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  1. #2926
    Quote Originally Posted by Tarmas_Eldar View Post

    There is no organised plan to get 4 OPs. They flip randomly and individual freeps flip them for the quest, without giving a moment's thought to the effect on the action.
    While this is usually the case it was not like that today Tarm, Fail and friends were continuously flipping the op's to 4 blue.
    The end is near, the ring will melt, but not if I can help it!

  2. #2927
    Why do you think it was Faerdo? It was me you nab, look just got this one today - A New Title Has Been Bestowed Upon You!
    You may now be known as Stygian-1, Flipper of the Outposts!

  3. #2928
    Do try to read what I wrote, I repeat it for you: 'and friends', maybe, just maybe you are one of those?
    The end is near, the ring will melt, but not if I can help it!

  4. #2929
    I just told you it was me flipping ops all day not Faerdo.

  5. #2930
    Quote Originally Posted by Stygian-1 View Post
    I just told you it was me flipping ops all day not Faerdo.
    It matters not who the initiator of the flipping sessions was Styg, I know I saw not only you with your support at the frequent flipping but also Faerdo and only occasionally someone else.

    And gz on your awesome (self-proclaimed?) title, you got that bored with pvp?
    The end is near, the ring will melt, but not if I can help it!

  6. #2931
    Tbh we had our proverbials handed to us most of the night, it was only around 9:30pm ish that it evened out and even then we was still taking a good hammering.....

  7. #2932
    naah, its a title from hidden deed .
    And yes, i am bored, not much fun in pvp these days.
    At least we had many fights in outposts yesterday :P

  8. #2933
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    scotland uk
    Posts
    124

    Raid Leaders

    Over the last couple of weeks other peeps on freep have taken on the challenge of leadin freep raids which gives the feel of something different whilst fightin the creeps,however, it would aslo be gr8 to see creeps take on same role rather than have the evening raid log in flip map and only want to fight in keeps where they know its only a lag fest( not a critism btw leaders have their own tacts). At the end of the day im sure most peeps would agree predictability is kinda boring,turbine/warner aint in the near future gonna change moors for us ,so why not as a server pull together and change the state of play ourselves.

  9. #2934
    Do you idiots that flip ops all the time think sometimes about the other side?
    Ratkille- Daginon, Dan... You said they are just doing quest. Really? Doing quests whole day? 4 ops whole fkn day blue. And you are protecting them. Gj man. Once i thought you are fair player. By keeping their side you are not much different than them.

    /sigh

  10. #2935
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Suffolk Uk
    Posts
    200
    Quote Originally Posted by BrekkaSrbenda View Post
    Do you idiots that flip ops all the time think sometimes about the other side?
    Ratkille- Daginon, Dan... You said they are just doing quest. Really? Doing quests whole day? 4 ops whole fkn day blue. And you are protecting them. Gj man. Once i thought you are fair player. By keeping their side you are not much different than them.

    /sigh

    Wait one min! why have i got into this!, Arrostorm was only saying about creep raid leaders, what's that got to do about it, the only person that fliped the map last night was sharn!i didn't flip anything when i was leading but then i gave lead to Rokkin. Just grow up and move on that i am NEVER! comming back on creep on eldar, thats why my WL in on snowy now! aslo you don't QQ about some of your kin members and other people that flip 24/7! i don't flip 24/7 do I!

  11. #2936
    Quote Originally Posted by Rattkille View Post

    Wait one min! why have i got into this!, Arrostorm was only saying about creep raid leaders, what's that got to do about it, the only person that fliped the map last night was sharn!i didn't flip anything when i was leading but then i gave lead to Rokkin. Just grow up and move on that i am NEVER! comming back on creep on eldar, thats why my WL in on snowy now! aslo you don't QQ about some of your kin members and other people that flip 24/7! i don't flip 24/7 do I!
    I dont give a dam are you coming to creep side, really. Its your choice to play whatever you want. This is why i mentioned you now :

    Quote Originally Posted by Rattkille View Post
    i have seen all 4OP's red and you don't see me and others shame people taking it. People only do the quest this is same for both side, atm the OP's and not changing anything at this time, this will never stop with people flipping them all the time, you can NOT make people take them, and no need to shame then too! that's not right and i feel sry for anyone that dose that should not be happing, if you don't like it don't play!
    Point - Dont protect the ppl that are ruining action by taking 4 outposts. They are not only doing it cause of the quest like you said.
    And yes, i told my kinnies to stop doing that or helping, one of them was beginner and i think he will/is stopped doing so.

  12. #2937
    Quote Originally Posted by Gwyndor View Post
    A RANT TO END ALL RANTS!!!

    I'm so very sorry people. But enough is enough! The time has come to just go completely and utterly MAD, and let it all out. I really, really REALLY do not give a damn anymore . . . . !!!!!

    Here comes a massive tirade, aimed mostly at turbine. If you don't like walls of text, just move along.



    I had a long chat with Ekla the other day. It came as a pleasant surprise to me that his thought aligned almost totally with mine. He suggested I do a write up of what is wrong with the moors, and come up with some solutions. I laughed. What a waste a time, I said. Who cares anymore? Turbine certainly don’t. And what makes you think I can say anything that hasn’t been said a thousand times before? Besides, the troll brigade will show up in very short order and chirp-chirp away that I’m just a creep QQer. No thanks mate.

    Well, I changed my mind. Here follows the last rant, the rant of all rants. It’s quite a bad tempered one, so it won’t be pretty. The opinions are my own. Some of you will no doubt strongly disagree. A few may even be offended. That is not my intent. If you want a slanging match because of it, carry on. Troll away by all means. I’m past caring.

    **

    The Ettenmoors is just a sorry, sorry mess at the moment. Turbine have totally mishandled this update. I thought it couldn’t possibly be worse than RoR. But now PvP is wrecked. The game as a whole is on its last legs. And all our concerns are met with silence, and there are SO many. They litter thread after thread after thread. No one at turbine has shown even the slightest sign of doing anything about it, or even giving a damn. When you consider the almost TOTAL lack of engaging, productive end game content at the moment, all that is really left to do is the Moors. But it is in chaos. However… one update to the Moors would make it once again a perfectly viable end-game theatre. I am quite positive that it COULD very easily be restored to functional order once again - if turbine wanted to make the effort.

    I’ll put myself in their shoes for just a moment. If I was on their staff I would take my list of these ‘things to do’ to the next dev meeting, based on my observations on PvP, and cause a proper scene. I would really go to town! For God’s sake, this stuff isn’t rocket science! There are simple things YOU, TURBINE, could do to fix this! And I’m not even talking about all the bugs, or exploiting/macroing/clubbing and problems of this sort, nor the terrible laaaaag, or any of the other numerous game mechanics and policies, or even taking into account suggestions of new maps or new classes -- or any of the myriad other issues.

    Right at this moment I’m just talking about the BASIC STUFF. COMBAT 1.01! But also, as you will see, the trouble far exceeds just combat and the Ettenmoors. It runs throughout every aspect of the game, and deep into its very foundations - which I believe are starting to crack. Ultimately, I wish Lotro could revisit an earlier game model, say the Shadows of Angar or Moria. Of course, if that model would yield turbine less profit than the current one, they would never consider it. That’s the sad reality of our world today, where for the large corporation profit is god, and people are nothing.

    But let’s just say they did want to roll things back, or just make a few radical changes. Some may sound completely crazy to you, others totally impractical. But do not desperate problems call for desperate solutions? And could it be any worse than it is right now? With work Ettenmoors COULD be repaired and re-conditioned, and go a long way to making PvP a far better experience for everyone! I’m talking about fights that are open, fair, and above all else FUN! That’s my key word here, FUN. Where has the fun gone?

    Of course everybody has their own idea of what ‘fun’ is. I understand that many players may well have a completely different viewpoint in how they define the word ‘fun’, and in how they approach the game and play it for their personal entertainment. Just look at the petty lamers, ez-moders, and exploiters that we see. They, I assume, are just doing it to have fun, not really caring about much else. Maybe these terms are a little harsh. Maybe a lot of players are just young. And that isn’t their fault. Young means inexperienced. Young means attitude: young, brash, and cocky as hell. We were all young, right? It would be wrong to judge them, and I’ve been guilty of doing so in the past. For that I apologise.

    So if there really is a proliferation of young players right now, then they probably understand, identify with, and quite probably WANT a different type of game to me, and to some of you. They want to kick the #### out of everything the moment they aggro it. They want fast thrills and instant success. Quite possibly what has happened is that Turbine have been listening to these young voices, and making provision for them. Who knows? I’m just speculating.

    We were all young once, even this grumpy sod, who first picked up a video game joystick in the 70’s. But these days my expectations are a lot higher. The simple games of youth don't cut it anymore, do they? And now Lotro is a simple game… ESO beckons and I wish I didn’t feel compelled to just move on. I love middle-earth and I love(d) Lotro. The game doesn’t deliver anything near what it used to in the shape of challenging, fun, and quality end-game content. But Lotro did start out great. It was superb! Lotro hit its peak with Moria. Remember the 21st Hall back in the day? It was packed. Hardly elbow room to move some nights. So many people, so busy busy busy with so many interesting end game things to do. Three raids we had (inc turtle), and eight 6-man instances (inc Forgotten treasury and HoC). Turbine, you set the bar VERY high in quality and quantity with that Exp. But you’ve continued to fall short of it, FAR short of it, year after year ever since. Do you really think we can now be in any way satisfied rebuilding ruined towns, or clicking on ladders in Big Battles??

    I personally am not. People are bored, turbine! Your game is in free-fall. I want my Lotro back, where I could fight in difficult yet exciting instances and raids, and achieve hard-earned rewards based on actual skill, actual endeavour, and actual EFFORT, like it used to be! And not just the content, I want combat to be COMBAT again! I do not want everything handed to me on a plate. I don't want to auto-attack my way to victory. I DO NOT WANT TO BE OP. I have no interest in fast thrills and instant success. And I do not want to run sambrog - 7 year old content - 1,000 times just for a poxy necklace. Yes I hear what you’re saying. How can turbine possibly design a game that meets all ends, satisfies every taste? I know. But I still have a right to stand firm in my corner, and argue for what I believe in, fighting for the game that I love. I can do no more…

    All this frustration translates very much into PvP as well, which is the only alternative destination for the end-game player if turbine will no longer deliver instances and raids. But Ettens is in disarray due to turbine's utter negligence! Time to sort it out, once and for all! I want to see an end to the ez-mode camping and farming and zerging night after night after night. It is endless and boring and useless. But such is our game now, which is dismantling itself before our very eyes. I want a PVP zone where freeps can fight on a par, toe-to-toe, with creeps, and creeps can fight on a par, toe-to-toe, with freeps. In Ettens I want to see creeps and freeps share a comparable level of DPS potential, CC effects, and healing output, where neither one can outshine the other with just raw numbers, but can only do so with skill and with strategy, rather than getting a free-ride because their class is so absurdly OP. I’m not calling for classes to mirror each other. I’m not even asking for parity across the board. Just a scaling down of the ‘trinity’ of DPS/CC/Heals that have on freepside rocketed to ridiculous levels. To counter it turbine simply sky-rocketed creep morale and skill cooldowns to equally ridiculous levels. This is why we have this mess.

    Sadly, turbine seem no longer interested in giving us a game that promotes evenness, or fairness, or challenge worthy of our skill. Of course, it’s more about the Store now, and $$$. And gameplay itself has suffered, and combat is now a total farce. And unfortunately it has attracted too many types whose sole aim is to stamp on the credibility and principles of this game and everyone playing it, to stand above other people and exert their OP dominance, and exploit it at every turn, either because they are young and thus know no better, or because their hefty ego outweighs their integrity.

    The following is what Combat in Lotro has become now. Lotro in HD in a nutshell:

    -Huge DPS numbers.
    -CC overkill.
    -Massive heals.
    -Almost immortal skills on some classes.
    -Absurdly short cooldowns.
    -Bubbles everywhere.

    Seriously! Somewhere along the line Lotro ran off the tracks. Now it’s completely out of control, and careering very close to the edge of a cliff. I could go on about the rest of Lotro, but this is about PvP. Ettenmoors needs a big fat reset button. THE FOLLOWING IS HOW I WOULD DO IT...


    ***


    Warning** (If you WANT to be OP, or worse, think you DESERVE to be OP, or you’re just young and being OP is your preferred style of play, or you actually NEED to be OP because you SUCK - like some people we know of here - you should look away now, as you will certainly hate this list and it will make you cry.)


    FREEP COMBAT IN THE MOORS, AND THE 'TRINITY'

    (The traditional trinity includes tanking, but as there's no tanking in the moors I've replaced it with CC)

    MASSIVE DPS! I myself could hit 13k on my BA before U12.1. Even now, with freeps having Aud, I can still hit 6k to 8k sometimes. That constitutes virtually 50% of a freep’s morale in one hit. One! Freeps can hit for a similar percentage of creep morale with 20k+ hits. I’ve heard of one 30k hit. It’s nonsense turbine. DPS on both sides needs a large scale reduction! Firstly, I would begin by vastly decreasing the magnitude of criticals to a sensible and practical level. Perhaps even place a CAP on crits (moors only). 5k would be reasonable. Of course alongside that I'm suggesting that freep and creep morale pools be brought back down to what they were in RoR.

    Secondly DoTs. Turbine you need to gut out this entire system and rework it, particularly those of Wardens. I’ve seen Warden bleeds hitting regularly for 3k and 4k. I’ve seen one hit for even 8k. A DoT - next to a BA DoT for example that ticks for 150-250! After rescaling the DoTs to SANE levels turbine, please then ensure that they are going correctly through mitigation checks, which they are not right now


    CAPS! Put a cap on crits, put a cap on heals, put a cap on CC. Cap it all! Caps should not and must not be overlooked. But they have been. It has been totally forgotten why we had caps IN THE FIRST PLACE: to prevent a total mess. If you take away the caps this is what happens! Reasonable caps NEED to be reintroduced for freeps and creeps alike. Everything is now so out of proportion it’s ridiculous, and cannot possibly be sustained. And let’s not stop with capping damage or healing effects… Bring back the Stats cap as well! Or maybe just apply the stats cap when freeps enter the moors. Caps work, you see? End this travesty! Keep everything within a sensible and established CAP, and we will never hear of QQ again! Never did turbine make a worse mistake when they removed the stat cap back in RoI.


    CROWD CONTROL! Reduce the effects of CC durations and cooldowns, on both sides. Constant, incessant, everlasting, unremoveable CC effects are just APPALLING right now. I’m not suggesting CC is removed of course, as it’s a fundamental and important gameplay component. But what we see right now is CC on bloody steroids, and it high time it got its #### kicked! Remember Dunland, I mean, STUNland? Not fun was it. Utter ####, in fact! In PvP it’s ten times worse - for the creeps anyway. All this mega-CC does is STOP people playing. It’s like, you’re trying to get from A to B, driving down this road to reach your destination, but you’re stopped dead every 20 yards by a set of goddamn traffic lights. How is this productive? How is being stunned EVERY 3 SECONDS WITHOUT IMMUNITY TO COUNTER IT, fun?! There is no FUN in being stunned once, recovering, then being stunned immediately again… and so on and so forth, so that for 90% of the fight you are not fighting at all but standing there dazed, or knocked down, or not being able to move (ie, NOT be able to FIGHT). Let everybody fight turbine!

    We are here to have FUN, which is to FIGHT, and CC is a killer of FUN, as it removes the basic concept of er, FIGHTING! Enough! CC needs a massive MASSIVE nerf across the board! Put it back to a bare minimum in the Moors! At the very least I suggest that after receiving the first daze/mez/stun/root, implement a 30 second immunity against being dazed/mezzed/stunned/rooted again. Applies obviously to both sides.


    HEALING! Freeps have healing skills that can hit 15k, restoring morale pools to 100% in 1 second. Just lol. Freeps can put out big heals and bubbles in a general Aoe without even being grouped! Just lol again. And yes a WL can heal 25k+, but that’s barely 50% of a creep’s morale pool. But both of these need to be trimmed down to fall in line with new a morale scheme. Firstly, I submit outgoing heals should be capped at 5k, keeping in mind that both freeps and creeps should revert to having comparable morale pools of around 12k at the bottom end, and say 20k at the top. Secondly, assert an aggressive reduction on all freep healing skills, not just in the exaggerated numbers but in cooldowns also. No more 2 or 3 freeps out-healing the onslaught of an ENTIRE creep raid. No more god-like captains! No more absurd bubbles and fairy lights that freep raids run round with. Leave that #### to lesser MMOs, or sci-fi games. There are no deflector-shields in Prof. Tolkien’s works. They have no place in middle-earth. I mean, what the hell is Frodo wasting his time for? Just give the ring to a bloody cappy and have him or her take it to Mordor solo. FFS.

    I am not anti-minstrel or anti-healer. I loved my mini. I say give me back my old minstrel turbine! I hate what Orion began in RoI with redesigning that class. Hate it, hate it, HATE IT! I was very proud of my achievement in healing all of the old raid content on level. The best though was OD hard mode. My kin was one of only 5 that achieved that at level 65. I tanked it all and healed it all. Those were epic fights! Healing Durin’s Bane HM was a very tough proposition, but I did it, and I sweated for it, with pure good old fashioned EFFORT, and INTELLIGENCE, and TIMING of skills. No 100% heals, no vast AoEs or codas or soddin bubbles and ####! Leave it out turbine! The challenge of healing is yet another element of Lotro that has been DUMBED DOWN to oblivion. And it stinks!

    Another problem with bubbles: they are a further strain on an already bloated mountain of graphics effects, which is exacerbated by LMs and RKs. All this kills the action dead with lag. So lose the bloody fairy lights! And put healing back to what it was: a noble art, that required passion, dedication, and craft. Not a bloody faceroll! Also put all incoming and outgoing healing percentages and effects back to what they were in SoA.



    OTHER POINTS

    --Repair all freep mitigation tables, and ensure that every instance of incoming creep damage is checked against those tables.

    --Give freeps PvP-specific gear, armour/jewelry/weps, that are earned along and throughout the PvP ranking curve, and maybe from deeds as well for the really epic stuff. This to be used only in PvP. Outside, open-world PvE gear should be barred from use in the moors. And why not?

    --Power pools. They are so horribly broken due to the changes made to stats and how they functioned. Power used to be a game mechanic, where players could whittle away an enemy’s reserves, using its restrictions against them. One more interesting strategy removed from the toolkit. It is now very rare that a power pool falls to 0. Awesome short-sightedness on turbine’s part, again...

    --No more Auto-Flips. What a bloody joke they are.

    --Pets, on either side, should not any longer be summoned in combat (except I guess for the LM skill Sic ‘Em… Nuke ‘Em, Zerg ‘Em, or whatever.)

    --Bring back the lock-out timer. No more flipping!

    --Disallow logging out in combat. Stop the cheaters!

    --No more cheap ‘get-out clauses’. Bar these skills from use in the Moors! So no more minis playing dead (yeh, it may work against dumb npcs, but it’s not logical against human players), no more cappy last stand, no more HiPS (burgs and wargs), and last but not least, no more sprinting/charging/make haste in combat! Oh wait, there’s that QQ again. All right then, give reavers a 30sec in-combat sprint to compensate. No? Do away with it all then. (including warg sprint in-combat, sorry doggies). So in summary… yes by all means keep a few panic buttons, but NO MORE cheap get out clauses. Get shot of ALL OF IT. Fight, or DIE. It’s that simple. Don’t like it? Go away then, back to pve land!

    --Bubbles. Bah! I can hear the freep QQ already. Okay then. If you must have them, then ONE bubble only, employed by only one class (cappy/minstrel, whatever), and to apply to one target at a time. Mitigates/absorb 90% (not 100%) of damage for a short duration, say 15 secs. Make it the same as the Warleader bubble. This way the NPC and one-shotter bugs will be, or at least SHOULD BE, eliminated! Yes, eliminated, problem solved! Because that is what is happening right now with cappies. Shield of the dunedain alongside audacity takes damage reduction over that 100%, and this is interpreted by your own friendly NPCS as healing the target: therefore you are added to their aggro list. NO MORE bubbles or similar effects absorbing ALL damage, the same for Shield wall. Bar these skills from use in the Moors! No more 100% ANYTHING. 100% of this effect or that has no place here – no place in reality, no place in the lore. Get rid of it!

    --Take a long hard look at the ON Buff turbine! It’s broken. It’s always been broken. Remove the +Ren/Inf buff it gives, and have it only grant +mitigation, and +outgoing dmg to the side that is outnumbered. And make it ‘intelligent’, so it constantly adjusts/updates itself in accordance with numbers of players on each side, whether its 3 v 7, or 30 v 50. This way a relatively stable and balanced fight can always be achieved regardless of how many players are fighting. No more farm and zerg! There will be cheaters ofc. Unfortunately Lotro is now infested by those of low (and sometimes no) integrity that will try to cheat, in this instance by probably parking freavers somewhere out of the way to fudge the numbers. So perhaps this buff would ignore players standing at Grams/GV, and count only those that are in combat, etc. (I dunno, I haven’t had time to think this one thru, but it’s something to consider. If nothing else it would sort out the zerging.)

    --NPCs. No NPC should ever again stun you or disarm you. I recently pulled all of HH on my reaver. Ofc I was disarmed to high hell and back, and just stood there like a lemon with all skills greyed out. I watched a full minute pass in which I had perhaps a total of ten seconds where I could actually fight. But of course I had my super-duper OP Wrath to save me! This is garbage on both counts. As pointed out earlier, overblown CC like this KILLS THE FIGHT, and that kills the fun, which in turn kills your game turbine. Leave these CC effects to actual players! NPCs should be nothing more than background components that are barely noticeable - except for elites that guard Grams/GV/Rez circles, and Keeps.

    --No more Keep buffs, no more DoF buffs, no more frackin’ OP buffs. EVER.

    --No more Audacity. What a waste of time. Remind me again what it’s for? Oh yeh, I’ll tell you what it’s for. It’s just a stopgap, a band-aid turbine threw on this open wound called pvp. If you cut dps and heals down to near modest levels, as it should be, you wouldn’t bloody need this lazy, ill-conceived rubbish.



    CREEPSIDE AND GENERAL STUFF

    --Cut Creep morale in half, put it back to where it was in RoR, and even lower than that, so that it is on a par with freeps (and in accordance with the new morale scheme for both sides I suggested, being between 12k to 20k).

    --Reduce magnitude of Creep critical damage numbers to the same cap as freeps.

    --Cap and reduce creep healing in the same fashion and by the same amount. Not like for like with freeps, skill for skill, etc, I don’t mean that. I’m not talking about mirroring the classes. I’m talking about capping the values. Cap it at the SAME ceiling. No more insane 5-digit numbers filling up the combat log.

    --Remove the ridiculous Creep cooldowns, restore them back to what they were before HD. What sort of game mechanism is it when I can on my BA just hit MT every 40 secs and avoid so much physical damage? Or on my reaver when I can run round with almost perma-wrath? Or on warg Sprint/Hips with almost complete impunity? These are no better than freep bubbles. In fact they are the same! It does not encourage or promote the notion of tactics, clever play, or guile to win your battles. It’s an ‘I win’ button, befitting only of tards. I’m not a tard turbine. I’m not a moron or a chimpanzee. I left freepside to get away from this s**t. I left freepside because it was boring and utterly insulting to run round in god-mode all the time. Turbine, you’ve pandered to too many whiners and moaners that don’t have it in them to WORK for their successes. No pain, no gain! You insult us and our intelligence by giving us these powers and abilities.

    --Introduce some better controls for class building, customization. Give creeps trait trees, for example. Give creeps gear. Something!

    ****


    There’s a million more issues. But this’ll do. It’s too much of a wall of text already…

    But so many problems solved! If you are shaking your head right now, it could be that you prefer a different brand of gaming than I do. Fair enough. By no means do I believe that my opinion is the only valid one. I’m just stating my opinion here. You either agree, or you do not. And I would say my beliefs here are impartial and without bias; in favour of neither freeps nor creeps, because I play BOTH (altho not freep in the moors anymore), and I want fair fights for both! And it’s quite possible I’ve upset or offended both sides. Sorry! But above all else here I’m trying to illustrate the root of where our many problems lie. I’ll repeat what I said before: turbine seem to want EVERYONE to have ridiculously powerful abilities, damaging skills, cc, and heals. They are no longer interested in giving us a game that promotes evenness, and fairness – or challenge. And if you say ‘killing a captain is a challenge,’ then I give up. You’ve totally missed the point. Bottom line: gameplay has suffered terribly, becoming a pale ghost of what it once was.

    Ettenmoors needs a big fat reset button like I said. Can’t you see how ultimately futile it is otherwise? Under this model, escalating from update to update, PvP will eventually self-destruct, like this:




    Hilarious, but ultimately pointless. Get a control turbine and end the madness! If something is not done soon it will get so overblown, so far out of proportion, you will never be able to reverse it. Dial it down and get back to basics. Or you will get hit in the pocket, and hard! ESO is coming, remember?

    So, flame away at these suggestions people. I don’t care. Neither should you care really, because it won’t matter. Nothing will be done by turbine anyway. They do not LISTEN! By all means put up counter arguments if you want. But you will never ever convince me that Lotro is in a better state than it once was, or combat is better now than it was in 2007, or even 2011. I heard a rumour a while back that turbine intend to release a major ettens update at some point, suggesting that the awful distortions that we see right now are only temporary, and that they will get round to sorting it out. Eventually. Yeh right, but we’ll see. But hurry turbine. ESO is coming in April. It’s a hot topic on occ every single day! People are so very tired and want to move on now for all the reasons I have given you. So hurry!! You have 4 months. The clock is ticking…
    tl;dr 678910

  13. #2938
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    scotland uk
    Posts
    124
    Mreza r u completely mentaly challenged? last night the creeps flipped the whole map,we took tir once which was immediately flipped again by creep raid ,I tracked 31 foe but unfortunately cant track nature thanks to turbine,we had the on buff and only had 12 peeps in our raid,B4 u start blaming Dan for flippin 4 op's u should take a step bk and realise there is more peeps in the moors than us and if they wanna flip op's we cant stop them,it happens both sides.

  14. #2939
    Quote Originally Posted by colhelm View Post
    Mreza r u completely mentaly challenged? last night the creeps flipped the whole map,we took tir once which was immediately flipped again by creep raid ,I tracked 31 foe but unfortunately cant track nature thanks to turbine,we had the on buff and only had 12 peeps in our raid,B4 u start blaming Dan for flippin 4 op's u should take a step bk and realise there is more peeps in the moors than us and if they wanna flip op's we cant stop them,it happens both sides.
    Creep raid? Last night? Urghm, no. Sharn left at the begining of night and disbanded it after you ppl didnt came. Last night whole map was blue and we fought at lug bd. And no you didnt had the ON buff at that momment. Whole fkn night there was one burg (i know which one is his creep and i asked him why, he said "i was borred") flipping all ops to blue and that cappy i mentioned earlier. That was the one i saw. Not sure which game you played i was there whole night fighting with 1 or 0 ops.

    And, btw, arro, tnx for this first sentence. Pretty sure i didnt even commented directly you, ever, on this forums.

  15. #2940
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    scotland uk
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    124
    well m8 u mustve came after the sharne raid,same old same old log in form raid flip map hug keep....and we did go to him but was waste of time.....the keep huggin tactic is getting really borin as he knows its just a lag fest,all we're askin is for someone to take over creep raids and fight differently rather than do the norm.

  16. #2941
    Quote Originally Posted by colhelm View Post
    well m8 u mustve came after the sharne raid,same old same old log in form raid flip map hug keep....and we did go to him but was waste of time.....the keep huggin tactic is getting really borin as he knows its just a lag fest,all we're askin is for someone to take over creep raids and fight differently rather than do the norm.
    Be happy there are raid vs raid fights at all in current state of balance. Ofc he is gonna hug the keep. No, he should go for open and wait for freep raid leaders to tell you guys "Let them kill something"?

  17. #2942
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    Suffolk Uk
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    Mreza you count how many OP's you have? and theres my piont

  18. #2943
    Quote Originally Posted by Rattkille View Post

    Mreza you count how many OP's you have? and theres my piont
    Your argument is... /sigh
    It would be silly if you wouldnt let us have 3 ops after you killed 49 creeps (number with rezzes), and we killed 2.
    There you go your open fights. 49-2.

  19. #2944
    Quote Originally Posted by Rattkille View Post

    Wait one min! why have i got into this!, Arrostorm was only saying about creep raid leaders, what's that got to do about it, the only person that fliped the map last night was sharn!i didn't flip anything when i was leading but then i gave lead to Rokkin. Just grow up and move on that i am NEVER! comming back on creep on eldar, thats why my WL in on snowy now! aslo you don't QQ about some of your kin members and other people that flip 24/7! i don't flip 24/7 do I!
    Simple question. Were you part of a raid both before and after Sharn disbanded, camping grams, while most of the time having 4 OPs?
    P.S It's never a good thing to talk after peoples back and saying stuff that you can't say(even) in IMS.

    Quote Originally Posted by colhelm View Post
    well m8 u mustve came after the sharne raid,same old same old log in form raid flip map hug keep....and we did go to him but was waste of time.....the keep huggin tactic is getting really borin as he knows its just a lag fest,all we're askin is for someone to take over creep raids and fight differently rather than do the norm.
    Same question. Were you part of a raid both before and after Sharn disbanded, camping grams, whiles most of he time possessing 4 OPs.
    Is that the way you want raids to be lead, camping grams/gv?
    Last edited by Axeny; Jan 15 2014 at 04:43 PM.

  20. #2945
    forum 'discussions':

    argument A is aimed at incident B
    argument B is aimed at incident A or even C
    argument C is aimed on the correct incident but due to rage/misinformation/stupidity/brownnosing totally missing the reason of the discussion
    argument D is aimed at nothing but simply trolling all other arguments

    Eldar's pvmp forum fits all of the above.
    The end is near, the ring will melt, but not if I can help it!

  21. #2946
    hehe nice post

    gone are the days where we cheered and thanked each other for a fun night full of action!

    Now its just attemts to undermine the effort of the other side.

    2 completely different stories, describing the very same event. Always negative comments that are supposed to make the first post look bad.

    - dude dont come here and say thank you for a nice night, we got farmed to oblivion. you were 5 times our nr, we had no healers, ON buff, 0 ops etc etc...

    This goes both ways!

    No wonder the community sucks atm!!
    Last edited by Erlo; Jan 16 2014 at 06:21 AM.

  22. #2947
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    UK
    Posts
    388
    Regarding the OP wars:

    Why bother having this debate again? It's quite pointless.

    Freeps accuse creeps of taking all OPs. Yawn.
    Creeps accuse freeps of taking all OPs. Yawn.

    You do realise that MOST OF THE TIME creeps will take those 4 OPs for no other reason than SPITE - because the freeps did the same thing the previous night?
    And you do realise that MOST OF THE TIME freeps will take those 4 OPs for no other reason than SPITE - because the creeps did the same thing the previous night?

    Now you understand what a circular argument is. And that unfortunately is what we’ve all come to.

    Bottom line is though, with these OPs, is that Turbine have given us a playground to play in where the See-Saw has a weight bias to one side – where the fat-arsed freeps sit. I’m sorry but that is the plain truth. If you do not see that then you live in cloud cuckoo land. With OPs 4-0 to creeps freep Masteries far outstrip us even then. But given that fact I can say with both authority and experience that creeps generally were more than happy to let it ride at 2-2. This was a fair arrangement, and most of the time creep/freep leaders would keep it that way as often as they could.

    However that mood has changed, and in both camps. Who knows where it started and how, but that’s irrelevant. The overriding factor now for OPs flipping over is SPITE, pure and simple. We both follow this circular argument and do it out of sheer spite and rebellion, or perhaps sometimes just because we're bored.

    Because it goes round and round and round. I don't agree with either side doing it to be honest. In fact, many of my tribies that I run with don't agree either - or at least didn't USED to. And I'm quite sure there are many freep PvP'ers who feel the same. But people will do it, because people are people. And in the heat of battle s*** happens. I’m sure when the freeps see us with 3-1 OPs or 4-0 they have an inherent need to flip them back, irrespective of what the masteries on each side compute to. They forget they outgun us anyway. They still would even if there were 6 Ops and we had them all. But still I don’t really blame them, because this is a virtual war and we will on both sides do what we can with the tools available to gain the upper hand.

    And nobody mention quests to me lol! No one takes an OP because they want a poxy quest! (or maybe some pve bandits may want to, good for them haha, woot 100 pts!), but 95% of the time people do it:

    A), Because they want to get their own back against those bastads on the other side who flipped all ops earlier.
    B), Because they were in the area at the time, (for example - you just had a fight at spider den, or you just flipped LC, so: "Let's just quickly take HHOP while we're here...").
    C), Because they’re bored.

    And we're all bored to the point where we don't care anymore - ALL of us.

    The code of fairness and etiquette has fallen by the wayside, and quite in line with PvP in general as it suffers this decline. And Mreza, mate, I'm not calling you out here, it was a legitimate argument you had initially, but no one here is whiter than white when it comes to OPs. We must all share the blame. Hell, I'VE flipped OPs beyond 2-2 and freely admit it! Yep, sorry, I hold up my hand and declare my part in that. Many a time recently I've been involved with flipping OPs. Sometimes quite deliberately to annoy the freeps, and usually whilst 'running with the crowd' that happened to swarm into the OP to flip it on its way past, or just for the hell of it, and utterly irrespective of how many we already had. I apologise for any nuisance this has caused to freeps. But don’t be too quick to blame me, just as I wouldn’t blame you for doing the same thing. Because you do. And neither of us can promise that it won't happen again tonight, or tomorrow night, or the night after... I fully anticipate, indeed EXPECT freeps to do exactly the same at any given time. It will happen nightly now, on both sides.

    In the same way I fully EXPECT freeps, whenever possible, to gather perhaps a full raid, turn all the map blue, and have all 4 OPs and besiege for hours on end whatever few bored creeps are standing around outside grams. Hell, these days I expect a SECOND RAID TO COME SWEEPING IN with epic fanfare to FLANK this pitiful handful of SOLOERS. Flanking grams with a raid ffs. But hey, how bored must freeps be! More than us I reckon to stoop to that level! For the lack of captivating end-game at the moment I can hardly blame them. And I hardly blame anyone for flipping OPs either, and for the same reasons: for a laugh, or for spite, or for killing time – or for creeps because we want some parity with Masteries, and freeps to be even more powerful than they already are. We will both carry on doing it.

    Sorry for sounding so negative and dismal. But it was to step in an end this silly argument about OPs. Let he who is without sin cast the first stone. Night after night we all pelt each other with stones, and most vindictively on this matter, yet no one has a right to do so. Everyone is guilty.

    It will happen, and will continue to happen while we're all in this somewhat depressed and apathetic mood - or until Turbine come out of their coma and start listening to their customers, ie, get rid of the damn OPs altogether!

  23. #2948
    Quote Originally Posted by colhelm View Post
    well m8 u mustve came after the sharne raid,same old same old log in form raid flip map hug keep....and we did go to him but was waste of time.....the keep huggin tactic is getting really borin as he knows its just a lag fest,all we're askin is for someone to take over creep raids and fight differently rather than do the norm.
    I try not to get involved in to many forums wars but really

    This post of your is utter rubbish.

    Wednesday 15/01/14 around 19.00 until 20.00 I was part of a sharne raid and we were at tol3 and got wiped easily by freeps. I counted 3 wipes and many many creep deaths. We were not hugging any keep but fighting in the open.

    So you see by doing that all we managed to do was feed the freeps easy renown.

    You talk about fliping keeps but often a freep raid will pop down to dof for the buffs before starting to think about raid fight. There are reasons but instead of moaning about sharne ask yourself why he at times will not fight in the open?

    The answer is very easy - The freeps have a huge advantage at present and are easily able to farm the creeps, this is why statements in a freep raid like " dont kill the warleaders let them rez" are used

    Sorry to interrupt your childish moan about OP flipping please feel free to carry

  24. #2949
    I dont attack whole freep community. I comment the freeps that frequently choose to flipp all 4 outposts. Tell me, Uz, Tarm, Rat, whoever even wanted to comment this "OP theme" :
    What can you kill with 0 ops on creep? What can you heal to survive anything with 0 ops?

    IF YOU ARE BORRED OF THIS GAME, DONT RUIN IT FOR OTHERS.

    Here is the example. 0 red ops, 4 blue. Attacked by a burglar that, i inspected, has - virtues rank 5 to 10. Legacies not maxed out and not even for the same trait tree. Not crafted but bought relic. And for only one of the legendary items. Has 10 audacity. Guess what happened?
    This isnt the rage cause i died or i will die numerous times, i dont care about that. You guys are the OP side of this game. Why do u need to do that? What do u lack? A skill perhaps. And balls for sure.

    A burg, Cherrywood was the name, i think that is flipping ops. (Not the one mentioned above) I asked you once, why you do that. Didnt named you anywhere before that. You continue doing same. Why? Here.

    GOOD JOB!!!! /stronghandshake


    At least i expect you, other freeps, that arent doing same, to tell them on your own OOC "Come on, dont do that...".

  25. #2950
    You do realize that freeps are often stronger when we fight you in keeps, even if its red, than in the open?(Depends on the Fraid though) Freep AoE is stronger than ever, as we have showed you many times on Lug stairs, so hugging keeps can do you no favours unless it causes lag.

 

 
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