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  1. #26
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    Jun 2007
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Thanks for the update guys

    Look forward to hearing more about it whenever you get a chance!
    Eats, the Ginger Warg.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/0920d0100000b7cdc/signature.png]Eatscarebears[/charsig]

  2. #27
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    This is great news! I think the new pots for fear, wounds, etc will be extremely useful.

    Now I gotta go farm even MORE to pay for all this....

    Keep it up, even the little snippets of upcoming updates give all of us hope, and helps slowly extinguish the fuel for the screams of balance between freeps and creeps.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jalessa View Post
    To reiterate, this is not the full list of stuff! This is just a bit of it
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  3. #28

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Definately some good steps in the right direction here. Other people have probably already mentioned what else I'd like to see but here it is:
    - Base morale increased by about 10%
    - Extra corruption slots - at least 2 more but preferably 3 or 4
    - 8 second stun/daze immunity when recovering from a stun/daze, just like the freeps have.
    - Increase in DPS for all classes to bring us closer to freep dps, probably also around 10%. (Blackarrows and weavers 20%)

    Give us that and we should have something close to balance.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/042080100000cdc34/signature.png]Caldreth[/charsig]

  4. #29
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    Jun 2007
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    252

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jman33 View Post
    Definately some good steps in the right direction here. Other people have probably already mentioned what else I'd like to see but here it is:
    - Base morale increased by about 10%
    - Extra corruption slots - at least 2 more but preferably 3 or 4
    - 8 second stun/daze immunity when recovering from a stun/daze, just like the freeps have.
    - Increase in DPS for all classes to bring us closer to freep dps, probably also around 10%. (Blackarrows and weavers 20%)

    Give us that and we should have something close to balance.
    i second that.

  5. #30
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jman33 View Post
    Definately some good steps in the right direction here. Other people have probably already mentioned what else I'd like to see but here it is:
    - Base morale increased by about 10%
    - Extra corruption slots - at least 2 more but preferably 3 or 4
    - 8 second stun/daze immunity when recovering from a stun/daze, just like the freeps have.
    - Increase in DPS for all classes to bring us closer to freep dps, probably also around 10%. (Blackarrows and weavers 20%)

    Give us that and we should have something close to balance.
    You'd have to buff morale and dps a lot more then that to be on par with freeps.(just saying)
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/02204010000116ae0/signature.png]Lugulnakh[/charsig]

  6. #31
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    Apr 2007
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    657

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jman33 View Post
    Definately some good steps in the right direction here. Other people have probably already mentioned what else I'd like to see but here it is:
    - Base morale increased by about 10%
    - Extra corruption slots - at least 2 more but preferably 3 or 4
    - 8 second stun/daze immunity when recovering from a stun/daze, just like the freeps have.
    - Increase in DPS for all classes to bring us closer to freep dps, probably also around 10%. (Blackarrows and weavers 20%)

    Give us that and we should have something close to balance.
    ROFL, looks like freeps are gonna get nerfed once again!
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/08207000000027b9f/signature.png]Thorken[/charsig]
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  7. #32
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    Mar 2007
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    512

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jman33 View Post
    Definately some good steps in the right direction here. Other people have probably already mentioned what else I'd like to see but here it is:
    - Base morale increased by about 10%
    - Extra corruption slots - at least 2 more but preferably 3 or 4
    - 8 second stun/daze immunity when recovering from a stun/daze, just like the freeps have.
    - Increase in DPS for all classes to bring us closer to freep dps, probably also around 10%. (Blackarrows and weavers 20%)

    Give us that and we should have something close to balance.
    I say boost weaver dps to 170% of what it currently is.
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  8. #33
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrwoo View Post
    ROFL, looks like freeps are gonna get nerfed once again!
    where is the freep nerf? im missing it...

  9. #34

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrwoo View Post
    ROFL, looks like freeps are gonna get nerfed once again!
    Freeps need to be nerfed. What Turbine did to creeps in MOM was to offer them to freeps on a silver platter lined with CC and DPS. They have been boosted to the level of godlike beings. I am sure those that died defending Helms Deep and Gondor would have loved to have been as all powerful as the Freeps in the moors.
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  10. #35
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    Apr 2007
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    657

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Aedon View Post
    Freeps need to be nerfed. What Turbine did to creeps in MOM was to offer them to freeps on a silver platter lined with CC and DPS. They have been boosted to the level of godlike beings. I am sure those that died defending Helms Deep and Gondor would have loved to have been as all powerful as the Freeps in the moors.
    You should be that weak, the strength of the enemy is in numbers. not small groups. I dont care what any of you think. If the freeps get nerfed people will leave. We dont want our PvE experiance ruined.
    [charsig=http://lotrosigs.level3.turbine.com/08207000000027b9f/signature.png]Thorken[/charsig]
    [FONT=Fixedsys][COLOR=#00ffff][FONT=Comic Sans MS][FONT=Fixedsys]ramsters- king of all minstrels, LOL I would pwn this guy!!![/FONT][/FONT][/COLOR][/FONT]

  11. #36
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    2,660

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by hotinaz View Post
    These will just make us more cookie cutter

    Oh, come on. At least try to be helpful/supportive...

    Thanks for the info Frelorn and Jalessa, while it's not perfect as mentioned before, it's definitely a big step in the right direction

    Sprint turning off auto-attack: I don't understand this change at all. Have there been complaints about this? Sprint is used as much to catch a fleeing freep as to escape. Having it turn off attack would be a minor annoyance, but an annoyance all the same. I hope you'll reconsider this one.
    I actually like this, if you haven't played a warg a lot you wouldn't have noticed.

    Sprint and Disappear often take 1-3 seconds to fire off, resulting in swift and imminent death. The reason is that your autoattacks have to hit first then it takes another 1 second pause before they actually activate.

  12. #37
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    Nov 2007
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    1,413

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jalessa View Post
    To reiterate, this is not the full list of stuff! This is just a bit of it
    Phew, that's good to hear, because while there are some good changes on that list...there is also a lot of very minor changes...
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  13. #38
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jman33 View Post
    Base morale AND POWER increased by AT LEAST 10%
    fixed that for you. our health right now is a joke with many creeps reporting that thier health is lower now than it was pre-mom while freeps have at least an extra 1500 health at lvl 60 than what they had at lvl 50.

    as for power, playing my ba feels like playing a bk10 hunter all over again, before people were able to re-spec properly to eliminate thier power issues except that i cant do that without gimping my health and damage output to a lvl where i might as well just chug a pot every 2 minutes. and im pretty sure that i have the same amount of power before mom came out as i have now while my skills seem to use more power than before.

    basically, i get the impression that all you did was give us another 10 levels but didnt give us any of the increases that should have come with being 10 levels higher. morale, power, damage, icpr, icmr, resistances and mitigations all need to be raised to level approprate values


    also, tone done the stuns/disarms on freep npcs, its almost impossible to fight the hobbits in hh without being stunned and disarmed during the fight, and it happens almost every fight. its annoying enough to be getting gray-bared by freeps without having to put up with it when fighting npcs and just makes farming cash for pots even harder.

    other than that, im pretty happy with the upcoming changes
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  14. #39
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    Feb 2007
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Frelorn View Post
    • Creep vendor and barter foods have been scrubbed. There will no longer be any issues where barter food is less desirable than vendor food or where higher ranked vendor/barter food is less desirable than lower ranked vendor/barter food.

    By scrubbed, do you mean you have taken out food entirely?


    Quote Originally Posted by Frelorn View Post


    1. Bottled Uruk Effluvium: removes one physical and one wound effect
    2. Bottled Orc Scream: removes one song and one disease effect
    3. Bottled Spider Chitter: removes one cry and one poison effect
    4. Bottled Warg Breath: removes one tactical and one fear effect
    I hope all these new potions will have separate cooldown timers.


    This is a nice start. I hope there's a lot more changes coming for this book.
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  15. #40

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrwoo View Post
    You should be that weak, the strength of the enemy is in numbers. not small groups. I dont care what any of you think. If the freeps get nerfed people will leave. We dont want our PvE experiance ruined.
    this isnt a nerf to Freeps. THey retain their skills and powers, the creeps just gain some protection against it.

    If you dont believe me, roll up a new warg, run out there in the moors and see for yourself

    Pounce a loremaster then try and get away :P

    Use your smelling salts, try and run, because now you have a second root/mezz/stun from someone else on you.
    See a hunters cross hairs on you, you may as well curl up in a ball and wait for death, its a 1 or 2 shot from it

    Propsed changes here are to the Creeps, giving them protections, not to your pve monsters.
    An effective change to the creeps in the Ettenmoors has nothing to do with your PVE experience.
    Ettemoors has no connection with the outside world.
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  16. #41

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by skorpion352 View Post
    fixed that for you. our health right now is a joke with many creeps reporting that thier health is lower now than it was pre-mom while freeps have at least an extra 1500 health at lvl 60 than what they had at lvl 50.

    as for power, playing my ba feels like playing a bk10 hunter all over again, before people were able to re-spec properly to eliminate thier power issues except that i cant do that without gimping my health and damage output to a lvl where i might as well just chug a pot every 2 minutes. and im pretty sure that i have the same amount of power before mom came out as i have now while my skills seem to use more power than before.

    basically, i get the impression that all you did was give us another 10 levels but didnt give us any of the increases that should have come with being 10 levels higher. morale, power, damage, icpr, icmr, resistances and mitigations all need to be raised to level approprate values


    also, tone done the stuns/disarms on freep npcs, its almost impossible to fight the hobbits in hh without being stunned and disarmed during the fight, and it happens almost every fight. its annoying enough to be getting gray-bared by freeps without having to put up with it when fighting npcs and just makes farming cash for pots even harder.

    other than that, im pretty happy with the upcoming changes
    I agree and will add these to my list:
    - 10% increase in power
    - 15-20% increase in ICMR and ICPR
    - Stop the hobbit farmers and gardeners disarming every fight, sometimes even twice in 1 fight. Weird that the hobbit hunters don't disarm.
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  17. #42
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    Nov 2007
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    2,112

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Frelorn View Post

    The Quartermaster NPC will now offer Monster Players several new potions.

    1. Bottled Uruk Effluvium: removes one physical and one wound effect
    2. Bottled Orc Scream: removes one song and one disease effect
    3. Bottled Spider Chitter: removes one cry and one poison effect
    4. Bottled Warg Breath: removes one tactical and one fear effect
    My personal favourite out of the list up there

    If I were to suggest one thing aside from the glaring issue of creep/freep balance, it would be to change how one can gain access to the delving. Maybe an alternate method of entry? The real problem is, I can never get in there(and thus haven't been able to get any fear pots on my creeps). Although the outpost idea was good, freeps just don't seem to stray from EC/STAB and thus the larger groups really never tend to get there.

    I've tried taking these in my groups of 3-4, but I must be missing something because wood trolls have a tendency to heal themselves for a large portion of morale, with apparently no cast timer(or maybe his orange circle is stuck in the ground or something or I'm being super slow w/ gut punch) which unfortunately, leaves my reaver with no power(IE no dps for the group). It must be something I'm doing wrong

  18. #43
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    Jun 2007
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    252

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    I love how Freeps can complain about the THOUGHT or MENTION of getting nerfed when us creeps have to deal with the fact that we DID IN FACT GET NERFED... Gimme a break.

    Besides, no one even said anything about nerfing freeps for pete's sake! I think paranoia is setting in...

  19. #44
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    Apr 2007
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    2,480

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Showtime87 View Post
    If you want to address balance through corruptions, you need to give creeps quite a few more corruption slots, so that we can actually use the traits that would bring us into a state of balance. Also, and perhaps most importantly, the base health of all creep classes needs a boost.
    Quoted for truth. It doesn't matter how many new corruptions get trundled out if the only sane Creep strategy at present is to use all your slots to increase morale back to about 80 percent of what it was pre-MOM. This is the only sane strategy because Freep DPS has been wildly boosted.
    Last edited by Cembrye; Jan 14 2009 at 05:37 PM.
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  20. #45

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrwoo View Post
    You should be that weak, the strength of the enemy is in numbers. not small groups. I dont care what any of you think. If the freeps get nerfed people will leave. We dont want our PvE experiance ruined.
    If the strength of the enemy is in numbers, then when I log in a Blackarrow, I should be controlling 3 Blackarrows. Yup, looking like someone 3-boxing, all firing the same skills in-sync.

    Maybe you're right. That might do nicely =)

  21. #46

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrwoo View Post
    You should be that weak, the strength of the enemy is in numbers. not small groups. I dont care what any of you think. If the freeps get nerfed people will leave. We dont want our PvE experiance ruined.
    Well, finally in MoM you do have the situation where the strength of creeps is in numbers, and are otherwise unable to really take out freeps without severe casualties if they are equally matched. But there's a few problems we are experiencing whenever creeps outnumber the freeps:


    1. When the creeps kill a few freeps using their superior numbers, the freeps log or cower in GV, even though they usually end up killing more creeps than they took casualties. Clearly, freeps don't want 5 to 1 fights even if they are more balanced to where both sides finally get kills. It's suddenly unfair. "Oh no! The creeps killed one of us! We aren't supposed to die!" It seems to me freeps can't decide what they want. Actually, they can. They want an easy button.
    2. The freeps get a big buff whenever the population is in the creeps' favor, even if many of the creeps logged in happen to be greenies farming slugs and not actually fighting. So that doesn't really make any sense if balance is to be achieved by creeps outnumbering freeps.
    3. Because freeps end up killing more creeps than they take casualties, creeps end up with less infamy than the freeps get renown. That is not fair. Under such a system, creeps should get a boost in infamy per kill so that it all balances out.
    4. Freeps don't want to die period. They just want creeps to hold still like good lil' NPCs and die. I swear, they treat us like NPCs, not people. So no matter what your lore point of view is, freeps are still stuck in PvE mode and expect everything to be scripted and handed to them. They need to snap out of it, use their wits, and fight.So even if you buy into that particular lore point of view, it's still not going to work in reality until freeps actually snap out of their PvE mentality.
    5. The idea that creeps are fodder (according to this lore point of view) once again treats them like they're unfeeling NPCs, not like they are human beings. Yes, freeps, we really are human beings on the other end. We don't want to be treated like fodder. It's not fun for us. Nor would it be fun for you. You can treat PvE NPCs like they're fodder all you want. No problem. But real people who want to have fun? Sorry, it doesn't work that way. What you'll end up with is no PvP at all because creeps won't sit down and take it. As it is, you already have green dots as fodder right from the get go. No need to make all of us fodder.


    Now on a personal note, I don't buy the creeps as fodder lore point of view 100%. Here's why: A here is a hero because he overcomes insurmountable odds, not because he's so uber to begin with.

    Also, like another individual mentioned earlier, Helm's Deep took many lives. Not every freep can be Aragorn or Legolas and wipe out 5 creeps with one swoop. I like to think that ideally PvP ranks should indicate that you start out as a simple foot soldier and work your way up as a leader and hero of your respective side. Granted, Turbine would never dream of nerfing freeps to make this the case, but it used to be the case for creeps. Not anymore, but hopefully we'll see those days again where rank means something in improving your character.

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  22. #47
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jman33 View Post
    I agree and will add these to my list:
    - 10% increase in power
    - 15-20% increase in ICMR and ICPR
    - Stop the hobbit farmers and gardeners disarming every fight, sometimes even twice in 1 fight. Weird that the hobbit hunters don't disarm.
    not to mention thier stun - disarm - disarm - disarm - stun - stun routine they get going, i have ot run from a single hobbit npc bceause i was grey-bared and unable to kill them after having already used my evade buff already.

    which reminds me: FIX MOVING TAREGT. it is currently a joke and usually still gets me killed 5-10 seconds after i have activated it without the freeps hitting me with a hs, i have seen all 3 improved swiftbow shots, merc shot, pen shot and the autoattacks that come with them still hit me from a single hunter who was in strenght stance, if they were in precision stance, then this would be a tad more believeable, but they were in freaking strenght stance and still managed to land 7 hits on me after i activated moving target when pre-mom, maybe one of those hits would have hit me
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  23. #48

    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Thank you Frelorn and Jalessa for giving us the inside scoop. We look forward to more of your inside scoops in the coming weeks.



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  24. #49
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    a good start...I guess.


    *sigh* was hoping beyond hope for a big fix but I can only pray that thats your ace in the hole for release notes.

    Pretty excited wound/posion/fear/disease pots though.

    Thanks for releasing what you could, it does indeed give a glimmer of hope. Can't wait to see the full list.

    One thing...I'm confused about the food? There was debate over waht was best so you got rid of it all? I must be reading that incorrectly...someone with better reading comprehesion want to fill me in?

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  25. #50
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    Re: Upcoming Changes to PvMP!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrwoo View Post
    You should be that weak, the strength of the enemy is in numbers. not small groups. I dont care what any of you think. If the freeps get nerfed people will leave. We dont want our PvE experiance ruined.
    If you don't care what anyone else thinks... why are you posting?

    Sorry, you can't ask your PvMP foes to be be as easy to defeat as mindless npc mobs...
    Ryzom, Captain 46! (Fear Me!)
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