[EVENT] Hûd in Eledhrim (Hall of Fire Wednesday) Elf themed event

[Cymaru]

That does not sound good! I hope the laptop can be un-melted? Is it post-Weatherstock stress syndrome?

Tonight I found out in a hurry that Aelaer does NOT like snakes. (Quite funny when your toons develop quirks of their own because personally I don't mind them.) Apart from that, she had a great time.

Yes, HoF is completely free-form, people might listen to a particular song in hushed silence, or talk all the way through it, or even decide to talk and dance at the same time. "Say" does not travel that far, there is plenty of space to doze or sit quietly. Traditionally the benches by the fire are where people sit if they want to pull out a book and read it by themselves.

The music tonight was simply awesome.

The music was indeed again of super high quality! Amorey & Primmrose with their songs (I wonder how they do it! delivering their lines in time with the music, simply awesome) And Makalaure played some melodies that sent chills down my spine! Thanks all for coming. Summer holidays are drawing near, so player numbers will be dwindling quickly

[Amorey]

Wondering at Elves by Once Upon A Hobbit, on Flickr

Here I was wondering what kind of special pies Elves eat to get this tall....


Periannath in Rivendell by Once Upon A Hobbit, on Flickr

Periannath and Elves


Music in the Hall of Fire by Once Upon A Hobbit, on Flickr

Thank you kindly to all the lovely Elves and to master Elrond for a warm welcome in The Hall of Fire. I had a little chat with Master Bilbo on my way out and I must agree with him when he made this comment about The Last Homely House :

"a perfect house, whether you like food or sleep, or story-telling or singing, or just sitting and thinking best, or a pleasant mixture of them all."

[Zuleyus]

(I wonder how they do it! delivering their lines in time with the music, simply awesome)

*Clears throat* Umm, please forgive my intrusion, but if I might perhaps attempt to give an answer to that...?

[Aelaer]

That is in itself awesome! All these things that people think up that add so much to the game experience

[Glingaeron]

Thoroughly enjoyed the event, last night! Alas, my computer was lagging up - so I made a quick exit from the RP, sadly.

Amorey, your tale of Pies really got me chuckling - and receiving strange shouts from the other rooms of my house.

[Kalluin]

Just a question about the actions of Elves toward other Elves. It has been my belief, pardon my Tolkien geekiness, that Elves can see the truth in other Elves for their spirits are more easily seen and their intents are more easily recognized. Is this not true? So in retrospect an Elf, even a wild and distrustful forest Elf, could probably see the honesty in other Elves who ask that weapons be removed, whereas a Dwarf or a Man might be quite different.

A reading of the Ósanwe-kentaconcept would be quite related to this matter, as the text from Tolkien specifically addresses this issue. I read it a long time ago - it is an essay written by Tolkien but not published within the HotME series, but in brief words it says that, since there is evil in the world, the Eldar learned closed their natural mind openness, thus shielding their minds against the Dark Lord, but in exchange they could be deceived by words.

As for yesterday, I arrived late but I enjoyed the dances and the company.

[Glingaeron]

A reading of the Ósanwe-kentaconcept would be quite related to this matter, as the text from Tolkien specifically addresses this issue. I read it a long time ago - it is an essay written by Tolkien but not published within the HotME series, but in brief words it says that, since there is evil in the world, the Eldar learned closed their natural mind openness, thus shielding their minds against the Dark Lord, but in exchange they could be deceived by words.

As for yesterday, I arrived late but I enjoyed the dances and the company.

An 'unofficial language', that is used by the Elves, is telepathy. While you might think this means moving objects with the mind, telepathy (which is called “sanwe-latya” in Quenya, is a method of communication between Elder Elves (and some younger, though it is much more difficult for them). Tolkien wrote that the method is used easily by those who lived in the Blessed Realm, and those who do not use a spoken language (i.e. a mute). The ability was greatly assisted by the willpower an Elf had over his/her spirit, and the ability to look from 'mind to mind' allowed thoughts and feelings to be transferred effortlessly.

I plan to cover this in depth, with Gûr Edhellen.

The 'thought talk' was not a common thing. It was used by the powerful Elves; those being the ones who were old. Really old. Galadriel conversed with Gandalf and Celeborn, using telepathy.

Through time, and generations, the ability diminished until it was all but gone or rare. That said, t'is not unheard of!

[Gothidox]

I plan to cover this in depth, with Gûr Edhellen.

The 'thought talk' was not a common thing. It was used by the powerful Elves; those being the ones who were old. Really old. Galadriel conversed with Gandalf and Celeborn, using telepathy.

Through time, and generations, the ability diminished until it was all but gone or rare. That said, t'is not unheard of!

Remember also, it wasn't necesarily old Elves! It was Elves who lived in, or once lived in Aman. So, therefore even an ancient Sindar and Silvan Elf would not have this ability but a Noldo residing in Rivendell may. However, Tolkien Scholours also suggest that "Eldar" had this ability, therefore this would include all Elves who set West, covering a much larger bracket of Elves than the former suggest.

[Glingaeron]

Remember also, it wasn't necesarily old Elves! It was Elves who lived in, or once lived in Aman. So, therefore even an ancient Sindar and Silvan Elf would not have this ability but a Noldo residing in Rivendell may. However, Tolkien Scholours also suggest that "Eldar" had this ability, therefore this would include all Elves who set West, covering a much larger bracket of Elves than the former suggest.

I dare-say that any Elf, who was born direct of one of those of the Sundering; or is from Aman itself, is old. Even to an Elf!

The term 'Eldar', that given by Oromë, means all the Elves that followed him to Valinor, but not the Avar. They didn't go to Valinor, hence their name of 'unwilling'.

That said, indeed; not all the Elves had this ability - even if Sindar possessed the ability, it would be greatly diminished than a powerful counterpart. Think of it like evolution, if you will. We humans lost our tails, to walk upright. Yet that does not mean not all of us can't climb tree's!

Pengolodh says that all minds (sáma, pl. sámar) are equal in status, though they differ in capacity and strength. A mind by its nature perceives another mind directly. But it cannot perceive more than the existence of another mind (as something other than itself, though of the same order) except by the will of both parties. The degree of will, however, need not be the same in both parties. If we call one mind G (for guest or comer) and the other H (for host or receiver), then G must have full intention to inspect H or to inform it.

But knowledge may be gained or imparted by G, even when H is not seeking or intending to impart or to learn: the act of G will be effective, if H is simply “open” (láta; látie “openness”). This distinction, he says, is of the greatest importance.

“Openness” is the natural or simple state (indo) of a mind that is not otherwise engaged. In “Arda Unmarred” (that is, in ideal conditions free from evil) openness would be the normal state. Nonetheless any mind may be closed (pahta). This requires an act of conscious will: Unwill (avanir). It may be made against G, against G and some others, or be a total retreat into “privacy” (aquapahtie).

Though in “Arda Unmarred” openness is the normal state, every mind has, from its first making as an individual, the right to close; and it has absolute power to make this effective by will. Nothing can penetrate the barrier of Unwill.

All these things, says Pengolodh, are true of all minds, from the Ainur in the presence of Eru, or the great Valar such as Manwë and Melkor, to the Maiar in Eä, and down to the least of the Mirröanwi. But different states bring in limitations, which are not fully controlled by the will.

The Valar entered into Eä and Time of free will, and they are now in Time, so long as it endures. They can perceive nothing outside Time, save by memory of their existence before it began: they can recall the Song and the Vision. They are, of course, open to Eru, but they cannot of their own will “see” any part of His mind. They can open themselves to Eru in entreaty, and He may then reveal His thought to them.

The Incarnates have by the nature of sáma the same faculties; but their perception is dimmed by the hröa, for their fëa is united to their hröa and its normal procedure is through the hröa, which is in itself part of Eä, without thought. The dimming is indeed double; for thought has to pass one mantle of hröa and penetrate another. For this reason in Incarnates transmission of thought requires strengthening to be effective. Strengthening can be by affinity, by urgency, or by authority.

Affinity may be due to kinship; for this may increase the likeness of hröa to hröa, and so of the concerns and modes of thought of the indwelling fëar, kinship is also normally accompanied by love and sympathy. Affinity may come simply from love and friendship, which is likeness or affinity of fëa to fëa.

Urgency is imparted by great need of the “sender” (as in joy, grief or fear); and if these things are in any degree shared by the “receiver” the thought is the clearer received. Authority may also lend force to the thought of one who has a duty towards another, or of any ruler who has a right to issue commands or to seek the truth for the good of others.

Lastly, tengwesta has also become an impediment. It is in Incarnates clearer and more precise than their direct reception of thought. By it also they can communicate easily with others, when no strength is added to their thought: as, for example, when strangers first meet. And, as we have seen, the use of “language” soon becomes habitual, so that the practice of ósanwe (interchange of thought) is neglected and becomes more difficult. Thus we see hat the Incarnate tend more and more to use or to endeavour to use ósanwe only in great need and urgency, and especially when lambe is unavailing. As when the voice cannot be heard, which comes most often because of distance.

For distance in itself offers no impediment whatever to ósanwe. But those who by affinity might well use ósanwe will use lambe when in proximity, by habit or preference. Yet we may mark also how the “affine” may more quickly understand the lambe that they use between them, and indeed all that they would say is not put into words. With fewer words they come swifter to a better understanding. There can be no doubt that here ósanwe is also often taking place; for the will to converse in lambe is a will to communicate thought, and lays the minds open. It may be, of course, that the two that converse know already part of the matter and the thought of the other upon it, so that only allusions dark to the stranger need be made; but this is not always so. The affine will reach an understanding more swiftly than strangers upon matters that neither have before discussed, and they will more quickly perceive the import of words that, however numerous, well-chosen, and precise, must remain inadequate.

The essay, itself, goes onto speak about how 'communication through thought' affects the Valar, and Maiar. We know for a fact that Gandalf, being a Maiar, was able to commune like this; as I said above.

[Laurefinde]

Thanks for bringing up the Ósanwe-kenta. I read it again and it is a fine article. Ósanwe-kenta

However, I believe all Elves can determine a few things outside of mind-speaking and mind-awareness because they are more "in-tune" with the fëa of any Elf they meet. I also believe this goes beyond just the Elves of Aman because why else would all Elves, over the years, live more in the world of the fëa than that of the hröa? This is an interesting subject and perhaps it should be brought up on the Tolkien forum below.

Oh and thank you for the acceptance of Makalaure in the Hall of Fire. It has been a pleasure to roleplay with you all, though it has not gotten deep (so far) it has been enjoyable and definitely a reason to come back.

[oldbadgerbrock]

Remember also, it wasn't necesarily old Elves! It was Elves who lived in, or once lived in Aman. So, therefore even an ancient Sindar and Silvan Elf would not have this ability but a Noldo residing in Rivendell may.

I think you're a little confused, or perhaps you have not accurately written what you meant to say. Please allow me to clarify:

1. The only Elves to return to Middle-earth from Aman were the Noldor. The lone exception to this was Elwë Singollo, a Teler better known by his Sindarin name, Elu Thingol. Thingol was one of three Elven ambassadors to visit Aman before the three kindred began their journey. (The Silmarillion.)

2. The Teleri are Eldar.

3. The Sindar are a subset of the Teleri, and therefore are also Eldar.

4. Celeborn is a Sinda from Doriath in Beleriand. (The Silmarillion.) Celeborn possessed this ability to 'mind-speak'.

4. Elrond Halfelven also possessed this ability. He never visited Aman, and he was not a Noldo. He was born in Beleriand of parents, Eärendil and Elwing, with mixed ancestry of Man and Elf. His paternal grandparents were Tuor (Man) and Idril (Noldo). His maternal grandparents were Dior (Man + Sinda/Maia) and Nimloth (Sinda). If he were to be classified patrilineally as in the manner of Elves, he would actually be classified as a Man. His brother Elros claimed this heritage when he became the first king of Númenor. (The Silmarillion.)

[Cymaru]

june 29, Hall of Fire!

19:00 UK / 20:00 CET
Hall of Fire, Last of the Homely Houses, Rivendell valley

see you all later tonight! (I truely hope so!! My net is acting up -_- apologies in advance if I "dissolve" in the middle of a conversation)

[Glingaeron]

see you all later tonight! (I truely hope so!! My net is acting up -_- apologies in advance if I "dissolve" in the middle of a conversation)

Not you, as well!?

My own broadband is terrible, at the current moment. I, too, apologize if I suddenly pop off.

[Amorey]

...I, too, apologize if I suddenly pop off.

The old Baggins's trick ?

"POOOF" vanishing into thin air in a blinding flash of light

I really hope both you and Lady Cymaru can be there from start to finish.

[Cymaru]

The old Baggins's trick ?

"POOOF" vanishing into thin air in a blinding flash of light

I really hope both you and Lady Cymaru can be there from start to finish.

Yes but I would come in the guise of Mirineth, not Cymaru!!!

[Silaen]

Yes but I would come in the guise of Mirineth, not Cymaru!!!

Cymaru would faint from all the elves!

[Vestrinexx]

Cymaru would faint from all the elves!

There are probably more Elves in Bree *grin*

*joke*

[Isilmewen]

I'm Back!!!!!!

I'll be in HoF tonight! Run now that you can

[Silaen]

I'm Back!!!!!!

I'll be in HoF tonight! Run now that you can

\o/ *hugs*

[Amorey]

Yes but I would come in the guise of Mirineth, not Cymaru!!!

Indeed so.

The Lady Mirineth is a lovely elf ...tall, but lovely

[Silaen]

Was some great fun tonight, even though we were not that many!

Good tales, songs and even a game of riddles! Thank you i had a pleasant time!





Hope you had fun too!

[Glingaeron]

Alas, I was called away for the majority of the day - and when I returned, my internet connection was...it was like kindness in the conscience of Morgoth Bauglir. Non-existent.

[Tanes]

A lovely evening, yet again. Nice screenshots of the square dance, Silaen! It was fun to participate in.

[Amorey]

*waves from the Shire*

What a lovely evening this was...really special.
I had a fantastic time..thank you kindly for having me

You will be pleased to know I made it back safely to the Shire and after an other rather unfortunate fishing trip to Bywater I am considering starting a new business ...I am sure I could convince someone that smelly weeds can do miracles for wrinkles....See you next week when I will go again to see the ELVES

*goes back to count her weeds...156...157...158 *

[Turanien]

Good morning Laurelin!

I think it may be time for Turanien to log back into LotRO... All other current gaming habits have died back to nothingness. The itch for LotRO RP is still present I find [worringly!] :P