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  1. #26
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by bprorsum View Post

    I'll remember this when a Freep makes note of the endless grind for Hope pots, Scrolls, Pots, Wound/Poison/Fear/Disease Pots, etc. etc. etc.
    yeah well, my warden can make 9g in 30minutes of play time every 3days or so. I have to farm for an hour for a gold which lasts around 2-3days creepside on a zerg server.
    Last edited by Aurthur; Apr 27 2010 at 10:16 PM.

  2. #27
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    As a R11 Warleader I'd accept a nerf to my AOE Rez in return for a buff in some other aspect of my class.

    On the whole tho.... nerfs are never good.... why penalize the players when its not them who screwed up?

    Turbine screwed up, so let them be punished by actually putting some work and late night shifts at the office coming up with ways to buff freeps or give them actual tangible rewards for pvping in the Moors.

  3. #28
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by lotrsam View Post
    sorry stubi, but guards should not be complainging about the current moors. I assume this is from a 1v1 standpoint. Champs and hunters have it alot worse...especially hunters.
    Not complaining pointing out flaws. A reaver has more bpe than a guardian, more morale than anything, about equal dps to a champ and they are fine?

    As for the guy who said 20% block i never realised you could block in OP stance with a 2 hander?
    [center][charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080000000abd01/signature.png]Stubi[/charsig]
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  4. #29
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Assassin12 View Post
    Not complaining pointing out flaws. A reaver has more bpe than a guardian, more morale than anything, about equal dps to a champ and they are fine?

    As for the guy who said 20% block i never realised you could block in OP stance with a 2 hander?
    As strong as reavers are right now, you tend to chew through on your guard.

    I honestly think with top gear and a good player, guardian is one of the strongest 1v1 toons out there this book.


    Even my Signature is trolling!

  5. #30
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by thenoobler View Post
    As a R11 Warleader I'd accept a nerf to my AOE Rez in return for a buff in some other aspect of my class.

    On the whole tho.... nerfs are never good.... why penalize the players when its not them who screwed up?

    Turbine screwed up, so let them be punished by actually putting some work and late night shifts at the office coming up with ways to buff freeps or give them actual tangible rewards for pvping in the Moors.
    Just put this up cause its going to be easier for turbine than adding freep incentives lol
    [center][charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080000000abd01/signature.png]Stubi[/charsig]
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  6. #31
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    As strong as reavers are right now, you tend to chew through on your guard.

    I honestly think with top gear and a good player, guardian is one of the strongest 1v1 toons out there this book.
    I agree However most of the other classes dont have a hope no matter how good the player/gear is.
    [center][charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080000000abd01/signature.png]Stubi[/charsig]
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  7. #32
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Celestialdemons View Post
    Good thing stuff is not balanced for 1 versus 1 though, heh?
    A good burglar will beat a warg in a 1v1.

  8. #33
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherGab View Post
    A good burglar will beat a warg in a 1v1.
    You mean a burglar who uses cooldowns or is skilled?
    [center][charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080000000abd01/signature.png]Stubi[/charsig]
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  9. #34
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Assassin12 View Post
    You mean a burglar who uses cooldowns or is skilled?
    Skilled.

    123

  10. #35
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherGab View Post
    Skilled.

    123
    Without cooldowns, and even without using cb/pounce or stealth, the good burgs i have faced have always lost. The only time they win is when they start using cooldowns like TnG. Toe to toe with no cooldowns from either class, the warg will win hands down. It's when you get dited and the burg immediatly uses TnG you begin to have some problems and get wrecked.
    Last edited by lotrsam; Apr 28 2010 at 07:08 AM.

  11. #36
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by lotrsam View Post
    Without cooldowns, and even without using cb/pounce or stealth, the burgs i have faced have always lost. The only time they win is when they start using cooldowns like TnG. Toe to toe with no cooldowns from either class, the warg will win hands down. It's when you get dited and the burg immediatly uses TnG you begin to have some problems.
    You have prob been fighting burgs traited QK. Try a good one with Gambler. Jugglez from B/W kicks *** 5 gambler traited, with his legacies. So much self healing.

  12. #37
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherGab View Post
    You have prob been fighting burgs traited QK. Try a good one with Gambler. Jugglez from B/W kicks *** 5 gambler traited, with his legacies. So much self healing.
    I'll ask the better burgs on my server, but with the burst dps a warg has i question the effectiveness of the self healing. I dont know the cooldown on the self heal, but i would think if i kill you in 30 seconds, you arnt going to get it off that many times.

  13. #38
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by lotrsam View Post
    I'll ask the better burgs on my server, but with the burst dps a warg has i question the effectiveness of the self healing. I dont know the cooldown on the self heal, but i would think if i kill you in 30 seconds, you arnt going to get it off that many times.
    45s for MG, and there's a gamble that heals you. Jugglez has all the legacies for them and a lot of inc healing, heals him around 1.2k each, 1k+ on a morale pot.

  14. #39

    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by BrotherGab View Post
    45s for MG, and there's a gamble that heals you. Jugglez has all the legacies for them and a lot of inc healing, heals him around 1.2k each, 1k+ on a morale pot.
    The only other self heal is Clever Retort, which has only a 1/4 chance to actually heal. You don't need to be Gambler traited to use it, nor does Gambler give you any extra healing bonuses than Quiet Knife. Mishchief Maker gives you +15% healing from Glee & Clever Retort, but very few Burglars trait 4 deep into it.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080000001901d1/01006/signature.png]undefined[/charsig]

  15. #40

    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    I am well aware that while things aren't balanced for 1 vs 1, that there are some classes that will beat others in a single man battle.

    And too bad we are not on the same server Despawn. I would have loved a fight.
    [CENTER][FONT=Century Gothic][SIZE=2][B][I]-[/I][/B][B][I] Edheluilas : [/I][/B][I] 68[/I][I] Champion [/I][B][I]- Edheluila : [/I][/B][I]7[/I][I]5 Hunter[/I][B][I] - [/I][I]Ceolhem : 7[/I][/B][I]5 Burglar[/I][B][I] -[/I][I] Dwormurin [/I][I]: 65[/I][/B][I] Guardian[/I][B][I] - [/I][I]Andryella : [/I][/B][/SIZE][I][SIZE=2]55 Loremaster[/SIZE] -[B]Darkwill :[/B] 65 Captain[/I][/FONT][I]
    Members of Insurrection[SIZE=1]
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  16. #41
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Morihei View Post
    LOL at the same old Freep names that jump in to cry out to nerf creeps so they can have total easymode back. Some things never change.

    pretty easy to turn that around. Go back to farming greenies for your easymode and dont QQ when you get zerged for doing it. (anyone camping Grams/GV deserves to get zerged)
    Apparently you know all about me. Anyway, to put things in perspective, the only people that would claim freepside wasn't OP prior to SoA B13 and during MoM B6 are the easymoding zealots. The only people still claiming creepside isn't OP right now are the easymoding zealots. Personally, I could care less at this point since so many other things bother me more than playing for the weaker side (not to mention I actually prefer playing for the weaker side). But that doesn't mean I'm not going to call out the same old, tired, propaganda spreaders for doing what they've done best for 3 years now.

    Edit: and no, I'm not claiming creepside is anywhere near as OP freepside was during B6. Freeps got a major nerf, this thread refers to a small nerf.
    Last edited by FajaSailors; Apr 28 2010 at 12:39 PM.

  17. #42
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by thenoobler View Post
    As a R11 Warleader I'd accept a nerf to my AOE Rez in return for a buff in some other aspect of my class.
    I've seen way too many balanced raid v. raid fights to justify this change.

    It's situational.

    On Brandywine and Elendilmir, the rez is OP because there's already a 2:1 or 3:1 numbers imbalance. But when a freep raid leader presents a balanced fight, with captain buffs, shield walls, and minstrel focus-heals, creeps only have rezzes at their disposal to remain competitive.

    Don't rebalance the skills because of a severe numbers imbalance: FIX the numbers imbalance, by adding freep incentives such as better armour and LI advancement items.

    I do agree that wargs' autoattacks need to be fixed, so they don't do such insane DPS, and spiders' DPS needs to be reduced slightly (160 non-crit DoTs, 230 Crit DoTs, currently that's a lot of DPS, considering they stack, and there's no way for Freeps to debuff that damage {Fire Lore for Reavers/Wargs, Wind Lore for BAs}).

    But don't nerf our Maximum Morale AND our Rez. Come on now.
    Last edited by Draugrim; Apr 28 2010 at 02:03 PM.

  18. #43
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Draugrim View Post
    Don't rebalance the skills because of a severe numbers imbalance: FIX the numbers imbalance, by adding freep incentives such as better armour and LI advancement items.



    But don't nerf our Maximum Morale AND our Rez. Come on now.
    Omfg I'm not alone xD. Yah iv'e been saying that for a long time. I'm lucky enough to play on a server that has relatively balanced raid v raid fights. Nothing as huge as E or BW but its usually 1 raid versus 1 raid and the fights can go on for some time unless one side is flanked/falls apart under whatever pressure is presented. I have complaints with pvp but none that essentially make winning impossible or my playtime completely unenjoyable.

    I'd be in favor of a player/class cap as thats more controllable than giving rewards to one side and making people zerg onto it. Caps can be controlled shiny pve armor sets/OP classes(both sides) is not controllable.
    Edit: You could make it so unless you leave/logged outside of grams/gv that the timer wouldn't affect you. Also the cap could be set higher for more populated servers and would also be able to (theoretically) help with the lag as the cap could be set below a mark that involves insane/unplayable lag.
    Last edited by elros9999; Apr 28 2010 at 02:21 PM.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/07206000000062d60/signature.png]Neithian[/charsig]

  19. #44
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Sezneg View Post
    As strong as reavers are right now, you tend to chew through on your guard.

    I honestly think with top gear and a good player, guardian is one of the strongest 1v1 toons out there this book.
    LOL at this conversation. Basically what is being said is that a cookie-cutter Reaver can be beaten by a top gear, well-played player. Lets take a look at the problem that creates:

    1) How many Freep toons, game-wide, have acquired their ideal build at any point in the history of this game? I would guess maybe less than 50 players, GAME-WIDE, across all servers.

    2) Why aren't there more? Because nearly every way to build a toon on Freep side is based on luck, chance, RNG. Almost nothing is guaranteed, as you complete content. I know many players who have gone 2+ years without seeing a specific, ideal, item drop, and/or winning it.

    3) Compare that with how easily/guaranteed a Creep player can accomplish a specific, ideal, build. Every one can, with relatively no luck necessary. If you complete the rank, you get acquire the corruptions, the traits, the skills, etc. Acquiring stones from the delving are the only random chance aspect of creating a perfect build, and the stones drop nearly every time. Very easy to get.

    What is basically being stated is that an exceptionally rare built Freep is the equivalent to a very common, top tier built Creep.

    There is definitely something wrong with that type of system.
    [SIZE="2"][COLOR="Yellow"]I guarantee your level 65 r0 greenie BA will contribute more to your Creep raid than my level 2 Minstrel will contribute to my Freep raid. After all, both took about 5 seconds to create.[/COLOR][/size]
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  20. #45
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by olagaton View Post
    1) How many Freep toons, game-wide, have acquired their ideal build at any point in the history of this game? I would guess maybe less than 50 players, GAME-WIDE, across all servers.

    3) Compare that with how easily/guaranteed a Creep player can accomplish a specific, ideal, build. Every one can, with relatively no luck necessary. If you complete the rank, you get acquire the corruptions, the traits, the skills, etc. Acquiring stones from the delving are the only random chance aspect of creating a perfect build, and the stones drop nearly every time. Very easy to get.
    Well for one just because it's a players ideal build, does not mean that it's the best build for PvP.

    Creep ideal build? thats laughable, Creeps dont really have to much choice in builds, they were designed in a cookie cutter fashion to illustrate the mass hords of Sauron.

  21. #46
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Morihei View Post
    Well for one just because it's a players ideal build, does not mean that it's the best build for PvP.

    Creep ideal build? thats laughable, Creeps dont really have to much choice in builds, they were designed in a cookie cutter fashion to illustrate the mass hords of Sauron.
    And yet most do pretty well once they hit higher ranks.

  22. #47
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by FajaSailors View Post
    And yet most do pretty well once they hit higher ranks.
    That's because their cookie-cutter/single build is the strongest build you can achieve. Ironically, their builds take little to no effort.

  23. #48
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Morihei View Post
    Well for one just because it's a players ideal build, does not mean that it's the best build for PvP.
    The difference is taking into account the ideal PvP build, regardless of whether the player chose it or not.

    Creep ideal build? thats laughable, Creeps dont really have to much choice in builds, they were designed in a cookie cutter fashion to illustrate the mass hords of Sauron.
    That doesn't make it any less effective. Fact remains, nearly every creep has the same opportunity to become the best built specific creep class on the server, whereas very few Freeps have the same opportunity to be the best built specific freep class on the server. I just wonder if Turbine (or players perceptions) are being based on the best built of each side, or if Turbine weighs the strength of the best built Creeps against just the average Freep build.
    [SIZE="2"][COLOR="Yellow"]I guarantee your level 65 r0 greenie BA will contribute more to your Creep raid than my level 2 Minstrel will contribute to my Freep raid. After all, both took about 5 seconds to create.[/COLOR][/size]
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0a20b000000085aec/signature.png]Chea[/charsig]

  24. #49
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    I dont have a quite ideal build yet as the thought of killing morroval in moria makes me want to cry. Also got a few other traits to get to 10.
    Reavers seems to come down to luck tbh if i crit ttk i win 90% of the time if they get some good bpe i lose. For example i beat a well played r9 and r10 reaver twice with no cooldowns and then lost to some ratehr average r7s because i was at 4k before i landed a skill.

    If Turbine balances 1v1 around a guardian then its almost perfect however we had a 1v1 session yesterday morning and me and a very good captain where the only ones who could win 1v1s over 50% of the time without cooldowns.

    Biggest change would be to remove the cripple pounce cj drop the chance of it proccing and make it a stun rather than a cj.
    Last edited by Assassin12; Apr 28 2010 at 05:43 PM.
    [center][charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080000000abd01/signature.png]Stubi[/charsig]
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  25. #50
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    Re: Suggestion: Small creep nerf

    Quote Originally Posted by Assassin12 View Post
    I dont have a quite ideal build yet as the thought of killing morroval in moria makes me want to cry. Also got a few other traits to get to 10.
    Just do the morroval ixp instance each day. You get something like 20-25 merrevail per run, and you'll be done before you know it.

 

 
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