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  1. #1
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    OSX 10.9 Mavericks

    On yesterdays' Keynote, Apple announced the next version of their OS.

    Does someone of our fellow Mac players have a dev account and can test the compatibility of LOTRO? I know, that 10.9 is still in Beta, but it would be a nice and relieving test, since i don't expect any information at all from the Turbine guys on this matter.

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by padraxus View Post
    On yesterdays' Keynote, Apple announced the next version of their OS.

    Does someone of our fellow Mac players have a dev account and can test the compatibility of LOTRO? I know, that 10.9 is still in Beta, but it would be a nice and relieving test, since i don't expect any information at all from the Turbine guys on this matter.
    I can't tell you, and I'd have to shoot you if I did

    Compatibility testing is going to be primarily an issue with Awesomium.

    Awesomium is an "open source" piece of code based on Google's Chromium.
    It handles ALL of the dialogs between player and ... NPC/Vault/Store/etc. i.e. all pop-ups.

    The Mac Client is still using version Awesomium 1.6, which is known to have memory leak problems.
    Awesomium 1.7 was released in March of 2013.

    If, and not until, Turbine integrates 1.7 into both the Mac and PC Clients, will the memory leak problems be addressed... and no one knows if that will stop them or not.

    BTW, The most recent update -- 10.8.4 works with no problems. --- or rather, I should say, no NEW problems. (All the old ones are still there.)
    Last edited by Valamar; Jun 11 2013 at 11:16 AM. Reason: oops
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

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    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
    Valanne: Beorning - Level 80

  3. #3
    Just to temper any potential unrealistic expectations, the compressed memory feature won't help LotRO stop crashing, unfortunately. It only compresses the memory images of inactive apps, as an alternative to paging them out. This makes more physical memory available to the system as a whole, but that can't help an app that has exhausted its address space.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Valamar View Post
    Awesomium is an "open source" piece of code based on Google's Chromium.
    It handles ALL of the dialogs between player and ... NPC/Vault/Store/etc. i.e. all pop-ups.
    Emphasis added by me.

    Why do you keep saying this? Blue names have said on many occasions Awesomium is used by in-game browser elements (i.e Store, Help, Lorebook, etc.). I haven't seen anything that would indicate it is being used by anything else.

    When Turbine switched from Mozilla to Awesomium in the Bullroarer client, I did a lot of testing, including using a debugger. I found no evidence at all that would have lead me to believe Awesomium was used by anything other than in-game browser elements.

    Do you have evidence to the contrary? If not, please discontinue spreading misinformation.
    Last edited by Psarra; Jun 11 2013 at 01:16 PM.
    [B]Camden • Bancroft • Kimball • Melinnas • Psarra • Prentice • Lirendil[/B]

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psarra View Post
    Why do you keep saying this? Blue names have said on many occasions Awesomium is used by in-game browser elements (i.e Store, Help, Lorebook, etc.). I haven't seen anything that would indicate it is being used by anything else.

    When Turbine switched from Mozilla to Awesomium in the Bullroarer client, I did a lot of testing, including using a debugger. I found no evidence at all that would have lead me to believe Awesomium was used by anything other than in-game browser elements.
    The only reference I have found to Awesomium by a blue name was by Sapience May 04 2012:
    Re: Awesomium
    From time to time, as we work on updating portions of the game, we put pieces in place ahead of their actual implementation. For example, the UI changes in advance of the additional bag. Aeseomium is one of those things.

    It's not in the patch notes because, aside from the .dlls mentioned, it's not in the game. Once it's finalized and available for use, it will be in the appropriate Update's patch notes.
    And, contrary to that statement, no mention of Awesomium has ever appeared in any of the patch notes from 6.0 (March 2012) forward.

    From everything I can find, it went live with Update 8 Riders of Rohan in October 2012.
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

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  6. #6
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    My understanding is that Awesomium is used to display ALL dialog boxes.

    90% of those dialog boxes are completely external references -- typically to content.turbine.com

    Things such as individual Item Tooltips are NOT in the Game client dat files. They are retrieved in real-time from the main LOTRO database structure.

    I have not been able to get any blue-name to comment on the Awesomium issue, nor have I seen any. I presume they consider it a "trade secret" and therefore something they cannot/willnot talk about.
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

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    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
    Valanne: Beorning - Level 80

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Valamar View Post
    The only reference I have found to Awesomium by a blue name was by Sapience May 04 2012.
    Here are a few that still exist. The rest were in the RoR beta forum and are no longer accessible. xRaina posted there on a few occasions as to the purpose of Awesomium.

    Here are a number of references that ARE still available, including the one you referenced by Sapience:

    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?390837-The-Bug-Reporting-Tool-and-You&p=6499979#post6499979
    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?457664-Awesomium&p=6151652#post615165 2
    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?509314-New-Bug-Reporting-System-OMG&p=6759896#post6759896
    http://forums.lotro.com/showthread.php?511403-The-Updated-Bug-Reporting-Tool&p=6811150#post6811150

    Quote Originally Posted by Valamar View Post
    And, contrary to that statement, no mention of Awesomium has ever appeared in any of the patch notes from 6.0 (March 2012) forward.

    From everything I can find, it went live with Update 8 Riders of Rohan in October 2012.
    I don't disagree with you there.

    Quote Originally Posted by Valamar View Post
    My understanding is that Awesomium is used to display ALL dialog boxes.

    90% of those dialog boxes are completely external references -- typically to content.turbine.com

    Things such as individual Item Tooltips are NOT in the Game client dat files. They are retrieved in real-time from the main LOTRO database structure.

    I have not been able to get any blue-name to comment on the Awesomium issue, nor have I seen any. I presume they consider it a "trade secret" and therefore something they cannot/willnot talk about.
    Again, do you have any evidence that this is the case? Have you done any testing to confirm your suspicions? If you have, please share. I would be very interested in seeing the data you collected.

    I have completed testing to confirm my suspicions, and I therefore disagree with your conclusions. When RoR was in beta, I used various debugging tools to watch when the awesomium DLLs were and were not referenced. I also used various networking tools to watch when and where the client was making tcp connections with particular interest in http and https traffic.

    My findings indicated that Awesomium was only used for in-game browser elements such as the store, lorebook, help, /bug, etc.

    All of the art assets used for interface elements are stored in the dat files in TGA format. You can use Nova Extractor to view the contents of these files if you wish, or you can head over to LoTROInterface and download the art assets directly: http://www.lotrointerface.com/downloads/info834-Update11SkinningPack.html

    Having those assets bundled in the dat files and then also downloaded using Awesomium every time they are needed makes little sense. Further, those assets do not seem to be cached anywhere on my system, providing further evidence that Awesomium has nothing to do with NPC dialog generation.

    Finally, packet captures created during LOTRO game play show no evidence Awesomium is downloading any interface elements to build NPC dialogs. The only traffic that shows up in these packet captures is generated through the store, lorebook, help, and /bug windows.

    I would encourage you to use a packet capture tool such as Wireshark or simply use tcpdump in Terminal (http://support.apple.com/kb/ht3994) to see for yourself the traffic going into and out of your computer when you're playing LOTRO. You'll find that art assets are not being retrieved in real time from Turbine's servers for Awesomium to build NPC windows on the fly as you suggest.

    I conclude, based on evidence I obtained through various testing methods during the RoR beta, that Awesomium simply replaced the ancient mozilla-based in-game browser component.
    [B]Camden • Bancroft • Kimball • Melinnas • Psarra • Prentice • Lirendil[/B]

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Psarra View Post
    Here are a few that still exist. The rest were in the RoR beta forum and are no longer accessible. xRaina posted there on a few occasions as to the purpose of Awesomium.
    Interesting. I did not see xRaina's postings. ... too many threads ... too many topics... not enough time

    I saw all of the comments from Kehler on the bug tool, I just ignored them because we agree on that part

    For what it's worth, the entirety of Support (support.turbine.com) is hosted at the vendor's site -- Parature (d12.parature.com). Their CRM software is what is used internally by Turbine for, at least, both DDO and LOTRO.

    Similarly, all of Turbine's sales (aka Turbine Web Store) processing is handled by Digital River, while the DDO and LOTRO Store is hosted by Playspan. (Undoubtedly the reason why the Valve/Steam interface is so laced with problems.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Psarra View Post
    All of the art assets used for interface elements are stored in the dat files in TGA format. You can use Nova Extractor to view the contents of these files if you wish, or you can head over to LoTROInterface and download the art assets directly

    Having those assets bundled in the dat files and then also downloaded using Awesomium every time they are needed makes little sense. Further, those assets do not seem to be cached anywhere on my system, providing further evidence that Awesomium has nothing to do with NPC dialog generation.
    I am aware of the art assets. But those are only the pretty borders for different things.

    I was referring to the text (stats, etc.) and image (icon) content of the various items. Those have historically only been available either from the Lorebook or data.lotro.com, NOT in the local dat files.

    Quote Originally Posted by Psarra View Post
    Finally, packet captures created during LOTRO game play show no evidence Awesomium is downloading any interface elements to build NPC dialogs. The only traffic that shows up in these packet captures is generated through the store, lorebook, help, and /bug windows.

    I conclude, based on evidence I obtained through various testing methods during the RoR beta, that Awesomium simply replaced the ancient mozilla-based in-game browser component.
    Here we get into an interesting issue and where we disagree -- As I understand it, Awesomium is not only used to DOWNLOAD material to display on-screen, but to DISPLAY materials, especially text, on-screen "on top" of the primary graphics, from whatever source. i.e. the pop-up dialog windows.

    All of the data updating, such as when you open a vault window -- is (as I understand it) done via UDP. All of the information about the items contained in your vault is downloaded in real-time from Turbine servers. This is why the LUA interface cannot expose those items except when in the presence of a Vault Keeper and an open vault window. AltInventory keeps a separate datafile containing that information to allow it to be viewed across multiple characters (in the PluginData folder).

    That I am aware of no one has been able to find a source for the icons or textual information other than the Lorebook, i.e. Turbine's game database, many have searched for them extensively. That is why the loss of both the Lorebook and data.lotro.com are being felt so significantly.
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

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    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
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  9. #9
    Just to let everyone know, I am running OS X Mavericks and I got a pretty nice performance boost out of my upgrade. I'm running a 2009 MacBook White with an nVidia 9400 and I've been able to kick my setting up from Low to Medium and still have a few more FPS than I did while on low. I think this has more to do with new graphics drivers from Apple than any new OpenGL implementation though. Anyways, just reporting in.

  10. #10

    Thumbs up Great performance

    I'm running a 2011 iMac 21,5" with 12GB RAM and I can confirm that LotRo on Mavericks (Golden Master Release) is working flawlessly and surprisingly much better than with Mountain Lion.

    Especially the mouse view is pretty smooth and when you sell many to an NPC the wait time between the items is much shorter than before.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Nirvana0728 View Post
    Just to let everyone know, I am running OS X Mavericks and I got a pretty nice performance boost out of my upgrade. I'm running a 2009 MacBook White with an nVidia 9400 and I've been able to kick my setting up from Low to Medium and still have a few more FPS than I did while on low. I think this has more to do with new graphics drivers from Apple than any new OpenGL implementation though. Anyways, just reporting in.
    Thank you for posting this. I'm on same hardware and on windows (boot camp) I get better frame rates and can run in medium settings. Annoying that same hardware performs worse when on OSX and using Mac client. I've heard Rohan is graphically more intense than areas leading up to/including moria. Are you still able to run at medium settings and no lag in that area? For me on OS 10.8.4 (mountain lion) I run medium settings but I suffer frame drops and lag in the UI, and I'm only up to moria. I run medium because I like the textures and tend to solo/duo so if my character is a little hard to steer, not really a big deal.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by HadronHalflife View Post
    Thank you for posting this. I'm on same hardware and on windows (boot camp) I get better frame rates and can run in medium settings. Annoying that same hardware performs worse when on OSX and using Mac client. I've heard Rohan is graphically more intense than areas leading up to/including moria. Are you still able to run at medium settings and no lag in that area? For me on OS 10.8.4 (mountain lion) I run medium settings but I suffer frame drops and lag in the UI, and I'm only up to moria. I run medium because I like the textures and tend to solo/duo so if my character is a little hard to steer, not really a big deal.
    There is a great deal of confusion about Graphics settings between the Mac and the PC clients.
    And sadly, Turbine offers no guidance.
    All of the Tool-tip pop-ups in the client for the two graphics settings panels are unchanged since release (in 2007) and describe the DX9 environment.
    (And some things on the Mac Client, such as the "Select Optimal Settings" still do not work. Nor do many of the graphics sliders.)

    Most of the various high and ultra high settings relate to the PC, they have no significant (i.e. visible) effect on the Mac.

    The Mac Client default settings, which are "high" as I recall, are equivalent to settings two notches higher on the PC Client.
    When you first install and launch the MacClient, the imagery you see is dramatically superior to that on the PC Client.

    Why? Because the Mac Client uses OpenGL and the PC Client uses DX technology. The two are VERY different technologies. If you switch the PC client to Open GL, you see the same issues.

    LOTRO was developed using DX technology in a 100% Microsoft environment. The entire game is written around Microsoft's Technology, APIs and the like.
    For obvious reasons, the Mac Client was not re-written from the ground up. The OpenGL conversion was present in the PC client about 18 months prior to the release of the Mac Client.
    I don't really do graphics so I can't begin to explain or comprehend the differences. All I can say for certain is that in 2006 ATI released one of the first DirectX9 to OpenGL converters for OSX.

    When you run BootCamp, you are no longer running OSX. You are running a pure Microsoft environment.

    For a comparison of Rohan to older areas -- visit Bree. Bree was reworked (in Update 11, I believe) using the same graphics technology deployed in Rohan. The differences between the "old Bree" and the new are significant, and not just the changes in the buildings. Lighting, shading and the like were all dramatically improved.
    Sapience has commented on how the improvements to Bree were a "pet project" of one of the Devs (ScarryCrow as I recall), who wanted to "clean-up" one of the most iconic areas in the game. He did an amazing job. And during that beta, those of us who were interested exchanged many comments with him on his work and things we wanted to see in Bree.
    One of the interesting "fixes" we came up with during his development work... "Specular Lighting" had to be turned off or vast chunks of landscape simply disappeared!

    I wrote up a bunch of notes on LOTRO graphics back in May of 2012 prior to the availability of a Mac Client. I suppose I should revisit the topic and see what's changed, especially from the point of view of the Mac Client.... but there are only so many hours in a day. http://lotro-wiki.com/index.php/User...Graphics_notes

    The issue of frame-rate drops and lag is one that is still "hotly contested" -- however, I have noted myself that after last Wednesday'a (9 October) "maintenance" -- update 11.5
    https://www.lotro.com/forums/showthr...Notes-Official
    Although those are now being ascribed to today's (14 October) downtime.
    I am now back up to being able to run for 3 or 4 hours at a time using Crossover (WINE). The Mac Client, however, still comes to a freeze at around 45-60 minutes.
    I was however, only in "the old parts" of Middle Earth, and not in Rohan.

    As for character's being hard to steer -- I've only encountered that, or seen reports of that effect, with regards to Rohan and Mounted Combat. There it is a "known issue" and major improvements have been made in each of the recent patches. In Moria, most of the 'hard to steer" issues relate to visibility. "Turn on your spotlight -- F10... that Helps a lot, or crank up the Gamma setting. Even following the two Moria Revisions, there are parts of Moria which are quite dark and where it is easy to go off the edge!

    Other than that, I am eagerly awaiting Mavericks release (apparently soon) to see if the memory management issue with the Mac Client is changed. Maybe that is what will be announced on 22 October along with the new Airbook (or whatever.)
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

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    Valamar: Dwarf Hunter - Level 100
    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
    Valanne: Beorning - Level 80

  13. #13
    Thanks for the response Valamar. My partner plays lotro with a dedicated graphics card. At the end of the day, the religious war of DirectX vs. OpenGL is more about API's (how easy is it to program) than it is about what graphical wonders are possible to create. OpenGL's API's didn't progress for many years partly due to some developers saying " you don't need DirectX, you can do it in OpenGL already", but I think they missed the point that DirectX enabled some things to be done easier (ie. less code, less error-prone code).

    I'm glad to see OpenGL being stewarded by Kronos to "catch up" with ease of programmability as DX and raising the bar for what graphics cards must support. Competition is good for us all. Now if only I could get Apple to choose workstation class graphics cards in their low-cost products or at the bare minimum, more frequent and highly optimized graphics drivers. sigh. oh well. learn to accept the things I cannot change, right?

    I've been in the new bree. I play on Dwarrowdelf. Not terribly populated it seems vs. other servers, so the graphic lags I see in Bree are no worse than in the old areas. So that's good.

    Everyone talks about the Mac client having issues. I downloaded it from Turbine (a grueling 18 hour download because they throttle speeds) using that damned Pando Media Booster (vs. going through Steam). I have been playing it since it came out of BETA with zero issues/crashes/etc. ZERO. And I have been known to play from 8am-6pm on a Saturday.

    Wondering if I am special or are the "mac crashes" because of different download mechanisms, hardware, or what? Hopefully my client never catches this epidemic.

    The "hard to steer" comment is related to the dropped frame rates and lack of responsiveness in the toon. The bridge to the homely house in rivendale is a notorious location where the game stutters or lags. As I try to correct his trajectory, I apparently over-correct and next thing you know, he's in the drink. I'm comforted by knowing that my partner on his dedicated graphics card Windows box has the same issue there in Rivendale and even my Mac under bootcamp had the same issue, so its not my hardware, nor the mac client that causes it. Just dropped frames and lack of responsiveness.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nirvana0728 View Post
    Just to let everyone know, I am running OS X Mavericks and I got a pretty nice performance boost out of my upgrade. I'm running a 2009 MacBook White with an nVidia 9400 and I've been able to kick my setting up from Low to Medium and still have a few more FPS than I did while on low. I think this has more to do with new graphics drivers from Apple than any new OpenGL implementation though. Anyways, just reporting in.
    Speedier graphics sounds on par with all of the early benchmarks with OpenGL that I've seen thus far. Apparently Apple has rewritten ALL of their OpenGL implementation for Mavericks. That's the rumor anyway. Even the older OpenGL 2.x benchmarks were considerably faster.

    Hopefully Turbine will take advantage of OpenGL 4.1 under Mavericks.

  15. #15
    So I didn't know the command to show the fps before upgrading to Mavericks on my 2009 white plastic MacBook (it's control-F for any googler's). But my performance with my integrated Nvidia 9400M graphics and 8GB of RAM on the 2009 core 2 duo macbook is 20-30 FPS in areas up to/including moria. in busy areas (lots of players), and when I pull down the menu bar, it drops to 10-15 fps. So it's playable, just wish it was 30+ consistently. When it hits the 20-23 range, it appears a little stuttery.

    Again, for those swearing that the mac client is unstable, i have to attest to quite the opposite experience. I've played for hours, in skirmishes, and instances, and never once had the game freeze. The mac client is no-less stable than the PC client was when I played on the same macbook under BootCamp.

  16. #16
    I have terrible performance under Mavericks. I am looking at 30 minutes maximum before crashing to the desktop as opposed to 60 minutes during the past year. Unfortunately now it is crashing at 2.5-2.7 GB ram used as opposed to the old 3.7 GB. FPS is fine (15-120 depending on area). Of course I will get the stock response from support in 3-4 days when they reply that we all have gotten in the past. Darn hard to believe not a soul at that game design studio actually plays the game on Apple equipment.

    I am probably at the low end of the requirements with a Intel quad core i7 2.7 gHz cpu, 8 GB ram, Intel HD 4000 at 1024 MB vram / nVidia 650M at 1024 MB vram, but sheesh...

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by StinkyGreene View Post
    I have terrible performance under Mavericks. I am looking at 30 minutes maximum before crashing to the desktop as opposed to 60 minutes during the past year. Unfortunately now it is crashing at 2.5-2.7 GB ram used as opposed to the old 3.7 GB. FPS is fine (15-120 depending on area). Of course I will get the stock response from support in 3-4 days when they reply that we all have gotten in the past. Darn hard to believe not a soul at that game design studio actually plays the game on Apple equipment.

    I am probably at the low end of the requirements with a Intel quad core i7 2.7 gHz cpu, 8 GB ram, Intel HD 4000 at 1024 MB vram / nVidia 650M at 1024 MB vram, but sheesh...
    I'm running on a 2009 MPB Core 2 Duo with 8GB of RAM and Nvidia 8xxxM so specs deff aren't your issue. I was also running it under Mavericks Beta so it's was pretty stable and feature complete even back in June.

    Are you running any 3rd party memory management software (hint: don't, Mavericks doesn't play nice), Virus scanner, etc?

    Are you task swapping much? The fact it *appears* to crash when using less RAM might just be a function of Mavericks memory compression.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by HadronHalflife View Post
    Again, for those swearing that the mac client is unstable, i have to attest to quite the opposite experience. I've played for hours, in skirmishes, and instances, and never once had the game freeze. The mac client is no-less stable than the PC client was when I played on the same macbook under BootCamp.
    Stability is directly related to WHERE you are. In Rohan stability is particularly low. Bree can be problematic since it was upgraded to use Rohan Graphics in the last update.
    However, in most all of Middle Earth EXCEPT Rohan, client crashing is pretty much a non-problem.
    Instances are unpredictable. Some seem to have no issues, others are plagued with them. But as "normal" for instances, you need to turn off things like Floaty Names and lower graphics settings. This has been true for both Mac and Windows clients "forever." The same is true in the Moors. Unless you have a very high-end gaming rig, the "activity" in instances and the Moors simply overwhelms most everything else.
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

    Partial cast
    Valamar: Dwarf Hunter - Level 100
    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
    Valanne: Beorning - Level 80

  19. #19
    Hi Bill. Well, I took the precaution of loading Maverick onto an external boot disk, and I'm glad I did. LOTRO is causing kernel panics. Next step is to re-install LOTRO onto the boot disk and try again. But for now, I'm keeping Lion on my main disk.
    [COLOR=#FF0000][FONT=Arial color=&quot]Mac Player[/FONT][/COLOR] since 2010

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hanfur View Post
    Hi Bill. Well, I took the precaution of loading Maverick onto an external boot disk, and I'm glad I did. LOTRO is causing kernel panics. Next step is to re-install LOTRO onto the boot disk and try again. But for now, I'm keeping Lion on my main disk.
    Wow... that's "different" -- I've not seen a Kernel panic for quite some time (as in years) in OSX. -- I've gotten numerous "spin-locks" which crash threads, but no kernel panics!

    Hard to believe that LOTRO is causing a Kernel Panic. OSX is much more robust than that.

    Do you have third party AV software installed? Historically that kind of software has made all kinds of kernel mods as part of its installation and the results are unpredictable.

    I had a PowerBook that was upgraded from Tiger to Lion (seemingly with no troubles) but could not get Crossover (WINE) and LOTRO to run. Yet I had an iMac which had a virgin install of Lion which had no problems with the same softeare. I finally "bit the bullet" -- wiped the PowerBook disk and installed Lion.... all problems disappeared.

    The PowerBook had been used by my son at college and he had installed (and theoretically uninstalled) a whole collection of media manipulation (AV) software. While installing those packages installs the Kernel mods, simply dragging the application to the trash does not get rid of them! Hence the wipe and re-install. ... at least that's the theory that Codeweavers support and I finally came up with after about 3 months of serious debugging.
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

    Partial cast
    Valamar: Dwarf Hunter - Level 100
    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
    Valanne: Beorning - Level 80

  21. #21
    Ah, could be. I've been having all sorts of problems with Virus Barrier and been meaning to de-install for some time. Maybe now is the time.
    [COLOR=#FF0000][FONT=Arial color=&quot]Mac Player[/FONT][/COLOR] since 2010

  22. #22
    I can't get the LOTRO Downloader to work on Mavericks (10.9).

    I click on the 'Mac Download' link on https://www.lotro.com/en/game/download

    I then open up the disk image file (lotrohigh.dmg) and per the cue,

    drag the "LOTRO-Live-multilang.app" icon to the Desktop.

    I then try double-clicking on it.

    The "LOTRO Downloader" starts up, prompts me for the administrator's password (which I enter)

    ... and then immediately exits with no error message.

    The Console shows the following messages during this:
    11/10/13 10:16:14.325 PM loginwindow[40]: ERROR | -[PersistentAppsSupport saveLogoutPersistentState:] | Attempt to insert app with NULL bundle ID
    11/10/13 10:16:16.230 PM launchservicesd[51]: Application App:"Finder" asn:0x0-c00c pid:233 refs=8 @ 0x7fec5a4223d0 tried to be brought forward, but isn't in fPermittedFrontApps ( ( "LSApplication:0x0-0x36036 pid=469 "SecurityAgent"")), so denying. : LASSession.cp #1481 SetFrontApplication() q=LSSession 100004/0x186a4 queue
    11/10/13 10:16:16.231 PM WindowServer[160]: [cps/setfront] Failed setting the front application to Finder, psn 0x0-0xc00c, securitySessionID=0x186a4, err=-13066



    Any body else having more/less success?

  23. #23
    I've had no problems running Pando under Mavericks (apart from the time it took to download). And the new installation works just fine. Currently installing Mavericks on my main disk.

    Hanfur
    [COLOR=#FF0000][FONT=Arial color=&quot]Mac Player[/FONT][/COLOR] since 2010

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    2,576
    Quote Originally Posted by WhifOfDespair View Post
    I can't get the LOTRO Downloader to work on Mavericks (10.9).

    Anybody else having more/less success?
    This is correct.

    Pando (PMB) uses Java 6.

    Java 6 is a 32-bit Java which Apple eliminated and recommended people delete based on a Homeland Security advisory, back in January of 2013.
    Apple advised people to replace Java 6 with 64-bit Java 7 directly from Oracle.

    PMB will not run with Java 7.

    Other than that...

    When you click on the ring from PMB, it asks for your system password. And then it fails.

    I haven't played with it for a while now, but it was attempting to create
    /Library/Application Support/Media Booster/
    /Library/PreferencePanes/MediaBooster.prefPane
    /Library/Internet Plug-ins/PandoWebPlugin.plugin

    Which is probably what the problem is. Hard to say. But at this point. Your experience is "normal."
    Bill Magill - Mac Player - Old Timers Guild- Gladden:

    Partial cast
    Valamar: Dwarf Hunter - Level 100
    Valdicta: Dwarf Rune-keeper - Level 100
    Valanne: Beorning - Level 80

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by Valamar View Post
    This is correct.

    Pando (PMB) uses Java 6.

    Java 6 is a 32-bit Java which Apple eliminated and recommended people delete based on a Homeland Security advisory, back in January of 2013.
    Apple advised people to replace Java 6 with 64-bit Java 7 directly from Oracle.

    PMB will not run with Java 7.

    Other than that...

    When you click on the ring from PMB, it asks for your system password. And then it fails.

    I haven't played with it for a while now, but it was attempting to create
    /Library/Application Support/Media Booster/
    /Library/PreferencePanes/MediaBooster.prefPane
    /Library/Internet Plug-ins/PandoWebPlugin.plugin

    Which is probably what the problem is. Hard to say. But at this point. Your experience is "normal."
    Okay, that makes a lot of sense.

    The thing is, if the app depends on Java 6, it should still be able to run - I have Java 6 installed as well as 7.

    Any well-designed app can find if there is a compatible JVM installed on a mac using the 'java_home' command.

    For example, to find an installed version of Java 1.6.x, just use:

    > /usr/libexec/java_home -v 1.6

    That will return something like

    /System/Library/Java/JavaVirtualMachines/1.6.0.jdk/Contents/Home

    while

    > /usr/libexec/java_home -v 1.7

    would return

    /Library/Java/JavaVirtualMachines/1.7.0_45.jdk/Contents/Home


    So there is no reason that it shouldn't be able to detect that a Java 6 runtime is installed.

    You can both find and invoke any of the standard java executables ('java', 'jar', 'javap', etc.) using the "-exec" option:

    > /usr/libexec/java_home -v 1.6 -exec java args ...

 

 
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