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  1. #1
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    Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Obviously Tolkien had no concept of character classes when he wrote LOTR, but it is fascinating to try and guess at what class some of the major characters would be had they been rendered as a LOTRO player character.

    Burglar: Obviously Burglar Baggins himself would be the inspiration. Frodo may be considered a Burglar. I think Golem would defintaly be a Burglar.

    Hunter: Legolas clearly. He is the only definite hunter I can think of. In The Hobbit the Dwarves are said to use bows capably, which I imagin is where the idea of dwarven hunter comes from.

    Lore-Master: I can't think of any lore-masters off the top of my head. Faramir says that when he first met Gandlaf he thought he was just a lore master to later realize he was much more. Radaghast and Saruman also fall into this category, but I think Saruman would be a little less "lore masterish" than the other two. I think that maybe Denethor could be considered a Lore-Master, and probably Elrond.

    Rune-Keeper: We can all admit that Rune-Keepers break Lore a bit. I really can't think of a good example of a Rune-Keeper. I think that maybe as he started to have more of a mind for power, Saruman perhaps became less Lore-Masterish and more Rune-Keeperish. However Gandalf does seem to "invoke names" in his power, so perhaps the Wizards are a healthy dose of both Rune-Keepr and Lore-Master.

    Minstrel: I think that Merry and Pippin could be considered minnies. They both preform a little in combat, but in the story they mostly move others through the words and personalities. They don't really sing THAT much, but I suppose a Minni could move and rally others through speeches as well as song. I also think Grima Wormgtounge would be a Minnie...and evil one no doubt...but thorugh his words and his evil "song" he almost overthrew the King of Rohan. His words clearly have great power. Galadriel also, with her words being able to shake men to their core, could be a Minnie.

    Guardian: Gimli is clearly a guardian. I think you could also make a case for Boromir being a guardian, since he used a sword and shield and was literaly a meat sheild to protect others (do his own demise). I also think that you could consider Sam a Guardian. He didn't have a shield, but his nature in the book and the way he acts, and his reasons for fighting when he does....it has Guardian written all over it. He is not flashy or particularly skilled, he is just really tough and has a lot of heart for that which he loves. Guardian in my book. I also think you might be able to call Eowyn a guardian or may a Warden

    Captian: I think that Theoden would be a Captian, Faramir definatly, and probably Return of the King Aragorn. These figuers lead and inspire men to great deeds.

    Champion: You could consider per-ROTK Aragorn a Champion probably. A whirlwind of front-line destruction at Helm's Deep. You might be able to consider Boromir and probably Eomer as Champions.

    Warden: The Rangers as a whole seem to be a mix-mash of hunters and Wardens, primarly Wardens though. I can't think of any main characters that would be Wardens, but the Dunedain definatly seem to be, and also Haldir of course. It is possible you could consider Glorfindel a Warden as well, or a champion, but he's not heavily armored.


    Thoughts?

  2. #2
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Burglar: Bilbo.

    Hunter: Legolas.

    Lore-master: Radagast/Gandalf.

    Rune-keeper: Galadriel.

    Minstrel: tough one, no clue really.

    Guardian: Éowyn, hands down. No one else even comes close.

    Captain: Boromir and Faramir.

    Champion: Gimli and Éomer. Both were extraordinarily aggressive in battle and bordered on the berserk on occasion.

    Warden: Haldir, the marchwarden who patrolled the borders of his land.

  3. #3
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    I think it is helpful to distinguish in this discussion attitude/demeanor from fighting style. For example, regarding the guardian class, Sam is very much a guardian in attitude, but not in fighting style. Whereas Boromir is very much in fighting style, not quite so much in attitude, which I would classify primarily as one of captain (with some champion and guardian thrown in). Eowyn is indeed a guardian in both style and attitude (though I'd argue she has a little bit of champion thrown in as well).

    Gimli and Eomer are champions all the way in attitude and style I think as well (I don't recall Eomer ever using a shield in the books, does he?) Legolas is a hunter pretty clearly. Gandalf in fighting style is very much a LM (light "armor", sword & staff) with a little bit of RK (damaging tactical attacks) thrown in.

    Pre-Minas Tirith Aragorn is hard to peg down; his fighting style is mostly champion, but attitude is a real interesting combination of champion, hunter (tracking), minstrel (healing), and warden (protecting the Shire) with maybe just a touch of captain thrown in. Whereas post-Minas Tirith, attitude shifts to being primarily captain with a healthy portion of minstrel (lots of healing/inspiring) and still a touch of champion.
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  4. #4
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by MithrilSoul View Post

    Pre-Minas Tirith Aragorn is hard to peg down; his fighting style is mostly champion, but attitude is a real interesting combination of champion, hunter (tracking), minstrel (healing), and warden (protecting the Shire) with maybe just a touch of captain thrown in.
    You can all some that up in one class: Ranger

    In all seriousness though, good post.

  5. #5
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by LoupGarou216 View Post
    You can all some that up in one class: Ranger

    In all seriousness though, good post.
    I agree on both points

    Also, IMO, Elrond is hands down a LM.
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  6. #6
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    The best Minstrel in all of Middle Earth would be Tom Bombadil.

  7. #7
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Obviously the Hunter is Bard the Bowman. He had a devastating crit on Heartseeker (pre-bk7) while in traited Burn Hot and Strength Stance with Reveal Weakness on Smaug resulting in a one shot.

    Legolas? Pfft...So he shot some orcs and got a lucky hit on a Fell-beast. But did he One-Shot a Dragon?
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  8. #8
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Always a very muddy and speculative issue but here's my take:
    Burglar:As stated already, Bilbo and Frodo (with maybe some Gollum on the side) composed the inspiration for this class.

    Champion: Gimli, Eomer, Aragorn, Eowyn and Halbarad? All have shown some champion like qualities in battle but, as always there is still too much overlap to peg them as a single class. I don't know about Glorfindel, I'll have to read up on him more.

    Captain:Faramir, Boromir, Aragorn, and Eomer. Boromir should be fairly obvious (see his campaigns for Gondor) as well as Aragorn. Faramir was the captain of his Rangers of Ithilien and I'm sure once or twice in the open field. I think of Eomer as a Captain in much the same way as Faramir: men of action, sparse on words. They sought to inspire by deeds rather than hefty speeches. Theoden showed very captain-ish qualities after Gandalf gave him the once over, especially before the battle of the Pelennor.

    Guardian:Boromir and, to an extent, Gimli, Sam, Glorfindel (protecting the hobbits from the Ringwraiths which I guess would include Aragorn as a Guard on the same merits) and the city guard whose name scapes me and whose son was befriended by Pippin.
    Hunter:Legolas, Aragorn, Faramir, Haldir, Halbarad and of course Bard + all the rangers.

    Lore-Master:Aragorn again (see knowledge and use of athelas), Elrond and the Istari.

    Minstrel:Tom Bombadil. It would be a large stretch indeed to include the hobbits as they didn't do a whole lot of singing in combat. I wouldn't include any of the Captains because they inspired with speeches and/or action. Song is the province of the Minstrel.

    Rune-keeper:This one picks very sparse elements from different places and really shouldn't be considered a class. Lots of Elves and dwarves used a combination of words and runes to create the effects they did (mostly spells of sealing) in which I don't recall a single example of what RKs do in game. That doesn't mean runes were never used to raise/lower the temperature, or to manipulate electricity, there just isn't substantial evidence of it unless we include the Istari. But even then they really didn't use runes that much. Just the G-man.

    Warden:Eomer, Aragorn, and pretty much all the rangers again.
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  9. #9

    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    I feel very strongly that Sam should be classified as a Minstrel and not a Guardian. Far and away his primary role in the stories was to bolster Frodo's morale and ease his dread of the Eye of Sauron. Sam only rarely found himself in a melee situation and, the Shelob thing aside, wasn't particularly adept at it. You can even say that he "feared off" that orc in the Tower of Cirith Ungol. I think that Turbine's classification of Sam as a Guardian was interesting but misguided in terms of actual function.

  10. #10
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by Vilnas View Post
    I feel very strongly that Sam should be classified as a Minstrel and not a Guardian. Far and away his primary role in the stories was to bolster Frodo's morale and ease his dread of the Eye of Sauron. Sam only rarely found himself in a melee situation and, the Shelob thing aside, wasn't particularly adept at it. You can even say that he "feared off" that orc in the Tower of Cirith Ungol. I think that Turbine's classification of Sam as a Guardian was interesting but misguided in terms of actual function.

    Well said, but Turbine's Sam/Guardian classification was actually a joke. You know that right?

    When the Guardian quest reaches Sam, he says he isn't a Gaurdian, but a Gardener and someone has obviously mixed things up! It's actually a pretty funny moment because the whole time I was like "### am I going to see Sam??!!!"

    Eowyn gets my vote for the ultimate Guardian-type character in the books.

  11. #11

    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by LoupGarou216 View Post
    Well said, but Turbine's Sam/Guardian classification was actually a joke. You know that right?

    When the Guardian quest reaches Sam, he says he isn't a Gaurdian, but a Gardener and someone has obviously mixed things up! It's actually a pretty funny moment because the whole time I was like "### am I going to see Sam??!!!"
    Nice! I didn't know that.

  12. #12
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Actually, I think Sam deserves the Guardian classification. Especially during the Cirith Ungol interlude there is a definite sense that Sam views his place in life as always standing at Frodo's side and if possible to shield him from any danger. Sam is Frodo's guardian specifically. It is his duty to care for and protect Frodo. Sam would willingly give his life to do so.
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  13. #13
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Champ = Gimli

    Guard = Sam

    Minnies= Merry and Pippin

    Burglar= Frodo

    Hunter = Legolas

    Captain = Boromir

    LM= Gandalf

    Aragorn = Champion

    That's how I see it at least.

  14. #14
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Aragorn-Champion, captain in RotK
    Gimli-Champion
    Legolas-Hunter
    Gandalf-Lore Master (Radagast is definetly a lore master, gandalf not so much, but they are both wizards and it's closest thing to him.)
    Boromir-Captain
    Faramir-Captain
    Eomer-Warden/Captain
    Eowyn-Guardian
    Theoden-Captain/warden
    Hama-Warden/Guardian
    Frodo-Burglar
    Sam-Guardian
    Merry-Guardian
    Pippin-Minstrel
    Saurumon-Lore Master
    Galadrial-Lore master, rune keeper maybe
    Elrond-Lore master, rune keeper maybe
    Throwing in some Children of Hurin peoples cuz they pwn LotR peoples
    Hurin-Captain
    Turin-Champion
    Beleg-Hunter
    Androg-Hunter
    Mim-Champion... minstrel maybe...
    Last edited by jakub909; Mar 31 2009 at 09:02 PM. Reason: Adding a few people

  15. #15
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Guardian = Glorfindel
    Champion = Rog
    Hunter = Beleg
    Loremaster = Elrond
    Warden = Haldir
    Runekeeper = Gandalf
    Burglar = Bilbo
    Captain = Faramir
    Minstrel = Pippin

    Best I could do without consulting my library.

  16. #16

    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Guardian: Sam and Eowyn without question, Thorin Oakenshield
    Champion: Gimli*, Eomer, Glorfindel, Elladon & Elrohir
    Captain: Boromir*, Faramir, Elrond*
    Hunter: Legolas, Bard
    Minstrel: Merry, Pippin, Bombadil
    Lore-Master: Gandalf, Radagast, Saruman, Denethor, Celeborn
    Rune-Keeper: Galadriel
    Warden: Dunedain, Haldir (but bow instead of javelin)
    Burglar: Bilbo


    Gimli may be heavily armoured, but he does not have a defensive approach to fighting, he charges into the fray and destroys everything he sees.

    Eomer was a captain in position, but his fighting style was not like one at all. He was a very brutal fighter and so I believe he rose to be such a good captain because he inspired men through his skill as a champion, not his words.

    Glorfindel, Elladon And Elrohir I would all classify as champions. They were master armsman, considered some of the greatest that ever lived.

    Boromir is a captain. He may fight with a shield but captains can also do that. But he also inspired the fellowship at times and lead them to greater feats of glory. His horn not only called for aid, but it also inspired him, merry, and pippen to fight harder.

    Elrond I argue is a captain. He was Gil-Galad's herald, but also lead battles on his own, standing on the front lines dishing out damage.

    *Note, I put Galadriel as Rune-keeper, but I am one of those individuals who believe runekeepers should not be a playable class, not to say they didn't exist, but only the MOST powerful of individuals could harness that power, and that is why I slotted Galadriel into that class.
    I believe the rest is self-explanatory.

  17. #17
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Did any tolkien lore mentioned the class "champion"? i know captain class have, warden, but champion?

    anyone can quote that statement?

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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by yongi View Post
    Did any tolkien lore mentioned the class "champion"? i know captain class have, warden, but champion?

    anyone can quote that statement?
    I haven't actually looked this up in the books recently, but I seem to remember the title of champion being mentioned; specifically regarding Boromir, whom I believe was attributed as being a captain and a champion.

    I looked up lotr wiki, and it names one of the Valar as a champion: Tulkas Astaldo, Champion of Valinor

    I agree with a lot of the posts in this thread, however I do question a couple. Why is Frodo considered a burglar by many? I don't really see him falling into any specific class. Also, I see Eowyn as much more of a champion than a guardian because she wanted to fight like the men and knew how to use a blade. I know she was said to have protected Merry, but I believe she would have snuck out to fight whether he was there or not.
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  19. #19
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by Frieja View Post
    I agree with a lot of the posts in this thread, however I do question a couple. Why is Frodo considered a burglar by many? I don't really see him falling into any specific class. Also, I see Eowyn as much more of a champion than a guardian because she wanted to fight like the men and knew how to use a blade. I know she was said to have protected Merry, but I believe she would have snuck out to fight whether he was there or not.
    Frodo is just an NPC. He's always getting into trouble, he's worthless in a fight, but if the fellowship members had let him die it would have been an instant fail.

  20. #20
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    Re: Game vs Lore: Classes of Middle-Earth

    Quote Originally Posted by sloth72khs View Post
    Frodo is just an NPC. He's always getting into trouble, he's worthless in a fight, but if the fellowship members had let him die it would have been an instant fail.
    ROFL!!! It's just one big escort quest Priceless post!
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