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  1. #26

    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    This thread is moronic. I'm not sure what server you play on, but on mine things are the most balanced they've been since Book 14.

    Creeps 1v1 and small groups > Freeps 1v1 and in small groups

    Creeps in raids < Freeps in raids

  2. #27
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCrusher View Post
    This thread is moronic. I'm not sure what server you play on, but on mine things are the most balanced they've been since Book 14.

    Creeps 1v1 and small groups > Freeps 1v1 and in small groups

    Creeps in raids < Freeps in raids
    Creeps with a bunch of wls and reavers in raids > freeps in raids

    Balance is situational, you can't generalize it that far.

  3. #28

    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by oopsies View Post
    Creeps with a bunch of wls and reavers in raids > freeps in raids

    Balance is situational, you can't generalize it that far.
    Depends on what you consider a victory with a raid. WLs can rez up a raid and wipe the freeps but the freeps can make more renown out of it.

    If you consider a wipe a victory, then sure, you're right. But if you consider renown/infamy gain a victory my point stands.

  4. #29
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCrusher View Post
    Depends on what you consider a victory with a raid. WLs can rez up a raid and wipe the freeps but the freeps can make more renown out of it.

    If you consider a wipe a victory, then sure, you're right. But if you consider renown/infamy gain a victory my point stands.
    Any amount of renown is a victory, no matter now many deaths it takes to get.

  5. #30
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCrusher View Post
    This thread is moronic. I'm not sure what server you play on, but on mine things are the most balanced they've been since Book 14.

    Creeps 1v1 and small groups > Freeps 1v1 and in small groups

    Creeps in raids < Freeps in raids
    i also destroy 1vs1 on the warden so ya there ya go - situational

  6. #31

    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fladrif View Post
    i also destroy 1vs1 on the warden so ya there ya go - situational
    Then why are we complaining about one side if everything is situational?
    Last edited by TheCrusher; Apr 06 2010 at 01:37 AM.

  7. #32
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by FajaSailors View Post
    Mascolella misses his beard.
    Weren't you bald for a short time too?

  8. #33
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by TheCrusher View Post
    This thread is moronic. I'm not sure what server you play on, but on mine things are the most balanced they've been since Book 14.

    Creeps 1v1 and small groups > Freeps 1v1 and in small groups

    Creeps in raids < Freeps in raids
    Same on Windfola.

    Quote Originally Posted by oopsies View Post
    Creeps with a bunch of wls and reavers in raids > freeps in raids

    Balance is situational, you can't generalize it that far.
    Captains > Support than WLs. There's no question about it. A Freep raid Captains > A creep raid with WLs.

    I play both WL and Captain as my main characters, though the Captain a bit less in Moors.
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  9. #34
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZeppelinCobalt View Post
    Same on Windfola.



    Captains > Support than WLs. There's no question about it. A Freep raid Captains > A creep raid with WLs.

    I play both WL and Captain as my main characters, though the Captain a bit less in Moors.
    Captains are WAY different in their impact on a raid compared to a WL. A Creep raid with a bunch of WLs is going to be better off than a Freep raid with a bunch of Captains IMHO. The AoE rez with its short CD plus bubbles with a 2 min CD are much more useful than the Captain rezzes with long CDs and bubble with a 10 min CD. WLs make amazing healers/tanks. Captains are NOT a replacement for a mini/RK. I've played my Captain out there quite a bit. I can tell you two things. WLs have more of an impact than Captains in a raid vs raid situation. Captains suck soloing because 95% of the time Creeps run from me in a 1v1 situation. The other 5% that don't run are either high ranked or "brave" lol

    Edit: Having 1 Captain per group is all you need. You can always have more than 1 WL per group though and having 2 high ranked WLs in a reaver group helps.

  10. #35
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerboa View Post
    I think I'd prefer this because I like the mindset of underwargs.
    I like people who play because they like the game and laugh when they get rolled.

    I'd be happy to see the e-peen guys move Freepside.
    Two things;

    1) You have this option already. Just re-roll.

    2) Why is it an issue if the Freeps are the underdogs? If you like playing the underdog side and feel the freeps are that, then play freep side.

  11. #36
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Familiarity View Post
    have not played on every server, but when E is the focal point of many creep transfers - in one case a tribe from Firefoot - there's a problem that either needs to be addressed just the world itself or the game as a whole to try and deter the disparity in numbers.
    Just to point out... if you have a problem with xfers... then get ready, cause it will only get worse as the GAME AGES.... the population continually shrinks and those who still play will gradually congregate on the still largely populated servers such as: BW, E, and Landy.

    Our tribe made the decision to leave Firefoot now, and pick a server of the "big 3" of our own choosing.... as opposed to wait a year and have turbine force our server choice upon us.

    I wont apologize for being one step ahead of the game.

    We have taken steps to stay away from the zergs you cry about, and keep our groups small.... but thnxs for calling us out as part of a problem.

    Seeya round.

  12. #37
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfather View Post
    Captains are WAY different in their impact on a raid compared to a WL. A Creep raid with a bunch of WLs is going to be better off than a Freep raid with a bunch of Captains IMHO. The AoE rez with its short CD plus bubbles with a 2 min CD are much more useful than the Captain rezzes with long CDs and bubble with a 10 min CD. WLs make amazing healers/tanks. Captains are NOT a replacement for a mini/RK. I've played my Captain out there quite a bit. I can tell you two things. WLs have more of an impact than Captains in a raid vs raid situation. Captains suck soloing because 95% of the time Creeps run from me in a 1v1 situation. The other 5% that don't run are either high ranked or "brave" lol

    Edit: Having 1 Captain per group is all you need. You can always have more than 1 WL per group though and having 2 high ranked WLs in a reaver group helps.
    Having 2 captains is even better. If you think having just 1 morale banner traited captain in your group is as good as it gets for freep raids with captains, I really would like to know why you think having 1 more last stand+ihw and oathbreakers...and aoe on defeat heal, and another buff banner and aoe run buff(with maybe some legacy love) is so bad. More than that is too much, just like it is creepside with warleaders. But 2 is actually rather ideal.

    I also have no idea why you brought up what captains can do solo when comparing captains to warleaders because captains are better off.
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  13. #38
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Toranoga View Post
    Two things;

    1) You have this option already. Just re-roll.

    2) Why is it an issue if the Freeps are the underdogs? If you like playing the underdog side and feel the freeps are that, then play freep side.
    In every game I play if I get the chance to play an animal 'toon I'll end up playing the animal 'toon. It really cracks me up to see a large dog running around on the screen. Now if the Freeps had a bear I could play I'd be all about that.

  14. #39
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerboa View Post
    In every game I play if I get the chance to play an animal 'toon I'll end up playing the animal 'toon. It really cracks me up to see a large dog running around on the screen. Now if the Freeps had a bear I could play I'd be all about that.

    So you should re-roll. That would be the nerf you are asking for.

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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by thenoobler View Post
    Just to point out... if you have a problem with xfers... then get ready, cause it will only get worse as the GAME AGES.... the population continually shrinks and those who still play will gradually congregate on the still largely populated servers such as: BW, E, and Landy.

    Our tribe made the decision to leave Firefoot now, and pick a server of the "big 3" of our own choosing.... as opposed to wait a year and have turbine force our server choice upon us.

    I wont apologize for being one step ahead of the game.

    We have taken steps to stay away from the zergs you cry about, and keep our groups small.... but thnxs for calling us out as part of a problem.

    Seeya round.
    I don`t claim E and have no say in who can play on the server. I left my old one because it did not have much to offer for PvE and I had no time to lead a kin otherwise. E did not attract me for a number of reasons, but I ultimately transferred to the server for a dear friend.

    I have heard your claims to avoid the zerg, unless no other freeps are to be found. Day of volume III I saw many members of your tribe right up at GV for an extended period of time (I saw at least four rank 11 reavers, two of them were not in your tribe though). I am not here to condone it like members of another tribe. You are straight up and aggressive, though it is hard to take down your group due to the high ranks when against freeps of a similar size.

    Do you not deny the number disparity however? I can think of worse transfers and rerollers, or flippers for that matter. What made E the choice out of the big three? What was so wrong to pick a medium sized server that had more freeps on average than creeps and still had a longer lifespan than Firefoot?

    Not looking for an apology. You are sending a message however by attracting more creeps to come to E, which is not what the server needs. If anything, its encouraging the die out of smaller servers.

  16. #41

    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfather View Post
    Captains are WAY different in their impact on a raid compared to a WL. A Creep raid with a bunch of WLs is going to be better off than a Freep raid with a bunch of Captains IMHO. The AoE rez with its short CD plus bubbles with a 2 min CD are much more useful than the Captain rezzes with long CDs and bubble with a 10 min CD. WLs make amazing healers/tanks. Captains are NOT a replacement for a mini/RK. I've played my Captain out there quite a bit. I can tell you two things. WLs have more of an impact than Captains in a raid vs raid situation. Captains suck soloing because 95% of the time Creeps run from me in a 1v1 situation. The other 5% that don't run are either high ranked or "brave" lol

    Edit: Having 1 Captain per group is all you need. You can always have more than 1 WL per group though and having 2 high ranked WLs in a reaver group helps.
    ^^^^this ^^^^
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  17. #42
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfather View Post
    Captains are WAY different in their impact on a raid compared to a WL. A Creep raid with a bunch of WLs is going to be better off than a Freep raid with a bunch of Captains IMHO. The AoE rez with its short CD plus bubbles with a 2 min CD are much more useful than the Captain rezzes with long CDs and bubble with a 10 min CD. WLs make amazing healers/tanks. Captains are NOT a replacement for a mini/RK. I've played my Captain out there quite a bit. I can tell you two things. WLs have more of an impact than Captains in a raid vs raid situation. Captains suck soloing because 95% of the time Creeps run from me in a 1v1 situation. The other 5% that don't run are either high ranked or "brave" lol

    Edit: Having 1 Captain per group is all you need. You can always have more than 1 WL per group though and having 2 high ranked WLs in a reaver group helps.
    I play my captain as well as a WL in the moors. And I am telling you, they ARE better than WLs. Especially since they have 2 forms of CC, yes I understand you need to have an archer for one of them. But that doesn't change the fact that WLs still have NO CC. *Looks at Turbine*

    Rallying Cry with an 8.3s CD > WLs slow heals that can be easily interrupted by a single freep that knows what he's doing. And even easier if you have a Burglar with +50% addle and -10s CD.

    Rallying Cry: 8.3s CD, Group heal, heals about 500-800 with crits of 900-1.3k about, heals 150-200 power, also heals some morale and power over time for 12 seconds. Instant cast, all you need is a defeat response, not hard to get in a raid of freeps.

    Quit Whining And Fight: 10s CD, Group heal, heals about 1.5k with crits of 2k, 2.5s Induction.

    Words of Courage: 3s CD, Single Target heal, heals about 400-700 with crits of around 1k, also heals about 140ish morale every 3s for 12s. Instant Cast.

    Crack The Whip: 4s CD, Single Target Heal, heals about 1k with 1.5k crits, 1.5s Induction.

    R9 WL compared to Captain with L60 First ages. How can you say more than 1 captain is a waste?


    Quote Originally Posted by Loth_Don View Post
    Having 2 captains is even better. If you think having just 1 morale banner traited captain in your group is as good as it gets for freep raids with captains, I really would like to know why you think having 1 more last stand+ihw and oathbreakers...and aoe on defeat heal, and another buff banner and aoe run buff(with maybe some legacy love) is so bad. More than that is too much, just like it is creepside with warleaders. But 2 is actually rather ideal.

    I also have no idea why you brought up what captains can do solo when comparing captains to warleaders because captains are better off.
    Exactly.

    WLs and Captains are about even, however with the buffs they provide for your raid, they are superior to WLs. In smaller fights, WLs will be superior to Captains.

    And I've said before in other topics, the in combat Rez WLs get is Situationally Useful, if you need to rez more than 2 people your group is probably going to wipe no matter what. Atleast on small servers. Maybe on the bigger servers you can rez 5-10 people and still be good. But if you have to use more than 3 WL rezzes, I'm assuming the creeps will be wiped on the bigger servers.

    The rez is still nice, but like I said, Situationally Useful.


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  18. #43
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Familiarity View Post
    I don`t claim E and have no say in who can play on the server. I left my old one because it did not have much to offer for PvE and I had no time to lead a kin otherwise. E did not attract me for a number of reasons, but I ultimately transferred to the server for a dear friend.

    I have heard your claims to avoid the zerg, unless no other freeps are to be found. Day of volume III I saw many members of your tribe right up at GV for an extended period of time (I saw at least four rank 11 reavers, two of them were not in your tribe though). I am not here to condone it like members of another tribe. You are straight up and aggressive, though it is hard to take down your group due to the high ranks when against freeps of a similar size.

    Do you not deny the number disparity however? I can think of worse transfers and rerollers, or flippers for that matter. What made E the choice out of the big three? What was so wrong to pick a medium sized server that had more freeps on average than creeps and still had a longer lifespan than Firefoot?

    Not looking for an apology. You are sending a message however by attracting more creeps to come to E, which is not what the server needs. If anything, its encouraging the die out of smaller servers.
    I'll camp GV... dont like it... but I'll do it... espcially when freeps wont go anywhere else... thing is I'll try to get a fight moved off to the side of GV hill, closer towards LC.... when the freeps push down the hill, we come from behind and flank from the rear.... we do this enough times and a few freeps catch on to where we are coming from and come over to us there adn we have gotten some fun fights out of it. We do the same when its a OC shuffle and no freep groups are out roaming for us to go fight: we make do with the current situation, and try to get our own fight moved off somewhere to the side, other times I personally get bored and log off as do other members of the tribe, but no, not all.

    I dont recall sending any message for more creeps, other than those tribemates from firefoot, to come to E. We were the biggest tribe on firefoot, trust me you only got a small fraction of our number transfer and/or re-roll lol

    Why choose E? ... I went to Brandywine a year and a half ago... didnt like it and went back to Firefoot.... It was between Landy and Elendilmir... we hadnt decided yet and were puttering around on our decision... then that do-do-brain Toebite went and xferd to E before we decided, so rather than split up (I wanted to go to Landy) we all went to E together, those who could xfer and those who felt like re-rolling.

    Why go to a medium sized server? the point of the xfer was to be on one of the "big 3" servers, that way no more xfering till the day turbine closes the doors.

    There will never be a server with a good balance between freeps/creeps... its too easy to roll a creep... level to 10, then hit the "create a creep" button and voila! 1 or 2 nights of pvping and you got yourself a rank 3 sig creep.

    It shouldnt matter how many creeps are online, and doesnt matter to me in what server I was gunna xfer to... every server is creep heavy.

    I could personally care less if there were 10 raids of freeps in the moors... I would do what Ive done every other time in the past when freeps outnumbered us on firefoot ... we had our 12man and there were 3 different kin raids out about the same size... we would find one and smash it,. then use wargs to scout where the other 2 were and smash them... it never occured to me to throw a fit cause we got the outnumbered buff and it totally amazes me why freeps would ever have a problem with a big supply creeps to kill.

  19. #44

    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    No nerf required.

    I already went through one nerf and it was called MoM.

    Looking at the stats for all servers, the renown still outnumbers the infamy.
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  20. #45
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by nolins12 View Post
    It takes a group of 10 to kill a r7+ defiler
    Or one good champ.
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  21. #46
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Familiarity View Post

    I have not played on every server, but when E is the focal point of many creep transfers - in one case a tribe from Firefoot - there's a problem that either needs to be addressed just the world itself or the game as a whole to try and deter the disparity in numbers.
    We just had a pretty significant number of creeps transfer/roll new toons on Landy from E.

    And for the last week Landy has had a higher ratio of creeps:freeps than E. Not greater numbers mind you, but a higher ratio.

    /shrug

    It's ugly on most servers right now from what I'm seeing.
    [FONT=Tahoma][COLOR=#ffffff][COLOR=red][FONT=Tahoma][B][COLOR=darkorchid]Second Marshal[/COLOR] Luc Brandenbuck[/B][/FONT][/COLOR][/COLOR][COLOR=#a9a9a9][FONT=Tahoma] ~[B]Battlemaster[/B]~
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  22. #47
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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Familiarity View Post
    If anything, its encouraging the die out of smaller servers.
    Just wanted to touch on this seperately...

    The die out of smaller servers is inevitable for an MMO... LOTRO is going on 3 years now... every new MMO, especially big name ones, keep siphoning off veteran players, and in firefoot's case, virtually every large kin has disappeared due to jumping into another MMO enmasse. Right now there is just 1 kin doing endgame PVE... and when SWTOR comes out, alot of them are coming together with my tribe to that game, what then is there to offer a player, wether veteran or newly subbed, on firefoot at that time? The best thing for the vet is to xfer off or reroll somewhere else, the best for the newly subbed is to avoid it like the plague. How much more will it effect the small pvp community, ouch!

    Elendilmir has been receiving a constant flow of xfers, both creep *AND* freep, since xfer service started a year and a half ago, when OON snuck in before the service went public and people went ballistic that they were allowed to xfer to E and not others to servers they wanted.... it baffles me that in over a year people have still refused to accept the inevitable and instead stamp thier feet and throw a tantrum and deal wth the situation by adapting.

    Expect more xfers to BW, Landy and E.... those are the 3 servers people are going to flock to as the game ages.

  23. #48

    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by nolins12 View Post
    It takes a group of 10 to kill a r7+ defiler
    Possibly *the* goofiest thing I've read all week.

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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Loth_Don View Post
    Having 2 captains is even better. If you think having just 1 morale banner traited captain in your group is as good as it gets for freep raids with captains, I really would like to know why you think having 1 more last stand+ihw and oathbreakers...and aoe on defeat heal, and another buff banner and aoe run buff(with maybe some legacy love) is so bad. More than that is too much, just like it is creepside with warleaders. But 2 is actually rather ideal.

    I also have no idea why you brought up what captains can do solo when comparing captains to warleaders because captains are better off.
    Captains are better off solo than WLs? Have you ever been in a 1v1 against a WL? It used to be that a WL vs a Captain would take ungodly long. Now, it's just a matter of how long it takes the captain to run out of power.

    Yes having two captains in a group is nice, but we cannot DPS as well as other classes. IHW is a 5 min CD and only absorbs 50% of your fellow's damage if they are in range. LS however is a 15 min CD. So you can only pop that combo every 15 minutes. WLs can bubble someone every 2 mins and their bubble is even better than our SotD. The run buff only works with your fellowship. Our AoE heal is nice, but remember that the HoT part does not stack :/ The initial heal does but it doesn't even compare to the WL AoE heal which he can spam much more often and doesn't need a defeat response. TBH, WLs being compared to Captains is like comparing apples to oranges. WLs are more like a mix of Minstrels and Captains.
    I'm not sh****ng on Captains. I play one and know how much we can improve the survivability of a group. I for one would love to see an all captain raid, but sadly I am not sure we have that many Captains on our server who PvP (I could be wrong.)

    Edit: When I said 1 Captain per group, I was referring to a fellowship as a group. Maybe you thought I meant raid?
    Last edited by Godfather; Apr 06 2010 at 01:30 PM.

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    Re: Creeps: Would you endure a nerf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Godfather View Post
    Yes having two captains in a group is nice, but we cannot DPS as well as other classes. IHW is a 5 min CD and only absorbs 50% of your fellow's damage if they are in range.
    Who said anything about DPS? WLs DPS is far worse than Captains. Take my word for it.... or continue to ignore my posts and spew lies.

    The run buff only works with your fellowship.
    WL Buff is 10% less, only works out of combat and is still group only. What is your point?????

    Our AoE heal is nice, but remember that the HoT part does not stack :/ The initial heal does but it doesn't even compare to the WL AoE heal which he can spam much more often and doesn't need a defeat response.
    Please read my previous post. Rallying Cry is a shorter CD than Quit Whining And Fight. But I'm guessing your Captain doesn't have very good LI's. And if this is true, you have no right to argue WLs Vs. Captains. Every detail counts, including gear. If creeps need to "Gear" out their character by getting ranks and purchasing skills, you need to count Freeps getting there gear.

    TBH, WLs being compared to Captains is like comparing apples to oranges. WLs are more like a mix of Minstrels and Captains.
    Wrong again. WLs have all of 2 heals. One you start with, 1 at R1. Then you get a 15m instant cast heal and 10m CD 2.5s Induction heal at R9. Minstrels have.... atleast 7 iirc correctly. WL can in NO way compare to a minstrel for healing, aside from hitting the 15m CD uruk heal which hits any 100% RANDOM 6 targets within 20m of you. Even on my small server I rarely get the heal myself.


    ~~Khronus
    [center]
    ~R7 Guardian. R7 Burglar. R6 Captain. R7 Champion.~
    ~R11 WarLeader Sexpanther, Unhallowed.~
    [i][b][u][color=#FFFF00]~~~[/color][color=#FF0000]Arkenstone[/color][color=#FFFF00]~~~[/color][color=#FF0000]~~~[/color][color=#FFFF00]Elendilmir[/color][color=#FF0000]~~~[/color][/b][/u][/i][/center]

 

 
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