapon legacy to add at least something? It is a very expensive legacy which deserves to have at least some effect.


    Disappointment (still) in Trapper of Foes
    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    I'm really hesitant here. The amount of CC and fellowship-damage buffs in the line, plus the complete removal of the old damage penalties, and loosening of the stance restrictions, makes for a potent combination. I fully admit that the Trapper line from days past was sub-par, but even then there were players who were able to do some impressive things with it. My sense is that the opposition to this line is more based on gut then experience.
    I understand why you are hesitant here. I have used this line in the past and have used it in its current state. Primarily the CC of this line is on par if not better than LMs and burgs allowing us to CC big groups for about 30 seconds and 2 perma mezzes or fears/roots which is the reason why I use(d) it. The problem is that CC is hardly if ever required in this game. The mobs which we would want to CC are immune while the trash gets dps’d down in seconds by proper groups and roots are generally broken by tanks within seconds. Why not create larger groups of really overpowered mobs which have to be CC’d? It is a big flaw in the current content design. So in general I would only trait for the debuffs (since CC is not required) when using this line and I hope you can agree with me that only the debuffs are not worth it.

    The second problem is that the individual traits of this line are unattractive and unfocussed. We require to trait 3 traits to make our trap potent which is a single skill (while in-combat) with a 30 seconds cooldown (on top of that the skill is decent at best damage wise). The rest of the traits would fit the other traitlines better with traits like -10% threat (really not a problem while in ToF) or minus power costs. This traitline is a mishmash of the leftovers of the red and blue line.

    My conclusion is that you should never have removed the damage penalty (the hunters who were whining about this are the same hunters who will never use this line even if they had to hand in a really tiny bit of dps.) Take the debuffing of this line way further so it becomes useful AND noticeable in fellowship/raid situations. On top of that wouldn’t it be more logical for this line to focus more on melee while red/blue stay ranged (I am aware that the blue line was intented to be that but I feel like it would fit this line more). I hope this helps you.

    Survivability of the hunter
    I feel like this is not the focus at all of your update while I think it should be. The hunter’s “oh ####” skills have been neglected or downright nerfed. Please read my arguments before you decide to address this issue or just leave it as it is.

    Desperate Flight: This skill lacks usefulness in fellowships and raids and ofcourse pvp (after the nerf). I understand why it had to be nerfed but it should’ve been changed instead of just removed. The new desperate flight should allow the hunter to retreat from battle (drop to stealth or something similar) for 10-15 seconds in dire situations (+/- 25%-40% morale), unable to use skills but able to move, unable to take damage. This would allow a healer (if around) to heal the hunter which would let him return to the fight and continue. However if the group did not manage to survive this would only postpone the hunter his death (seems balanced to me).

    Improved Press Onward: I think it has been forgotten that this skill is supposed to be a legendary skill of the hunter and not a regular buff. In dire situations this skill does not benefit the hunter at all since 3 seconds induction is too long to wait while you are dying. Make the heal imidiate and the power buff over time (or at the end of the 3 seconds). This allows the hunter to heal himself quickly while having to wait for the full effect to apply.
    Bow of the righteous: I think a lot of the hunters use this skill because there are not enough worthwhile alternatives and some extra power can never hurt (right?). Could you check whether this skill have been properly scaled and maybe try to make it more interesting. Let it add some nice effects to some skills or change it altogether.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    1) Bright Campfire is changed to provide more In-combat and OOC buffs
    The OOC regen amounts were nearly doubled in the last update, but I'll take another look at them. In-combat is an interesting idea, perhaps wrap this into the Trapper Line somehow...
    I feel that the OOC buff should be at the level of food but any improvement is welcome ofcourse.

    Thanks for reading,

    Brave Sir Robin
    Last edited by Brave.Sir.Robin; Dec 10 2011 at 11:39 AM.

  7. #157
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Brave.Sir.Robin View Post
    [...words...]
    I agree with pretty much everything, the only part I don't agree with is the bit on ToF, but that's because I have no idea how to fix that mess. I particularly like the bit on press onward and DF, I agree both could use some buffing.
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  8. #158
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    Good thread. I'll give my thoughts on the top 10.

    1) Bright Campfire is changed to provide more In-combat and OOC buffs
    The OOC regen amounts were nearly doubled in the last update, but I'll take another look at them. In-combat is an interesting idea, perhaps wrap this into the Trapper Line somehow...
    The problem is Bright Campfire is simply that groups don't care about OOC regen. People have food for that and the vast majority of groups will just plow ahead unless the instance has mechanics that force stopping at certain points (ie Dark Delving).

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    2) Hunter's Art is changed
    My thought for Hunters Art are:
    • Slightly increase damage
    • Re-work buff a little: Now lasts for 30 seconds. Instead of stacking multiple effects, it now tiers up and refreshes duration, much like a RK's Writs.
    Now that sounds good. Hunters Art isn't so much a problem of what it does, as the cost of doing of using it and the annoyance of keeping a 10-second buff going when there are other things the player has to watch that are a higher priority.
    One thing to consider though, please think about making stance-changes a higher priority in the que than inductions. So many times I've wanted to drop from S:P to S:E, hit the hotkey to do so, and it didn't happen because the Swift Bow/ Barbed Arrow/ Quick Shot I had already que'ed blocked the action.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    3) Split Shot is changed
    My thoughts for Split shot are:
    • Stop the additional target legacy from effecting it (This was added near the end of beta, and was the reason the damage and radius had to be reduced, the skill was just WAY too strong. Removing the legacy lets us make the skill more exciting in other ways...)
    • Modify it to give +1 focus per target hit
    • Slightly increase radius
    • Slightly increase damage
    Kind of sad about this - I like the current implementation for a number of reasons. The biggest being it works well with Arrow Storm to keep the focus coming and the small radius means I don't have to worry about a mobs sudden move three steps in the wrong direction resulting in it's breaking whatever CC is up.

    However I'll wait and see what happens. If it does give extra focus per target hit without needing a critical hit it might be worth the trade-off.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    4) Adjust or blow up the Trapper Line
    I'm really hesitant here. The amount of CC and fellowship-damage buffs in the line, plus the complete removal of the old damage penalties, and loosening of the stance restrictions, makes for a potent combination. I fully admit that the Trapper line from days past was sub-par, but even then there were players who were able to do some impressive things with it. My sense is that the opposition to this line is more based on gut then experience.
    Partially on past experience yes, but also on just how meaningless CC has become as the game has aged. When players didn't have massive morale pools and inflated damage it was useful because the regular monsters in an instance could easily overwhelm even the best tank if something went wrong so it was important to split up the fight. Now though players complain if the tank doesn't round up all the mobs so the group can nuke them down because they think it's slowing down the instance (I know, a stupid concern given it's a game but these are people we're talking about, not logical beings). it's only rare cases (typically where the mechanics of a fight force CC to be used) that it actually becomes important and for those times groups will take one of the dozens of Lore Masters running around or possibly a burglar as they both bring other things (power batteries & disease/ wound clearing or FM-dispenser) to the table.

    Personally I think you were on the right track with the idea of reducing the lines CC and increasing it's debuffing capabilities but the problem is that the most desired debuff was put onto the trap. Solo or with serious friends that isn't an issue because it's not a big deal for someone to adjust the mobs position so the desired one runs over the trap. In a typical group (PUG or kin or even in-game friend) it's a whole different story. Even when the trap is a tripwire that could give a free FM, people still would rather tank a monster in place than take the 5-10 seconds needed to convince it to run over the trap. Again it's a stupid resistance, but humans tend to be a stupid species who violently resist any change from what they know.

    My suggestion is to take a page out of Blizzards book - one of the biggest changes for hunters in the first two expansions was that the Survival talent tree (which is akin to Trapper of Foes in purpose) gained two non-CC things that groups wanted. A debuff (later changed to a buff) that increased melee damage to the target and a buff that restored power over time to the group. Find two things groups want but can't handily get, make them the three and four-trait bonuses for the line (moving group-wide poison to the 2-piece bonus or it's own trait). Right now I can think of two items that fit the bill. First a group-wide power-restoration that activates on a critical hit from Penetrating Shot, Blood Arrow, or Merciful Shot and deliver all the less power than a Captain's Rally Cry when Now for Wrath is traited but delivers all that power in one lump sum instead of over time. The second one being to replace the B/P/E debuff on Penetrating Shot (since finesse does the same thing but it much more common) with an increase to incoming damage that increases as the number of ToF traits slotted increase.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    5) Induction/focus crit and power legacies are consolidated, one for crit, one for power
    I'd like to make a pass on Legacies, but I can't promise when. The fact remains that Hunter DPS is high, and consolidation will push it higher, so it's a difficult place to be in. In previous Hunter updates the class was behind the curve, allowing me to hand out buffs more freely.
    When ever you do make a pass on legacies, please consider having one person do it for all classes instead of the person doing each class also making the changes. One of the things that kind of annoys some of us is that there seems to be several different approaches for legacies that vary by class.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    6) Scale and/or update Heartseeker and Shot Through The Heart
    Can you be more specific? Do you mean damage increase? Cause Heartseeker seems just fine to me...
    It's fine in that it hits hard against "typical" targets. But against the ever-escalating amount of mitigations found in PvMP and upper-end monsters the damage hasn't caught up with the other shots. Basically we're starting to see yet again cases where it's better to use an attack that hits nearly as hard but doesn't give warning and can be combined with other shots to deliver more damage in the same amount of time it takes to fire one Heart Seeker. Given that it is still our longest-induction shot and has a cooldown that prevents it from being used in every fight (plus that annoying-as-hell "hey I'm TARGETING YOU" crosshairs) we do have reason to expect that this is the sort of attack that if it does land hurts. Not as in the "ouch, that stings" hurt but the "omg heal me! Heal me!" hurt.

    Maybe instead of trying to increase the raw damage (which will start yet another whinefest from monster players about how "OP hunters are!" based on devastating crits against low-ranked wargs), just have Heart Seeker ignore any mitigations and remove the can not miss on even level targets. That way it's still survivable if the target has enough morale but it will consistently hit hard enough to actually make it a feared ability in the Moors and something to consider using against high-mitigation targets in PvE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    7) Ranged Interrupt
    Sorry, Hunters will not be getting an additional Interrupt.
    It doesn't have to be "another" interrupt. The problem with our current one (as nice as it is to finally have one) is that we have to practically be on top of the target to use it. Soloing it's fine because 9 out of 10 times the target we want to interrupt is already in our faces, but when we're in a group and hanging back out of AoE range the time it takes to run up, stop and wait for the server to realize we've stopped, then hit Blindside and have the animation take effect means that except for extremely long (and generally unstoppable) inductions we've already missed the chance.

    If you don't want to add another interrupt to avoid monsters needing anti-interrupt buff, then consider flipping the order of attacks in Blindside and giving the ranged component a... well range.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    8) Buff Quickshot (on the move, no induction and/or stanceless slow)
    Unlikely to see significant change here. Induction-less was attempted during beta and it was too problematic to stay around. As for on the move, such a change would need to be paired with a range reduction, or a reduction in the potency of the Hunters slows. This is not a direction we are planning on moving in.

    9) Blindside's interrupt comes at the beginning of the animation
    Will do, absolutely.

    10) Needful Haste's pre-ROI duration is restored
    If Needful Haste is not worth using in the new state, it can be buffed.

    The topics I'm most interested in hearing feedback about are my ideas on Split Shot and Hunters Art, and to hear from players who used to use Trapper before RoI, and how they feel the line has changed since.

    Edit: Just to clarify, things I'm talking about here are potentials for Update 6. Update 5 is very much put to bed at this point.

  9. #159

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    I am up for the changes in split shot and hunter's art, right now they are not worth it, the increased duration or tiered effect sound both as good options for hunter's art, as people is saying something needs to be done about animation too.
    Heart seeker is good, but please remove the damn yellow reticle!!!

    Yellow trait line, trash it!!!! make it support and debuff
    Trait 1 for campfire to give a small power over time to fellow in a similar way to rune keeper stone.
    Trait 2 a skill with longish cd puts an incoming ranged damage in target, maybe could be tiered
    Trait 3 improved strenght of the earth gives power back in AoE to fellow
    Trait 4 snare in barbed as it is but move it to blue trait line and bring earthborn to the yellow.
    Trait 5 a skill will reduce critical defenses in target
    Trait 6 trash actual df, df should be an sprint or an increased evade (similar to ba moving target), if traited affects the whole fellow
    Trait 7 traps provide a constant debuff on increased incoming damage to whoever is on top of them, without breaking them, thinking in blight, fire trap from ba, sticky tar
    Cap stone: Heart seeker puts 1 minute debuff increasing target incoming damage greatly, this would stack up with trait 2, HS can be shot every 2 minutes although with lower damage?
    The bonuses for going deep into this path should enhance the different aspects of the traits.

    New legacies created to enhance this new trait line, increasing debuff manigtudes and power returns.

    Overall I still think that red line should be the static artillery cannon and blue trait line the kiting quick hunter, and I'd like to see more work in these lines.
    Aleatar (HNT) Altuntun (MNS) Alearwyn (CPT) Aleawen (WRD) Alearelda (BRG) Aleariel (RK) Alearan (LM) Aleathelion (GRD)
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  10. #160
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Aleatar View Post
    Trait 6 trash actual df, df should be an sprint or an increased evade (similar to ba moving target), if traited affects the whole fellow
    Sounds rather OP to me, I really like the rest of the ideas though.
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  11. #161
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    I think it's telling that not one person has chimed in yet to say Trapper is good.

  12. #162

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Smugo View Post
    I tried running ToF in Gortheron T2 today. While I could lock one mob down easy, anger and genus specific CC made anything more near impossible. Since we had no LM it worked out well enough, but given the option I'd pick a good LM over myself any day.
    I actually did Gortheron T2 Hm this past weekend to get us warmed up for Tower since Gotheron is a mechanics driven fight and just have fun. Anyway, you should be able to hold down two even with anger debuff if you have a CC bow bc Distracting shot's cd is halfed. Also use the cry of the predator and dazing blow (with trait to put in on a 50s cd) to wipe the anger debuff. distracting shot and bards arrow can be used to lock them down. it is highly dependent on the mob type if you want to lock down 2 though.

    In response to others, I agree LM's have an advantage, but I often go CC if we are short on LM's. Honestly, I would rather take a fully geared hunter that knows what he is doing than pug an LM because we are one short...but most of the time this is not the case.
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  13. #163
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by kballard View Post
    In response to others, I agree LM's have an advantage, but I often go CC if we are short on LM's. Honestly, I would rather take a fully geared hunter that knows what he is doing than pug an LM because we are one short...but most of the time this is not the case.
    I fully agree with this, and as I pointed out earlier it's unlikely to be the case often enough to matter much which is why most of the ToF stuff is likely to be rather irrelevant anyway except to the small group who like playing strategy solo stuff, and the few who who through boredom or lack of an LM just want to play a different way.

    I dunno, I'm not playing LOTRO currently (nor anything else really, just busy) I just think largely for me I'm at a point where time is at too much of a premium and I'm getting used to the idea of not grouping, which largely I thank ZC for because while the hunter isn't/wasn't broken useless, it just lacked any woohoo factor, and standing next to nearly any other class it seemed like we were the only ones standing still.

    I don't think fixing ToF will change any of that and while HA and Spshot fixes will go a long way to feeling like the class has finally been paid some meaningful attention, ultimately this was ALL said in beta ROI, here we are saying "told ya so" at update 5, being placated with probably in update 6 we will address it. To me that's just not good enough really, but it's summer here so I'll see how things go in the winter.
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  14. #164
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Ding! Split shot... Move Barbed Hindrance to split shot. Leave everything else regarding the skill as is. You're welcome.

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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    As for me, three things top my list to delete from the taskbar entirely.

    Bright campfire. Just do away with it or make it an emote. Just what does it bring to the table again?
    Default trap. Ditto. We will either need to make or purchase or maybe they could drop occasionally.
    Split shot. lose it or do something with it that makes it worth using.

    Im thinking there maybe could be a couple more that could just be dropped from the hunter repertriore (did I spell that wrong) to allow for some of the really nifty ideas put forth in this thread. Who do I call to get the ball rolling?
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  16. #166
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Eckenbrand View Post
    It's like saying "Champions shouldn't be able to Tank because there's not one situation where a Champion needs to Tank instead of more DPS"

    Now go through the entire list of classes.

    By your logic, we should only have 1 tank class, 1 healer class, and a bunch of different DPS classes, since DPS, apparently, is the answer to everything, since



    Yeah, right.
    Nicely said. I agree that the QQing about ToF is a little ridiculous. It's our secondary role, of course we shouldn't be as good at it as an LM. Also we can both DPS and CC at the same time better than an LM can, so we really don't have a lot to be upset about IMO. Do I use ToF? Not often. But I sure do when we only have one LM in OD wing that needs two CC classes.

    ToF needs to be more utilitarian if the devs ever want us to use it regularly. Inductions needs lowered BPE (keep resist of course) ranged stun skills needs to stop, our ability to buff should be better than it is or it simply won't be used unless you're short on burgs and LMs.

  17. #167
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Zombie_Columbus View Post
    9) Blindside's interrupt comes at the beginning of the animation
    Will do, absolutely.
    Can someone explain to me in plain english what this means?

    To me, the problem with Blind Side is always that it needs to wait until the skill queue of the previous skill is fully done before activating, thus half the time my interrupt is late. Wouldn't changing this from "Melee" to "Immediate Skill" fix this?

  18. #168
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Currently the interrupt is part way through the animation, so you have to wait for the skill to go off, and then wait for the intterupt. With it at the beginning you just have to wait for the skill to go off. It's still not perfect, but it will be an improvement on how it is currently.
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  19. #169
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Able to set your own camp anywhere for the cost of gold for a hunter to return to.
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  20. #170
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    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by Ezial View Post
    Able to set your own camp anywhere for the cost of gold for a hunter to return to.
    How about :
    Add Hunter port to Celondim or Duillond?
    Add Hunter port to Misty Mts.
    Add Hunter port to Lothlorien.
    Add Hunter port to Trollshaw (not Rivendell)?

  21. #171
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    N. Gate, Grams
    Posts
    1,002

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    Quote Originally Posted by LadyDena View Post
    How about :
    Add Hunter port to Celondim or Duillond? Yea maybe, Thorins gate is good enough though, imo.
    Add Hunter port to Misty Mts. Rivendell
    Add Hunter port to Lothlorien. Mirkwood port , take the boat right over
    Add Hunter port to Trollshaw (not Rivendell)? Rivendell is good enough.



    ..............................
    Ridduk R14 WL
    Brandywine

  22. #172
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    437

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    I would like to have Barbed Hindrance moved from Yellow to Blue line.
    And Rapid Recovery from Blue to Yellow line.

    Makes more sense to me, I though that Trapper is for CC/Corruption removal/Support etc. With Rapid Recovery you can use Dazing Blow more often. On the other hand, Huntsmen need to slow better with their Bleed damage skill.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/2a21c01000010d221/signature.png]Morkorga[/charsig]
    Faileon R10 - Nub Hunter...

    [b]Mess with the best, die like the rest.[/b]

  23. #173
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    2

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    i would like SotE in move. it was survival.

  24. #174
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Forums
    Posts
    59

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    (edit)
    Sorry for long post, didn't realize I went that long winded
    (/edit)
    After reading the first few pages, and skimming to the end (hot topic here really).

    I (while not remembering the numbers) like the idea of improving HA (i only use in endurance stance when i'm royally screwed for power--which is very rare). The animation is too long for pratical use, and the bonuses are quite lacking (+10% damage per use S:S isn't bad but duration too short for pratical use).

    Split shot has promise, but even in Skirm raids with 2 tanks holding everything while standing on top of one another rarely hits more than 2 targets (with +AoE legacy). So increasing the target area would be nice. As I suggested on a previous post (read rant) make the range/# of hits vary with distance. If you target is 1m from you, and you can hit 4 targets with SS, it becomes 4 hits on 1 target. If target is @ 20m range, AOE = ~5m, and # of hits per target ranges from 1-[Max # targets/2] based on # of targets in area (after all, the arrows have spread out some from being shot). If target is @ 40m (max range), AOE= 10m with only 1 hit per target (face it your 4 arrows shot from your bow at once are now spread in a wide arc). Is a change like this possible, I doubt it. Would it really amp the value of SS, yes--possibly to the point of OP, but we can all dream right?

    (random thought)
    change Shot through the Heart to ADD a high DoT/Second (not pulses/ X seconds) on a Crit, with .5% increase of DoT with Dev...after all, shooting something in the heart is a wound that bleeds a hell of a lot. (fatal in most cases)


    Hunter Heal--we have 4 heals, a Pot, Press Onward, ISotE, and Agile Rejoinder.
    1) can't change the functionality of a Pot.....
    2) Press Onward--if you're using this, you're pretty much up a creek, and are probably gonna die due to an interrupted induction.. Fix: remove induction, or reduce induction and make un-interruptable.
    3) Even with Legacy and Earthborn this isn't a very good heal, would prefer to see this skill become an Instant w/ over time bonus much like the Captain's Rallying Cry with Now for Wrath traited.
    4)Agile Rejoinder--would like to see this provide a much larger instant (500-1000) with same HoT (~120/pulse)

    New suggestion (maybe)

    will this one be liked, probably not, but why not give us a larger assortment of oils, allowing for more damage types (currenlty 3 max--fire, light, and whatever we've put on our bows through scrolls)

    Which reminds me... the new skills don't reflect the change in damage type that oils apply. Recently the devs fixed Barbed arrow so it applies a DoT in line with any applied oil, but the new skills will always do damage in line with the bow, ignoring any applied oils.

    Other comments.

    I saw many comments about wanting a boosted evade with a different skill. We have a legacy that boosts parry AND evade with the use of Swift Stroke. I wonder if it would be possible to make swift stroke a ranged/melee skill based on range from target, where if it becomes a ranged attack, the legacy only buffs Evade, yet it remains unchanged if it is a melee skill. It would give us another ranged attack, and a bit more defence.

    Some miss the days of Huntanks. I personally don't believe the hunter was ever meant to be a tank, can we take a hit or 2, yes, but out and out tank, no. We are a DPS class after all.

    A final thought: I've seen many expressions of displeasure towards ZC, and I would like to point out (though i'm not happy with the dev team in general right now) that ZC and the other Devs are working the priority list:

    1) Do what WB tells them to do [may be swapped with #2]
    2) Do what Turbine tells them to do [may be swapped with #1]
    3) answer the community.
    Last edited by Laspher; Dec 29 2011 at 05:49 PM.

  25. #175
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    2,338

    Re: What the hunters need - A guide for ZC

    - Fix Hunter's Art. I never use the skill. Animation is long and ugly... disrupts combat flow and aggro starts before you even have an arrow out. The ICPR buff is ridiculous when you waste more power using the skill then the power returns...

    - Induction/focus crit and power legacies are consolidated, one for crit, one for power

    - Agile Rejoinder always gives heal. Rework the legacy.

    - Remove or decrease Distracting Shot induction when full trapper. The induction time makes it difficult to position mobs in Orthanc.
    Razor // Lusitanius // Crickhollow ~ Portuguese Kinship //

 

 
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