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  1. #1

    Raid Stats Question

    I'm currently working on finishing up my armour pieces to be good to go for Throne T2C. I currently have 4 of the Pelennor orc carver 4 essence slot pieces and 2 of the 2 essence slot featured instance gloom bane pieces. I'm working on getting the last 2 of the orc carver pieces. I also have all the featured instance 2 essence slot jewelry. I know I need over 30k morale, high physical mastery, and physical and tactical mits at/above 24k, but I was curious as to what some of my other stats should be at like finesse, crit defense, and resistance. My mits already are where they need to be, but I need to raise my morale just a bit, and would like to add more phys mast so I was hoping that I might be able to drop my finesse or crit def down possibly and replace them with some morale or phys mast essences depending on what champs should have those stats at. Thanks for any help or suggestions!

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Posts
    737
    finesse you want around like 3 essences worth.. With 8000 or so I don't see any of my attacks being full BPE'd (plenty of partials though)

    crit defense you don't really need any unless you're planning to offtank, which can be helpful.

    resistance is cute, but you can get 4000 from food, which makes stacking it seem a little pointless. Traits are the only realistic way of getting resistance because stacking vitality is pretty worthless for non-tank classes. So if you're overcap on your mits, unslot some virtues and redirect them towards resistance.
    105 (Captain, Champion, Guardian)

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by DuneBug View Post
    finesse you want around like 3 essences worth.. With 8000 or so I don't see any of my attacks being full BPE'd (plenty of partials though)
    You need more than this. You want to be as close as you can be to 30%. I have 15/16k unbuffed. Keep in mind you can get 3k+ from the correct bow.

    Before T2C gear, I was raiding with (roughly);

    32k morale unbuffed
    70k mastery
    15k crit
    16k finesse
    24k Phys Mit
    24k Tact Mit

    Points to note.
    - I unslotted my crit def jewels as I found little use for them in Throne T2CM.
    - You don't need your mits that high, 22k will do with scrolls.

    So yes, drop your crit def for morale/mastery. It depends what you class as 'high' though. Prior to the new gear, 65-70k mastery (w/o scrolls, 5% damage tomes etc) was good enough. I can drop to 21k morale and have huge mastery, so find the balance. Be smart with your essence choices also - crit rating gives crit def and if you use 3 slot jewelry rather than the 2 slot + mits you can slot mits that give mastery too.

    Reply if you have any other questions!
    |MI6| - Evernight
    Hunter|R10 Guardian|R9 Champion|R7 Minstrel|R6 Burglar|R5 Reaver|R12 Warg|R9

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Trampin View Post
    You need more than this. You want to be as close as you can be to 30%. I have 15/16k unbuffed. Keep in mind you can get 3k+ from the correct bow.
    Someone did some tests in another thread and he said ~19% for T2
    I have only 2 Finesse essences and it seems enough.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Castorix View Post
    Someone did some tests in another thread and he said ~19% for T2
    I have only 2 Finesse essences and it seems enough.
    I haven't tested personally so I'll take their word for it. Going from personal experience (And if you've done Throne you'll know what I'm referring to) there are some fights where you require as close to 100% success rates from skills so I've tried to stick as close to 30% as I can.
    |MI6| - Evernight
    Hunter|R10 Guardian|R9 Champion|R7 Minstrel|R6 Burglar|R5 Reaver|R12 Warg|R9

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Trampin View Post
    I haven't tested personally so I'll take their word for it. Going from personal experience (And if you've done Throne you'll know what I'm referring to) there are some fights where you require as close to 100% success rates from skills so I've tried to stick as close to 30% as I can.
    I just found the thread with Google (the "search" from those forums is not very accurate)
    https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...cts-some-tests
    I think 30% was ok before U18 changes.

  7. #7
    Thanks for the suggestions everyone! Right now my finesse is at 27.6% so maybe I'll drop that down if 19% seems to be good for Throne T2C. My crit def is at 58.5% so I'll drop that down too, and add some more morale and phys mast. I'm at 29K morale and 62k phys mast. I was hoping I wouldn't have to do anything for resistance so that was nice to see I was thinking correctly there. I have a few T7/100 essences I have left to switch out too so that will help a bit when I get those switched out over the next few days. Thanks again!

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    Republic of Ireland
    Posts
    24

    At your service!

    Dear ellessarstarwalker!


    The primary focus when preparing for T2(C) is setting up defences - since being defeated makes one completely irrelevant. Therefore Mastery and Morale will be your "fillers" only at the final stage once your survival and efficiency is optimized (the opinions regarding optimum differ, I will provide mine below).
    "How much morale/mastery should I have?" Has never been the right thing to ask - and can only be neatly answered by: "As much as you can spare in your build for them". However the amount of what one can "spare" should be based on the aformentioned optimization. Mastery is the biggest number on your character sheet, valuing tens of thousands, followed by Morale/Mitigation/Resistance. This and the fact that a T8 Supreme Masterful (Main Stat) Essence contributes less to the corresponding rating than a T7 Minor Essence of Resistance does, for example, means that Essences make a bigger difference on ANY other rating than Mastery.
    Simply put: +6k rating to a Mastery of a character who is already sitting at 60k will not be as significant of a difference as +6k rating to the Mitigation of a character who has 15k. Also the formerly mentioned takes twice as much slots to achieve. This example alone should prove that even having a couple of slots for some of the lower Ratings (1-3/each) would net you greater overall benefits than just stacking Mastery for example while hoping not to get hit...

    Virtues: Fidelity, Tolerance, Honour, Charity and Innocence/Confidence - 5th picked based on whether you need the extra P. Mit. or Res. (An easy way to remember these is Tac*2, Res*2 and Phy/Res)

    Armour/Jewellery(Epic Battle) sets - aka the 10%-ers. These forums have seen this topic a few times, I have tested it myself, the conclusions agree on having unnoticable difference vs the slotted pieces (given you can adjust the rest of your build around them). So you can go 2-piece Jewellery (neck, ear: +10% AoE), 2-piece Pelennor (+10% dmg), 2-piece Osgi (+10% AoE) and 2-piece Featured Gloom Bane (+10% run) as movement speed is very handy for everyone, especially mellee classes for quicker positioning, etc. On top of being roughly as effective as a full Ess-slot build it is also a lot cheaper to acquire/make.
    If you want to keep the 4 Pelennor over the 2 Pelennor / 2 Featured than you will have to compensate for the +Mits and +Morale. Mitigations will also dictate whether you can have some of the 3-slot jewellery (Osgiliath) pieces equipped or stick to the Absent ones.

    Defence:
    1., Mitigations - T2 against lvl 108 cap is 25,281. Armour buff (Phys Mit, mainly) is only likely with yellow cappy in your fs, cappy+food is +578 Tac Mit from stats, blue line trait +5% Tac Mit, Scrolls +1441 to both. Definetely aim for 24k+ with all buffs.
    2., Critical Defence - 10,500! Contrary to what some of the posters here would have you belive, reaching the soft cap for this is highly recommended for every class, especially for those in the midst of the fight 24/7. Try at least 7k... (Think of distributions, AoEs and the occasional "oooopsie")
    3., Resistance - Virtues are mainly used here to offset the T2 penalty, so this is tough... Food, Hope Token, stat contributions and the odd buffs - welcome it all and consume in big quantities!
    4., Avoidances - Block: N/A. Parry: Huge contribution from Might and if you are facing them, you are doing it wrong. Evade: T2 penalty will make it 0, you can consider slotting 2-3 of these if you have constant troubles with positioning and/or aggro (this advice can also be extended to every class).

    Efficiency:
    Finesse - The only complication here is positioning, otherwise this one is pretty straight forward. Finesse rating gives you a % value that you directly take from the enemy's BPE % (the BPE rating will remain uneffected). If you are behind your opponent(s) you are solely dealing with Evade. Worst case scenario: 13%. Required Finesse Rating: ca. 6,400. Going higher than this is only recommended, if:
    a., there is a percentage buff to the opponent's Evade that Finesse can overcome (as rating buffs will only effect partials beyond the 13% cap) or
    b., the positioning can not be maintained efficiently and one has to occasionally overcome B/P percentages, as well.
    Please note that the thread/testing referenced by Castorix measures the necessities for Resistance rolls (I believe the testing warden ran it with light dots) and not BPE. BPE cap is 13% regardless of how much +rating T2 mobs get.
    Recommendations for getting Finesse: off-hand/cloak/ranged slot/Osgiliath Armour

    Offence:
    1., Critical Rating - ca. 13,000 should do. Flurry is +1,300 and cappy+food is +1,000 from stats making it 15,300. Red cappy can cap you with +2,400.
    2., Physical Mastery - Thanks if you got this far I recommend T8 Supreme Robust Mights, obviously, as +278 Morale will beat +374 Mastery every day of the week. Throw in some morale essences towards the end, I don't think you can reach 30k+ with Robusts only if you have done the optimization correctly.


    Have Fun and Good Luck in the Raid!

    Kindest Regards
    Last edited by Nogen; Aug 05 2016 at 10:39 PM.

  9. #9
    Worst case scenario: 13%.
    BPE cap is 13% regardless of how much +rating T2 mobs get.
    Nope. Monster stats are different from ours. You can look at my tests: https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...t=#post7619421

    Attacking from front needs somewhere around 35% Finesse, attacking from behind needs less than half that (Mobs have more Evade than Block/Parry).

  10. #10
    Nogen makes some valid points (with a lot of words), but;

    Quote Originally Posted by Nogen View Post
    2., Critical Defence - 10,500! Contrary to what some of the posters here would have you belive, reaching the soft cap for this is highly recommended for every class, especially for those in the midst of the fight 24/7. Try at least 7k... (Think of distributions, AoEs and the occasional "oooopsie")
    Having completed Throne, I unslotted all jewelry with crit def essences in place of morale/mastery. I had roughly 4/5k (with my t8 supreme crit rating second stat) and never had the slightest problem.

    Obviously it's your choice, your build, take whomevers opinions you'd like
    |MI6| - Evernight
    Hunter|R10 Guardian|R9 Champion|R7 Minstrel|R6 Burglar|R5 Reaver|R12 Warg|R9

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Location
    UK
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    659
    Quote Originally Posted by Trampin View Post
    Nogen makes some valid points (with a lot of words), but;



    Having completed Throne, I unslotted all jewelry with crit def essences in place of morale/mastery. I had roughly 4/5k (with my t8 supreme crit rating second stat) and never had the slightest problem.

    Obviously it's your choice, your build, take whomevers opinions you'd like
    I swear that the mobs don't even crit anyway? Like, never
    Selembar - R12 - Minstrel
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  12. #12
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Norway
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    871
    Quote Originally Posted by Celembar View Post
    I swear that the mobs don't even crit anyway? Like, never
    There are no crits in new instance for champs to take.
    Moridin


    Aut vincere aut mori
    Attitude is everything

    League of Legends HebnesO: Singed The MAD Chemist. - Gold ranked player season one
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