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  1. #26

    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by SGWB View Post
    I don't believe it has anything to do with doing or not doing damage.
    I guess my experience is that if we have someone with a bow hit the same target, we get a lot larger radius of aggro triggered. For me, the only difference I could figure out is the damage being done. *shrug*
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  2. #27
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    Well, all right. I'm frankly kind of afraid to post build and all because I know very well I'll get a lot of "wuts rong with u STOOPID," because nerd chestthumping is what forums are for. :-) Also, it seems perfectly possible to me to give general advice on statting for soloing without having to know a particular character's build.
    We're Captains, we're nice ^^

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    I'm in mostly quest reward and reputation rewards stuff. I sprang for a crafted emblem and a crafted halberd,
    Sounds good enough, you've got better emblems and weapons than me! lol...dangit.

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    what stats are important for Captains, for instance Might versus Agility, that I would appreciate getting straightened out.
    Depends on play style, boy, bet you've heard that before. You want to DPS/tank, might and vit are primary. Personally I've gone Vit and Fate...now I'm trying to get Will up to improve out-healing rates.
    Might to improve Damage and in taking less damage
    Agility to improve hit rates and crits. I know crits are kinda important for us as a crit with DB or PA will open up our defeat skills. I've always found crit rates to be very fickle anyway and on level mobs seem to die fast enough to open up defeat skills whenever I need em.
    Fate in-combat morale/power regen. Good if you're like me and the fights are longer
    Vit, more morale (out of combat morale regen) and resistances to some things.....
    Will, power (out of combat power regen) and OUTGOING HEALING RATES, just realized this myself so now I'm trading off some fate to up my will.

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    I've been advised to do crit banners instead of heralds, so I got a guildie to make crit banners. Frankly, so far I'm not really convinced that I'm any more survivable with the banners than with the heralds. Why, why are there no max level banners? Anyway. ATM I'm trying to slog it out with the banners because that's what everyone says to do, but I hate it. I hate not having access to the uh-oh buttons on the heralds. (And which banner for soloing anyway? War? Hope?)
    I hate banners too. I only use them in groups (crit of course, and which banner really does depend on the fight, length, opponents etc). I find my archer more than makes up for it. Many will disagree. I don't have a might built cappy, so my dps is lower than most, adding 10% to bleh = bleh. If I hit for 200 and my archer hits for 100 my archer is now +50%. Also you've heard that we're better at healing others > healing ourselves so let archer take the aggro suits me fine. [honestly that idea works for 5seconds, but works better for archer to take one mob, I take the other] Cappys who never run heralds is mainly due to the fact they want to use muster courage as a self heal. If you're running this build you need to have a might/vit build imho. To reduce incoming melee damage (and virtued up as such), as that muster courage heal isn't huge and has a longish CD too. [but again, that area I'm not to clued up on]

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    I've had some people tell me to use a 1h-and-shield, some tell me to use a 2h. At the moment I'm doing a halberd just because I enjoy halberds, but I would value a reason-based commentary on which is best for soloing. So far, I can't say I've noticed a difference in survivability either way.
    2h all the way, hally/2h sword (both give +2% damage...woooo) conserves power. You want a shield and sword, roll a dang guardian. They have shield skills up the wazzoo.

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    I've also tried traiting different ways: I tried mostly red, I tried mostly yellow, and then I sort of gave up because again, I wasn't noticing a big difference in how often I ended up dead, and decided to do what I darn well pleased. Which is currently 3 Hands of Healing (blue), 2 Lead the Charge (red) and 2 Leader of Men (yellow).
    I'm traited full HoH and 2 Leader (I HATE the mark cooldown). This allows me to
    1. no re-trait solo vs. group
    2. Valiant Strike Heal over time if things get hairy.
    3. Quickly change Telling mark to revealing mark if again, things get hairy.

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    My virtues are probably not where they should be because I have very limited play time and refuse to spend it killing 500 grey-level leeches or whatever just to up a stupid virtue. (Another of my serious complaints about this game. :-) I've made a bit of an effort to get traits that guildies said were important, but not really gone all out yet, and honestly, I don't want to unless I know for sure that a given virtue will really, really help. If it really makes a difference, fine, I'll kill the 500 leeches, but convince me. :-) ATM my slotted traits in order from strongest to weakest are Idealism, Loyalty, Fidelity, Justice and Empathy.
    All my vitues are : if it adds morale or vit, I get it.
    Get it to 10! Sorry, it just needs to be done. DON'T solo them if doing so is like going to the dentist. Actually some of the best game times I've had were getting the Trolls in MM done. Round em up and wow, total chaos, it was awesome.


    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    Please don't bother telling me I don't know how to play. I'm a very old hand at MMOs, but without good solid information I'm finding it hard to figure out how to weight things in LOTRO. If anyone knows of a good website with current-best-practices advice for soloing (as opposed to raiding) builds/equipment, that would be wonderful too...so far I've looked for such a site in vain. So far all I have is a lot of conflicting advice from in-game chats.
    Me too, so I won't tell you how to play, I'll tell you how I play and you can take what you can from it. I don't know of a decent website though, sry.

    Yeah always conflicting advice, different ways to play. Well, it seems like you don't like banners, no problem. I use the archer herald only. It adds DPS, which I need when soloing since i'm not built for dps (might/agility) I'm built for long fights (vit/fate) where I'm not tanking obviously (might). I just feel happy when I have the highest morale in the group. [i know it's not the only factor etc but it still feels good ]

    If I really want to DPS with my build I'll trait it so I can use oathbreakers archer. I prefer to run HoH as while the fights last longer I feel more in control of the fight through the heals etc. (for example, have my archer open up the fight with revealing mark on the target. Auto attack, and hit inspire once in a while. Yay, I'm killing mobs while having cake in one hand and a cookie in the other, and the fight lasts long enough to finish both of them, nom nom nom). Traited Rallying cry is a MUST. (as is +rally cry heal, cooldown and vocal heal on your emblem!!!) With that skill and emblem you can fight on and on and on and ....

    Because I feel 'safe' with high morale and strong heals, using telling mark in a fight to make it go a bit quicker is all good (again I always get telling mark legacy) and with to arms/strength of will on my archer (hey it's all good practice for grouping right). Like I said, if I find myself sinking...revealing mark. Playing like this I rarely use pots/food let alone man heal.

    I'd like to hear from you once you're 65 and do that Dwarfy repeatable quest under Thalenguillllandaodinfdk (sp?). (near Dol Guldur). [anyone know the right name for that one? Dwarves end up blowing up the cave troll with C4.] I believe if you can easily handle/manage that fight, you're pretty set.


    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    Thanks in advance.
    Just hope this and the others posting has helped.
    Last edited by Aoeworth; Jun 11 2010 at 04:24 AM.

  3. #28
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aoeworth View Post
    We're Captains, we're nice ^^
    I hate banners too. I only use them in groups (crit of course, and which banner really does depend on the fight, length, opponents etc). I find my archer more than makes up for it. Many will disagree. I don't have a might built cappy, so my dps is lower than most, adding 10% to bleh = bleh. If I hit for 200 and my archer hits for 100 my archer is now +50%. Also you've heard that we're better at healing others > healing ourselves so let archer take the aggro suits me fine. [honestly that idea works for 5seconds, but works better for archer to take one mob, I take the other] Cappys who never run heralds is mainly due to the fact they want to use muster courage as a self heal. If you're running this build you need to have a might/vit build imho. To reduce incoming melee damage (and virtued up as such), as that muster courage heal isn't huge and has a longish CD too. [but again, that area I'm not to clued up on]

    I'm traited full HoH and 2 Leader (I HATE the mark cooldown). This allows me to
    1. no re-trait solo vs. group
    2. Valiant Strike Heal over time if things get hairy.
    3. Quickly change Telling mark to revealing mark if again, things get hairy.

    Yeah always conflicting advice, different ways to play. Well, it seems like you don't like banners, no problem. I use the archer herald only. It adds DPS, which I need when soloing since i'm not built for dps (might/agility) I'm built for long fights (vit/fate) where I'm not tanking obviously (might). I just feel happy when I have the highest morale in the group. [i know it's not the only factor etc but it still feels good ]

    If I really want to DPS with my build I'll trait it so I can use oathbreakers archer. I prefer to run HoH as while the fights last longer I feel more in control of the fight through the heals etc. (for example, have my archer open up the fight with revealing mark on the target. Auto attack, and hit inspire once in a while. Yay, I'm killing mobs while having cake in one hand and a cookie in the other, and the fight lasts long enough to finish both of them, nom nom nom). Traited Rallying cry is a MUST. (as is +rally cry heal, cooldown and vocal heal on your emblem!!!) With that skill and emblem you can fight on and on and on and ....

    Because I feel 'safe' with high morale and strong heals, using telling mark in a fight to make it go a bit quicker is all good (again I always get telling mark legacy) and with to arms/strength of will on my archer (hey it's all good practice for grouping right). Like I said, if I find myself sinking...revealing mark. Playing like this I rarely use pots/food let alone man heal.
    Your build appeals to me. Consider it stolen! Hahahaha. ;-) I'm going to give it a shot and see how I like it! :-D

    PS Aoeworth: Do you ever skirmish solo? If so, how do you find that build works for it?
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  4. #29
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    The build I went with was 5 traits in HoH (Strong Voice) (Captain's Hope) (Now for Wrath) (Fear No Darkness) (Strength from Within) and 2 traits in LTC (Turn the Tide) for AOE and Stun (Focused Strikes)

    Legendary Traits of (In Defense of Middle Earth) (Oathbreaker's Shame) and (Hands of Healing)

    I run with only banners

    Have no problems running with Kin in any instance and retraiting is not that necessary with this build. It works for solo and in groups.

    Also have symbol well set up for healing (-30 second cool down for Rally Cry and -6% healing cost reduction, etc...) and two hand sword for DPS (set to hit 5 creatures with Maximum Targets for Pressing Attack, Pressing Attack crit bonus, etc...) , Have 1st age weapon set up to do buffs and will buff +1215 For Melee crit buff, +1368 for parry buff and 158.4 on focus power regen buff.

    I also solo skirmishes with this build and take out the elites in the skirmishes solo this way. Hate using the sidekick who has little controls and most of the time stands there without helping in fights, so running without a herald or a soldier is the way to go for me.

    I have enjoyed this build and am able to hold my own solo against up to 8 same level normal mobs at once (though that does hurt a lot) and plow through same level elites without loosing even 1/3 morale by end of fight.
    Last edited by adamantiumdragon; Jun 14 2010 at 10:05 AM.
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  5. #30
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aoeworth View Post
    ...
    I hate banners too. I only use them in groups (crit of course, and which banner really does depend on the fight, length, opponents etc). I find my archer more than makes up for it. Many will disagree. I don't have a might built cappy, so my dps is lower than most, adding 10% to bleh = bleh. If I hit for 200 and my archer hits for 100 my archer is now +50%. Also you've heard that we're better at healing others > healing ourselves so let archer take the aggro suits me fine. [honestly that idea works for 5seconds, but works better for archer to take one mob, I take the other] Cappys who never run heralds is mainly due to the fact they want to use muster courage as a self heal. If you're running this build you need to have a might/vit build imho. To reduce incoming melee damage (and virtued up as such), as that muster courage heal isn't huge and has a longish CD too. [but again, that area I'm not to clued up on]
    ...
    I agree with you that the Archer does more DPS than a captain alone. I did post test results to the forum, which have been purged, that showed that the best DPS I could do was with an archer a 4 red/2 yellow (Precise Ally and Loyalty)/1 blue (Now for Wrath). I'm running a fairly balanced build with my might and agility around 430.

    In regards to Muster Courage, over time it can return 2.5 to 3 times as much healing as Lend Will, and the healing improves as you increase your tactical healing and vocal healing legacy.

    ...
    If I really want to DPS with my build I'll trait it so I can use oathbreakers archer.
    ...
    I'm sorry to tell you this, but I also ran tests for the Master of Oaths and the Oathbreaker Armaments. Those posts were also purged from the forums.

    Master of Oaths only increses the Archer's moral by about 400, reduces incoming damage by about 2 % and increases damage output by about 2% to 3%.

    The Oathbreaker Armament does not increase dps or damage resistance by any test I have tried. The devs claim that it gives your herald some kind of increased resistances but do not say what they are. I know for certain that it is not common damage resistance.
    Last edited by SGWB; Jun 11 2010 at 04:17 PM.

  6. #31
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Interesting finds SGWB, thanks for that info. Was not aware that oathbreakers herald isn't all that.

    Did you ever test the Forchel herald vs. our normal ones? I'd imagine traiting is the big factor in their damage output and armour values as opposed to what kind they are.

    However in closing, oathbreakers archer looks cool and we all know image is everything, lol.

    and to the OP.

    Yes I skirmish solo all the damn time....dammit And it's no problem at all, well, when I say solo is more like a 3 man fellowship. Me, my archer and my warrior. SB my warrior, attack with archer (in skirm he's always on aggressive, just order him who to attack first), then when the mobs come in warrior goes for it, I sit back and have a cookie for a bit. Throw to arms, strength from within, throw a heal and pile on in myself.

    It's why I love captains. Can sit back a bit like a general and analyze the fight and dissect it mob by mob. With a big big pull, I'll target though the warrior, order archer to attack same target and burn a couple of the trash mobs down quickly (defeat skills). Also if there is the big pull I open up with valiant strike immediately, because somebodies gonna get hit...a lot, lol. If the big pull is big, I'll be able to use VS again before the fight is over (most likely).

    Here is the trait setup I have, and others feel free to critique as well, as I too am always looking to somehow improve.

    Empathy, Valour, Loyalty, Justice, Idealism.

    HoH line (I never change it) Captain's Hope, Relentless Optimism, Deeds before words, Now for wrath, Words of courage.
    LoM: Loyalty, Precise Ally
    If grouping and I can visit a bard, I'll do this
    LoM: Tactical Prowess, Captain of War. (or Adherent of Elendil, Captain of War...better but lose the mark cooldown )

    Legendary: Oathbreakers Shame, Idome, HoH.
    Last edited by Aoeworth; Jun 12 2010 at 01:47 AM.

  7. #32

    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Captains solo just fine....albeit slowly. Our DPS remains pretty low; but with the ability to self heal (and if you're somewhat lower level, to have a herald who can be shield-brothered), we remain a viable solo class. Is Captain the easiest to solo? Not really....but with careful pulling, you'll be able to handle those days when you find yourself playing alone. And at 65, you'll be invaluable to raid groups.

  8. #33
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aoeworth View Post
    Interesting finds SGWB, thanks for that info. Was not aware that oathbreakers herald isn't all that.

    Did you ever test the Forchel herald vs. our normal ones? I'd imagine traiting is the big factor in their damage output and armour values as opposed to what kind they are.

    However in closing, oathbreakers archer looks cool and we all know image is everything, lol.
    ....
    I have never tested the Forochel armaments. Rumor has it that the devs are looking into improving Master of Oaths. Maybe they will took at the Oathbreaker Armaments as well.

  9. #34
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tarkin View Post
    Captains solo just fine....albeit slowly. Our DPS remains pretty low; but with the ability to self heal (and if you're somewhat lower level, to have a herald who can be shield-brothered), we remain a viable solo class. Is Captain the easiest to solo? Not really....but with careful pulling, you'll be able to handle those days when you find yourself playing alone. And at 65, you'll be invaluable to raid groups.
    I'd say of all my toons (all classes), i found my captain the second-easiest to solo, behind my warden. He is very hard to kill, even with a bad pull. Although, yes, wish DPS was higher for some fights can drag on.
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  10. #35
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    I have a cappy currently at 62 and don't have too much trouble soloing. Sounds like the biggest problem your running into is getting too far into the mobs. I find it best to only pull one or two at a time and just take my time but then again my first character was a hunter so I am very used to managing my pulls. Your yell taunt, and the one mark that does damage is excellent for ranged pulling.

    I run a mixed blend heavy on the lead the charge side when soloing just for the added dps. Also I tend to switch out weapons often, usually using whatever is my current max dps weapon.. Even if it's not a legendary. And I'm in about the same boat as you for virtues, I put them off for a long time. I am currently in the process of working them up abit though just for that little bit extra.

    Unfortunately there is no one right way to do things. Alot of it is just personal preference and play style. If you like to wade into the middle of 6 mobs and beat them all down, your going to have to load up on the AR and mitigations as well as some healing. If you like to pick them off one by one, then you can just focus on DPS. You'll have to think about how you like to play and what is the weak points in that play style. Then trait and gear to mitigate that weakness as best as possible.

    I know that nothing I said is a "do this, because of this" but i've found that if you just cookie cutter exactly what someone else does it generally turns out bad. I find it better to hear what other people do or like and take just the parts that sound useful or interesting and integrate them into what I already do. It makes a more unique character, and is more enjoyable to play for me.
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  11. #36

    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    I also think, not in line with OP, that Moria was great. There were things to do...then Loth and rught after the anti-climactic diappointment of SoM killed it for me. I started the game back near release with a captain, so I cannot coment on speed, but it was not hard in general. I found cpt then to be perhaps best for solo, or near the top, though having played only one chracter, it's not a well-founded remark in that respect back then. However, I was able to solo quests that weren't solo. I used my herald solo back then. The herald died just about every time, but what he did was occupy a few mobs long enough to let me do the damage I need to make the fight winnable. Herald was also used to occupy mobs so I could go run through places, pick up things, etc. Same as a stun when you send a herald at a mob...

    There are low points yes, prolly for everyone like it has been said. 30-35 harsh, but 35 changes the game, get horse, whole new class of weapons and armour, skills. It's a hill to climb geting from 27-35 but 35 was the best level I ever changed to, personally, hah maybe because cpt was getting very slow and boring. Then there is 42-50 which was hard, but a last stretch so I hung in. Not sure what it's like now, but i was proud of my cpt solo ability. A group of course is always quicker, but not if it takes like an hour or something to get together. I just did all solo and easy ones because by the time I found the group, the 5K xp from the quest wasn't even worth it time-wise, when I could have gone somewhere else and did a bunch of starter solo quests real quick.

    That's my advice. If your group is there or people are doing same thing at same time, join up. If no responses, or slow time of day, skip the fellow quests and move on to the next area with a pile of solo and bang 'em out best you can. I hate waiting to fill groups. I did it in Dol Dinen with my cpt, and never did DD again with my alts, unless I had kin come or a group at the ready. If it's your first toon and you want to read the story and experience the land and quests, that way is longest, especially first time through when you don't know what's up. We didn't even have the quest arrow in the radar, had to ask people or wander around and find things. That in itself makes it so much quicker.

    Things are different now, with skills and trair lines etc. Muster courage self-heals and bonuses. I gathered as much might and Vitality as I could on the best armour I came across, but I guess now we sacrifice all this damage ability and replace it with heal because at end of Shadows of Angmar they react to player wishes and polls, and many a capt wanted a better heal ability (yes it is true) but to do so they drop cpt DPS much to my chagrin, so now cpt can heal self solo and live longer and take longer to kill. In groups though it can be a boon in raids and other tight spots, while other times the heals are redundant...

    Anyway my 22 1/2 cents.

    Good luck. I still love my cpt...

  12. #37

    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Thanks everyone for the responses. I think WoW forums made me permanently a little gun-shy about forum flaming (yes, I play WoW, liking LOTRO does not mean hating WoW or vice versa, so just don't even ;-). So it's a relief to find that not going on here.

    Especial thanks to the folks who have posted in with crunchy details about what they're doing. Obviously there's a lot of variety in approaches, I will have to do some more experimenting I guess.

    Just to be clear -- I have absolutely no problem playing the Captain in groups, there things work wonderfully. Obviously the class is really set up to shine in group. However, with my schedule it is hard to find groups, especially for questing.

    I also haven't YET run into much problem skirmishing "solo," because of course you're not really "solo," you have the pet soldier and can always also run your herald if you want.

    What's been painful is specifically and only the solo level grind. I don't and can't wade into piles of mobs because I die. Quickly. I pull very carefully, using Noble Mark or Threatening Shout if there are other mobs too close in range. If it's just a kill/drop quest, this works fine because I can just stay on the edges and wait for respawns. Where it *doesn't* work is in solo quests where you have to penetrate deep into a camp to click on clicky things like ballistae or plaques or statues, and unfortunately there are lots of quests like that. If I pull multiple mobs in an attempt to get through quickly, I get overwhelmed and die, and if I pull singles and duos very carefully, I can't get them down fast enough to avoid getting hammered by respawn, especially respawning pats. And then I have Dread, and can't penetrate back into the camp to pick up where I left off without getting killed again, and that's usually about when I quit in disgust for the night. Again. And this happens repeatedly with quests that are marked as Solo quests, at level or slightly below level, and it just seems like either the quests are horribly mismarked or I must be doing something wrong.

    I will have to try some of the suggestions for making the Herald a better offtank, because so far my experience has been that I pull aggro off the Herald way too quick...only if I don't touch a mob at all will it stay on the Herald, and then it can become hard to keep the Herald up. Duos work okay with the Herald offtanking, but trios and quartets become real trouble especially when the mobs bleed or stun. If there weren't so many 3- and 4-pulls (or duos that BECOME 4 pulls because it takes so long to get the mobs down that respawn happens on top of you!) it'd be a different story.

    I'm also finding certain kinds of mobs, particularly those evil shards of darkness in Mirkwood, that pound me so hard solo that getting a second one respawning on top of me during a fight is pretty much guaranteed death.

    My problem with self-healing keeping me up during soloing is not usually that of running out of power, but running out of healing abilities such that they're all on cooldown and good night, Irene. (I'm a Scholar and have potions which do help a bit, but still.)

    So if anybody has any specific thoughts about those situations I'm describing, please let me know. Other than that, I'll fool around with the advice given so far in this thread, and my thanks to all. :-)

  13. #38
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    Re: Soloing as Captain?

    Quote Originally Posted by NazgulWannabe View Post
    ....
    I will have to try some of the suggestions for making the Herald a better offtank, because so far my experience has been that I pull aggro off the Herald way too quick...only if I don't touch a mob at all will it stay on the Herald, and then it can become hard to keep the Herald up. Duos work okay with the Herald offtanking, but trios and quartets become real trouble especially when the mobs bleed or stun. If there weren't so many 3- and 4-pulls (or duos that BECOME 4 pulls because it takes so long to get the mobs down that respawn happens on top of you!) it'd be a different story.
    What armaments do you have on your herald? I recommend the Major Reinforced armaments, of any flavor.

    I'm also finding certain kinds of mobs, particularly those evil shards of darkness in Mirkwood, that pound me so hard solo that getting a second one respawning on top of me during a fight is pretty much guaranteed death.
    Those suckers hit hard because they use shadow damage. I try to avoid them whenever possible As far as killing them faster, All I can recommend is to get Beleriand damage on your weapon. It is the best overall damage type for your legendary weapon. The cheapest, fastest way to do that is to run the Midnight Raid instance out of Echad Dunan in Eregion. It will take a small fellowship.

    I personally love this instance. I plant my archer near the fire on aggressive mode, and then I and another player form a triangle around the fire while our third burns tents. Easy mode.

    My problem with self-healing keeping me up during soloing is not usually that of running out of power, but running out of healing abilities such that they're all on cooldown and good night, Irene. (I'm a Scholar and have potions which do help a bit, but still.)
    ....
    Just make sure you have Revealing mark on your target for the self heal. I use revealing mark anytime I have to fight more than one mob. If you have the HoH capstone you can trait for it and get an additional, very powerful, self heal. You will give up some DPS for it. If you aren't having power problems then you may want to give up some will for might and agility as well. I rarely suggest giving up fate.

    Hope it helps
    Last edited by SGWB; Jun 24 2010 at 03:48 PM.

 

 
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