Council visiting Turbine

[Yicky]

Well, I am on my way home from a very VERY long day yesterday that went from about 8am to 1:30am with Turbine. Met some awesome people. and yes, got to spend a lot of time in the pit. I am suprisingly pleased regarding the discussions I had and it has given me a lot of hope for the future of PVP. I think you guys being hopeful as well would be just.

I have not had my post discussion yet so I am not sure what can and cannot be revealed as of yet. So I will go over some posts, but I think you guys will be pleased.

How about missing any old tribe..........stranger?

Miss you guys too.

I am not aiming this post at you, it just starts with addressing your post.

The issue with Audacity armour is not set bonuses. It is that you take 30% less damage and are CC'd for 50% less time. That is an absurd advantage that any established player has over a new player or new alt. Like Sazh said it makes new characters total fodder until you suffer through your collection of commendations and become mildly competitive. A 13 audacity r0 is still fodder. It is a ridiculous system that has no place in a pvp zone and other contemporary mmo's have had the same issues with it (SWTOR for a recent example with expertise).

I know it was an attempt to create a "season" type of pvp environment but if the season lasts until the next level increase then that concept doesn't hold. Effectively anyone who attempts to pvp with a new character after the first month of an expansion (being very generous) is entirely uncompetitive. Yes you can win fights without audacity. Not without being a more skilled player than your opponent, which isnt likely to be the case for a new player.

The costs for the first 7 ranks of audacity currently are the maximum I think is reasonable all the way to 13 for both creeps and freeps. Costing nothing would be the preferable option but like I said in my other post, baby steps. I would be totally fine with audacity armour not being available outside the ettenmoors as well.

I agree that audacity in it's current form needs tweaking. It started off as a way to take fights from being swayed within the first 30 seconds. However, it is now at the point where it is not really doing what it should be, in my opinion, and needs to be re-worked a bit.

@Yicky, interesting enough, ill participate in giving feedback, although atm its pointless. However, if you believe its not pointless, then take this point up with them.


Ah yes, Audacity. Ive got some thoughts and ideas I know will work for the good of Pvmp, but firstly, how on earth do I get Turbine to listen - and I have no idea what they're planning, which means its highly unlikely they'll throw out there current plans for Pvmp in favor of what im about to write.

*Pvmp currency in commendations is great and shouldnt changed, because it causes a grind within the moors for the moors: which means more game time.

*But Audacity should be removed on the obvious grounds that its unfair and a slap in the face for pve raiders.

*Simply make more ways to spend commendations...anything, anything at all. Make a Champion weapon look like a shovel and people will buy it, anything and everything stupid for lols and people will grind 7k comms for it.

*More options: make at least 6 different set bonuses for each class that dont make characters overpowered, but provide different options. More options = happier players.
*examples not perfectly balanced, but they're basic ideas*
Example: Hunters strength of earth channel skill adds 5% mitigation per tick for 20% total for 10 seconds. Considering how fragile it's to get off (still 1 hit interrupt?) its not going to be overpowered, but it can be useful in different situations.
Example2: LMs Inner flame gives +40% run speed(which simply negates BA hinder making the freep run normal). This is only useful if traited, easily interrupted and has 20m range. +40% can be very useful is used correctly in dire situations.
Example3: LMs Burning embers has a chance to hit aoe targets if they're on Tar, but LMs fire-lore and wind-lore cannot be used.

Players with pve gear usually do more dps, but giving pvp players more options to try different ideas and tempt them into grinding comms is the key. Good example is Rainithri-1 who currently uses pve gear for max dps. The goal is to tempt him into using different gear for different options so he spends more time actually having fun testing different styles instead of 2 options.

As for creeps its different, but the fact is im not the only person who loves killing shiny freeps with there silly new toys.

After the initial outcry, the whole hatred for commendations has kind of subsided. I'm suprised that you say commendations are good the way they are. Most people do not like the cap behind them or the limitatons that they have for purchasing items. I think the system as room to grow and be evolved. But that may be another discussion

I don't know if audacity should be removed...I do think it at least needs to be rebuilt. I will say I am on the fence on whether or not it should or should not remain in the game. I've thought about both. So I do see what you are saying from that side.

More things to spend commendations on...YES. Most defanetly. With that, I think the cap should be changed. And depending on what people want to be able to buy. Maps, skins, jewelry, consumables. Suggestions would be great

6 armor sets!?!? Good gracious man!! I personally am not a set bonus person. Mostly because they are one sided and the pvp set bonuses can completely negate the most basic of creep abilities. I would wait to check out the new class overhauls before bringing out what set bonuses should be. There is no idea on what kind of true balance will come with the new changes to freeps and the creep for Helms Deep.

I would much rather see a system where you would acquire skills (similar to the daoc realm ranks) rather than armor and buffs. Yes those skills could be used outside of pvmp or pvp but they wouldn't be complete deal breakers if not present (like the lack of audacity often is). I brought a champ to moors with no audacity and she was fodder for a few weeks. Same happened when I poked my nose out after RoR. If that SoS bonus wasn't on the moors armor I'd probably be using hybolt or something else, but as you pointed out none of that is effective enough to compete in the Ettenmoors now.

I always thought the aud armor was just to try and give (or force) the freeps something to acquire. Didn't care for the early moors sets at all, preferred the rift or moria gear. Aside from LI's, offhand weapons, or some rings there isn't any real reward for going to the moors aside from the armor...but I would much rather come out with a nice weapon than armor that wouldn't be useful elsewhere.

Aud armor was meant to lengthen fights based on less damage coming in and calming CC down. However that isn't really working out too much right now. So it is something that I think needs to be looked at and re-worked.

this, this, and more this. I bought skins for my warg and reaver I never intend to use, simply to get rid of the overcap notification as I think its lags me a bit more than normal.

Creepside: introduce the equivalent of trail food, for +morale or +plus damage (very small numbers here, the freep equivalents are only good for 1-2%).
more good skins. Make the buffs expire on death and this will be a true comms sink.
MAPS for comms. Grinding out map deeds is PvE, and a requisite to being fully effective in a PvP zone, on a PvP specific character. This doesn't add up, just let the maps be bartered for by those people who have been there, done that so they don't have to farm their 1 billionth sapling for grimwood.

Freepside: possibilities are endless, but pretty much anything related to LIs, scrolls of empowerment, delving, relics, damage type titles, jewelry options, actual cloak options, food, dyes, etc.

I can see maps for comms. I cant stand the map grind as it takes weeks due to cooldowns. Alternative is the store or sigils. Or maybe allow it to be an account wide unlock upon completion the first time. So for example, you get your poor maps on your warleader, then get on your defiler and you can purchase the maps for comms. Would that be something people might like?

I like the ideas regarding more spending for freeps. LI damage types, etc. I would like to see some nice cloaks come in. (similar to PVE raid cloaks) PVE only players dont understand what it takes to get geared up and ranked in the moors and it is just as time consuming(if not more) as a raid. SO why not have stats on jewelry or cloaks that is equivilant or close to raid gear?

I'm very disappointed with the lack of emphasis that has been given us, but never NEVER under appreciate the bird...... Someday it might finally fight back. I don't know if the things Yicky has done will make a huge difference. I do believe he will always give it an extreme effort. These devs obviously have limited time. If they want to work on PvMP that probably limits their time even more. They probably don't have time to wade through all the trash I post. I think having someone who is obviously heavily invested in PvMP like Yicky talking to people who can actually make changes _has_ to have some positive effect. I haven't given up on them injecting new life into the Moors just yet, (although I imagine right now is probably chaos incarnate for them so I'm not expecting to see anything right off).

Thank you. Support is greatly apperciated. I think after this visit, people will be pleased. I wish more than anything that I could just blurt out everything that happened. But once I know what can or cannot be said, you will know.

I will say you hit the nail on the head regarding time and resources. I do not think you should give up just yet. (this is not a Turbine pitch trust me). After yesterday, I think people will be happy.

this is about the only meaningful constructive input I care to waste my time on, other than banal rhetoric that reflects on the game itself as a whole. I don't have the desire I once had to tell you how to fix a broken system, just to point out and emphasize that it is indeed broken.

Well knowing how to fix a broken system is a challenge in itself. An even bigger challenge is to find the time and resources to do it. I will say...it is a known issue

Hopefully the end of this thread finds you somewhat more hopeful everyone. However feel free to smack me around some more

Forgive the spelling mistakes. I am beyond exhausted.

--Yicks

[lionoil]

6 armor sets!?!? Good gracious man!! I personally am not a set bonus person. Mostly because they are one sided and the pvp set bonuses can completely negate the most basic of creep abilities.

The main goal is to provide more options to both freeps and creeps. Lotro pvmp has endless possibilities, and providing players with options is just one area. For example, LMs in Pvmp have one trait line thats far more effective then other options, and one pvmp armor set bonus option as well. You wouldn't actually think LMs had 3 trait lines and 3 armor sets because they're so out of balance, which is the other half of my point. Options that dont overpower one player over others but simply provide another area to customize yourself ie: pros with cons.

[searingskitso]

thanks so much for your hard work yickster. im very glad we still have you on this server. and cheers for talking to us about how turbine works. i hope they get the moors popping a


last thing, im wondering if they ever thought about having a valve'esq map editor. im sure this will be more trouble than its worth but... this would be a good way to take the leg work out of the map creating process.

[RGilthanas]

I think we need to even out a lot of things for both sides.

- March/mounts - disable BOTH or enable BOTH, not one or the other when entering keeps.

- Improve on the buff system, maybe consolidate each buff into ONE buff, kinda like a stacking buff (Tier I, Tier II, etc depending on the # of OPs/Keeps) to help reduce lag

- Give all creeps full access to all skills since freeps can come out fully geared and "skilled-up".

- Give a GOOD reason for high ranks to keep playing - better rewards. Something simple that makes a higher ranked freep/creep harder to kill than a lower ranked one. Don't give more dps, just more survivability and please make this a Passive. I don't want items like brands since they never work as intended.

I will keep adding to this, thank you Yicky! You're my boy blue!

[BLOODWILLFLOW]

Yicky if the current state of PvMP is how you represent the community of PVP players then you sir should be removed the from the Council


Staggering that this current mess in Ettenmoors made it out of beta....Unbelievable

Perhaps we need someone on the Council who isn't 100% biased to Creepside

[J2theMul]

Lol its not yickys fault. Everything in the moors was done before he even got on the council. The council anyways is just a pr move fluff thiers no real power or anything. Its 5 years to late to make a difference now 90% of vets left for gw2 and newer games. So I wouldnt put to much faith in the fluff council . Yicky is not to blame but least hes willing to try to talk to def people lol.

[KristTsirk]

Where's the pictures?